Jedi Archive
Thread: Why don't people understand? It's not meant to be easy.
PowerDrinker
Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:22 am
#14
I have to disagree with many future Jedi here.
The XP grind is perfect, you want a Jedi work for it a little bit.
What's really annoying me is that the quests are gated. For example, in Phase 3 you can unlock experimentation, ranged defense and melee accuracy. I want all of those skills (you need them to be an effective jedi) but in order for me to get them I need to wait for Phase 3, 3 times. That means 4 1/4 months per cycle * 3, so over a year of waiting just for the skills I want.
Now, what sane person is going to do that? No one, so we're all going to have ranged accuracy from phase one, ranged speed from some other phase, surverying etc. Basically useless skills....
The devs need to make the phases 1-2 days. The XP grind will still stop people from becoming Jedi. The only difference is that you won't have to wait or be stuck with useless skills. How hard is it to wait?
Oblox
Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:28 am
#15
yay agree totally, helped my friend with jedi knight trials went group hunting (shock a rarity these days) was a great laugh, still id personally rather grind solidly to unlock but thats me.
VempireX
Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:41 am
#16
RamhornSWG wrote:
jedi is meant to be an accomplishment in this game, not something easily obtained
First of all I love your name DarthBush lol.
Accomplishment?
Basically you clicked a mouse button 200,000,000 times.
If you got killed by a BH a few times make it 200,010,000 times.
My point is grinding something to say " Wow im so proud of myself " is not fun.
I never see anyone post a message "WoW I had so much fun playing my Jedi today"
Its always I am working so hard and I made 900k xp in an hour!
So what that doesnt make for an enjoyable game.
Then don't grind? If your goal is Jedi, then you have fun in combat, right? Then why you don't stop thinking "I have to get Jedi ASAP!" and combine fun with the grind? Do caves and POI's, join a REAL hunt group, corvette etc. At least that's what i am going to do.
I will grind once in a while in a solo group on Dantooine, but i am going to do it when i am in the mood for it. I am paying to have fun in the game and that's what i am going to have. I feel sorry for those who only have Jedi as a goal.
gilcrestp
Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:03 am
#17
RamhornSWG wrote:No sweetie.Just pointing out the fact you dont pay someone to work.Grinding xp by mindlessly killing 40000 creatures is not fun unless your a sadist.The whole game has devolved into Grindfest mania.When an online game lacks balance or monthly content in the form of a story line, you end up with this pile of crap.
i totally agree, the hologrind was in my opinion much more fun, cuz its what you would be doing anyways, grinding professions...but now you just get to go out, and kill senseless amounts of things and then go back and get hardly nothing for it. At least during the hologrind you werent forced to a certain amount of time. And plus, i thought that this was gonna be QUEST based, the one "quest" i have done is ride to 160 random patrol points, and other than that the only other quest will be to grind out over 200 million xp...this is demoralizing
BJohnny83
Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:08 am
#18
The fanboys are seriously missing the point. Yes, play the game fine. Been there done that. Join a guild...in one. Visit all the poi...done that. Do the themeparks...done that. But to even get one box in the fs trees you HAVE to grind. And if you bring your guild along they just steal your xp so it takes longer.
The point is we were all led to believe this system would be quest based. I had my hopes up and again they were crushed. This system is no different AT ALL then holo grinding. Now it is hologrinding with a time limit secretly hidden in the form of village quests. Heck I do not even have as much of a problem with the grinding as I do with the fact that since I CHOSE not to mindlessly grind professions in order to get a jedi in in the old system, Inow have to wait 3 weeks between each phase in order to unlock a padawan. That means I have to wait 6 cycles! That = 4 and a half months. What exactly is the point of having to do the village more then once? And then to add insult to injury we have to grind millions of regular character experience to convert to jedi experience to get 24 useless boxes? And THAT just gets you to jedi padawan. You then have to grind more millions of jedi exp just to become decent. And that is content? This is the new jedi experience? Add that to the fact that jedi have already been stated to become weaker with more of them around and the fact that combat will be nerfed and you see the point?
This took them 2 publishes to do? Ths had them delay the 2nd publish and the 1st one week each? I question the talent at SOE if it takes them a full publish to add holo grinding in a different degree. And have you seen the first quest for the combat fs tree. Go to waypoint 10 times and patroll it LOL. Wow that took a lot of thinking. Do that 10 times for the unlock and do it 10 more times further out for the flag. What a load of CRAP. My whole guild was falling asleep during it...especially for the flag.
All of you guys making the point that this is hard. News-flash it is not hard. It is not hard killing 25k rancors a day. It just takes a long time. It means you have all day to sit in front of a computer and mindless and boringly kill creature after creature after creature. And to insult you even more if you do not kill creature after creature after creature for weeks on end it will take you at least6 months to even get to padawan. That is fun? That is content? It is an excuse for content. It is mad grinding. Some of us have jobs and a life.
This new quest system where you have to wait 4 and a half months because we CHOSE to PLAY the game, which btw was your excuse for us not to grind, is a load of crap. People in my guild like me who started atlaunch of this game feel insulted and cheated by this system. Sure some of us may not have played every single day since start cause lets face it the game sucked when it first came out. But the fact is if we chose not to grind professions. Our reward became pay SOE over $60 while you grind everyday just to become a weak padawan and then grind more millions of jedi exp. They will not even allow you to do all the quests and then grind exp. No, we have to wait. And please do not preach to me the excuse that they want you to play the game during that time frame. If you want to make sure you have that full branch before the next phase you almost have to grind. It is a timesink plain and simple. And most of us have done almost EVERYTHING in this game and were looking forward to playing a jedi. We did not want to wait 4 and a half months to even be able to pick up a damn lightsaber.
Hey as a star wars fan, I just want to actually see what it is like to wield and have fun with a lightsaber. Some of us have lives where we cannot grind everday. And some of us do not want to wait 4 and a half months to do so. It is a sly way of SOE to MAKE us pay them while we wait for a jedi. Have we not waited long enough?
JTL BETTER add content and fun to this game or you will see a mass exodus out of this game come this fall/winter. Hell I even supported jedi being harder to get then usual and as a BH I had SOME fun. But like a lot of people as a 2nd character I would still want a chance to at least try out a jedi. I do not want to wait forever to do so. And ya knowwe do not even have a choice in making our 2nd character a jedi. Maybe some of us are attached to our name. Maybe we wanted to keep that guy a bh or a combat medic or a TKA. But we do not have that choice as it takes 25 times the length to regrind that on our 2nd character slot then to regrind force sensitivity on that 2nd character and make that person a jedi. Another slap in our face by SOE.
Oh and we will have fun when they add something fun to do. It does not take long to get to the content in this game. There is so little of it.
Give this one day and I will see the usual responses that a person ahead of me has already posted above by the fanboys. $100 I will see responses about then don't do it. It is supposed to be hard. Quit if you are not having fun etc etc etc. I am sure every company that is sucessful takes that response. Just have them quit! Quit = less money = no jobs at the company BTW. Please come up with a good response then your usual responses. And if you are a current jedi then do not even bother. I know half of you are just happy to keep everyone else from being a jedi and is the fuel for you arguing against the rest of us being pissed about this new system.
Alila
Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:11 am
#19
as someone who's been in the SWG beta and had much correspondence with the devs and others during that time I find the direction the game has taken not only slightly amusing but quite hilarious..
I don't remember what Q-3PO's exaxt words were but it was something like this:
How do you think contemporary MMORPG's have made their games have "content"? Yes, by inserting tons of mindless grinding into everything, making every quest as time consuming and difficult as possible to complete. Now how does SWG differ from this? Well, for one, we don't believe in grinding, we're trying to make a game devoid of grinding with TONS and TONS of content for people to enjoy, so they can really experience the Star Wars universe and not feel like they're stuck in a threadmill.
Remember that? Remember how the game was in beta (like maybe 100k xp required to master an elite profession and for example factories still gave you 1/10 of the normal xp)? Look at the game now and what do you see? A billion xp to reach jedi padawan 
Ok ok, so jedi _IS_ a bit different, I admit that.. but come on people, the entire game is going down the threadmill shaft.. I say people on the top has lost sight of the true goal while making piggyback-jerryrigging solutions to problems in the game instead of really solving them.
gilcrestp
Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:11 am
#20
/clap for BJohnny83
i dont think anyone could of said it better
i dont think anyone could of said it better
Cyborg-Shoryuken
Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:42 am
#21
rhaspede wrote:
The problem is not the system, the problem is way people play the system. It's not meant for you to sit at your computer and kill rancors or kryat dragons or whatever or craft swoop bikes or composite helmets or stimpacks over and over and over and over and over and over and over until you get enough xp to gain your skills. The point is for you to play the game normally, (go on guild hunts, or hunt alone, or do the dungeons or the theme parks or the quests in the game or craft items that you sell in your vendors, oritems that you use yourself as you go about your adventures) and gain your xp as you go along. Eventually, you should look up and say; "Hey! I've finally earned enough xp to gain my next skill!" Now I'm not saying that it's dumb to take a day to hunt to gain xp, but everyday shouldn't be that way. XP stands for experience. You should actually be enjoying that Kyrat dragon hunt. Interracting with the other players accompanying you. Not sitting down and figuring out how many times you're going to have to do a certain special on a certain creature and how many times you're going to have to heal in the process, then creating a running the approriate macro and walking away from your computer while your character "plays itself" for 18 hours. People aren't "experiencing" the game anymore, they're plowing through it blindly. You're going to sit and craft 8000 composite armor chestplates in 1 day? Of course the game isn't going to be fun for you anymore!
And your analogy about clicking the mouse 2,000,000 times isn't really accurate either. This is a computer game. No matter what you do; pvp, grind professions, fish, craft, you're going to be clicking your mouse. That's like saying "I didn't pay 50 bucks for Madden '05 to push X, O, Triangle and Square all day. That's just absurd reasoning.
Damn....
...you took every-last single word out of my mouth and posted it before I had the chance to.
You're scary...what are you...some type of telepath?
ecspider2004
Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:51 am
#22
Most of our society wants something free. In this particular case its jedi. I saw a kid that was only playing for two months calling himself a veteran and demanding he be a jedi now. The 10-30 year old generation is gimme gimme gimme.
Obeowa
Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:19 am
#23
Dont you think its funny that the majority of ppl that say "its good that it takes ages, tough luck, just do it" have "Jedi padawan" etc in their signature?
One of the major pulls of this game is the fact that you can become a jedi. I am one of the guys that it will take the longest time to unlock, ive been playing a long time, grinded out tons of proffs, more than ppl that had already unlocked, and still i have to grind tons more xp after a quest? I am sorry, its not the way. This is a RPG, lets have rpg style content. Instead of a mindless grind for hours, something intelligence based, multiple quest endings etc. Getting a mission from somebody, running 2k, conversing, then running back is the poorest example of content i have ever seen. Probably the most fun ive had on the game was the final cries of alderaan chapter, you had to actually THINK, and remember what other people had said to you.
So i guess what im saying is instead of flaming us non unlockers, just because you were lucky and got it, understand the reason a lot of ppl are angry. We will be grinding a lot more than you to get jedi.
And devs, instead of making us grind for hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours, how about a path that requires we UNDERSTAND the force, instead of grind grind oh, i guess we better give you a saber now.
One of the major pulls of this game is the fact that you can become a jedi. I am one of the guys that it will take the longest time to unlock, ive been playing a long time, grinded out tons of proffs, more than ppl that had already unlocked, and still i have to grind tons more xp after a quest? I am sorry, its not the way. This is a RPG, lets have rpg style content. Instead of a mindless grind for hours, something intelligence based, multiple quest endings etc. Getting a mission from somebody, running 2k, conversing, then running back is the poorest example of content i have ever seen. Probably the most fun ive had on the game was the final cries of alderaan chapter, you had to actually THINK, and remember what other people had said to you.
So i guess what im saying is instead of flaming us non unlockers, just because you were lucky and got it, understand the reason a lot of ppl are angry. We will be grinding a lot more than you to get jedi.
And devs, instead of making us grind for hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours, how about a path that requires we UNDERSTAND the force, instead of grind grind oh, i guess we better give you a saber now.
dridernce
Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:22 am
#24
Hollyrosie wrote:
Why don't people understand, that force sensitive is not meant to be easy? You want to be a force sensitive crafter? good for you, get the xp thats required.
True, it's not meant to be easy. Then again, it's not meant to be impossible.
BaronRonin
Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:27 am
#25
Yes, please, all of you complaining plz quit....More room for me and I don't want to see the SWG universe with 300 jedi per server 
All of you griping about having to grind jedi were all the ones who hologrinded to get there.....
If you originally wanted content then why did you hologrind to try unlocking jedi.....I'll admit I started to hologrind for jedi but hated mastering something and then dropping it immediately to grind another prof...
So I decided to be a badge whore 
Each mastered prof gave a badge, I already had 90% of all the content badges, so that was all that was left to badge-grind
And also It let me see which profs I liked, Master TKA was nice but after soloing Krayts, I decided to see what the other profs offered...Swordsman and Commando was nice, BH okay, Pistoleer and Carbineer and Pikeman, ugh 
But because i grinded them to see how useful they were, it wasnt boring, it was an experiment.
You all were too busy grabbing prof after prof to get jedi, you made the grind boring....
Did you all go straight for the Savage quenker missions and just grinded them for the best killrate/xp ratio????
You support the DEV's by grinding when they make 'content' as a disguise for grinding.....if you had played for content and not grinded maybe they woulda added real content....
Every other MMORPG i played was the same, dont blame just SOE, in all of them my 'concept' was "I cant spend time role-playing, it takes away from me gaining xp and getting stronger" Every grinds to uber levels and then are bored, where as the lvl 10 ppl are having fun role-playing, its the same everywhere you go .....
My fav times in SWG was my clan hunting....yes I earned less xp/hour but who cared, we all were having fun and i got to fight stuff i couldnt take on alone, still got crappy xp, but taking on rancor lairs when normally i'd lose to a single one was new....but we were together playing, not grinding....only thing ground those days were our meat and hide stockpiles
Sooooo my point, if you are mad that the devs are 'forcing' you to grind again after hologrinding for months on end the first time, then plz go, all your doing is supporting them, they see that everyone is grinding, so why would they pull out new content ??? if you all were exploring the content side of the game, they'd seen that.
If 75% of ppl in your state started up riding bicycles instead of cars to work, the state would pass laws to tax bicycles more, no?
Called supporting what the majority is doing (stupid example, but you get the idea) if 10 % of SWG is trying to just roleplay and do content, then why add more for the minority???
Tell em you want more content and less grinding, AND THEN STOP GRINDING, dont keep at it or quit....you quit then why would they listen to your complaints, your gone and replaced by another willing to grind.....
Gungan missions on naboo have been always broke, no one visited it or complained to devs, but they picked up 300 quenker missions instead....hrm....
Long rant, so goodbye, ill be back to having fun, even if i got to make it up myself
Maybe ill do some janta raids or a PvE rebel base, or go shopping for the 3rd time this week for clothes
Gwern
Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:32 am
#26
for 1 tree of crafting mastry, you need 1.225 Million Force Crafting exp
Elite Crafting Professions get a ratio of 5:1 ratio (Arch is different)
1.225 Million Force Crafting exp converted to Elite Crafting Profession exp = 6.125 Million Elite Crafing Profession exp
4 Crafting Mastry trees would = 24.5 million Elite Crafting Profession exp
exp required to master a Elite Crafting Profession = 820k
24.5 Million Elite Crafting Profession exp to complete the 4 Crafting Mastry trees is = mastering a Elite Crafting profession 30 times
here is the math...
450k 4th tier Crafting Mastry exp
350k 3rd tier Crafting Mastry exp
250k 2nd tier Crafting Mastry exp
175k 1st tier Crafting mastry exp
1225k Crafting Mastry exp for 1 tree
X 4Crafting Mastry trees
4900k Total Crafting Mastry exp for all 4 trees
X 5 Conversion ratio to Elite Crafting Profession exp
24500k Elite Crafting Profession exp for all 4 trees
/820k Exp to master 1 Elite Crafting Profession
29.87 times mastering an Elite Crafting Profession
24500k Elite Crafting exp
/ 300 exp per combine (this is about the max you can get per combine)
81667 crafting combines
*Note: Chef was used as a example... some other crafting professions are worse off (Arch exp needed = mastering Arch 122 times, and Medic profession need to grind over 600,000 ABECs to get the 4 boxes)
for a crafter to master the 4 crafting trees is the same as mastering 30 elite crafting professions... This does not even include the 2 trees of something else to unlock thier Jedi/second character slot... Remember not everyone is doing this to get Jedi... Some crafters just want the crafting tree
Aienaa - Chilastra - Master Chef / Master Tailor / Master Artisan
Mon'cal - Chilastra - Master Weaponsmith / Master Armorsmith / Master Architect
Aiene - Chilastra - Jedi Knight