Jedi Archive
Thread: [Discussion] Removal of XP loss upon BH death?
Fugitron wrote:There has been alot of comments lately about completely removing XP loss from the BH system. This thread is to discuss the "possibility" and PROs and CONs if this did occur. Please try to keep flaming down and to stay on-topic. BHs are welcome to give constructive input.Some following questions to consider when discussing:JEDI:- Do you beleive the BH system currently is effectively stopping the growth of jedi (as intended) ?- If XP loss was removed would you feel as much "tension" when losing to a BH ?- If this occured do you beleive the grind would now be "too easy", "just right", or still "too hard" ?- Does XP loss now (or even when grinding) make you "show off" less ?BOUNTY HUNTER:- What is the main motivation for hunting player jedi (please be honest) ?- Do you beleive its fair that jedi are the only profession in the game that loses something upon (BH) death ?- If they took away jedi XP loss would you hunt as many jedi as you do now ?- If XP loss remains do you beleive BHs should be punished for losses or consecutive losses ?Remember PLEASE try to stay on task and try not to flame eachother - someone will disagree with you - agree to disagree. Maybe if we have enough good input we might be stickied (at least for a bit)
EXP LOSS WASN'T INTENDED TO STOP JEDI GROWTH IT WAS TO STOP BH'S FROM FARMING JEDI FRIENDS FOR CREDITS.
I want to slap whoever started that rumor you (OP) are spreading.
Its not a rumor, during a house of commons discussion a dev stated that it was meant to hinder the progression of jedi (population control) AND to stop the exploitation. They also stated that it didn't work as planned.
Qwad wrote:
Fugitron wrote:
There has been alot of comments lately about completely removing XP loss from the BH system. This thread is to discuss the "possibility" and PROs and CONs if this did occur. Please try to keep flaming down and to stay on-topic. BHs are welcome to give constructive input.
Some following questions to consider when discussing:
JEDI:
- Do you beleive the BH system currently is effectively stopping the growth of jedi (as intended) ?
- If XP loss was removed would you feel as much "tension" when losing to a BH ?
- If this occured do you beleive the grind would now be "too easy", "just right", or still "too hard" ?
- Does XP loss now (or even when grinding) make you "show off" less ?
BOUNTY HUNTER:
- What is the main motivation for hunting player jedi (please be honest) ?
- Do you beleive its fair that jedi are the only profession in the game that loses something upon (BH) death ?
- If they took away jedi XP loss would you hunt as many jedi as you do now ?
- If XP loss remains do you beleive BHs should be punished for losses or consecutive losses ?
Remember PLEASE try to stay on task and try not to flame eachother - someone will disagree with you - agree to disagree. Maybe if we have enough good input we might be stickied (at least for a bit)
EXP LOSS WASN'T INTENDED TO STOP JEDI GROWTH IT WAS TO STOP BH'S FROM FARMING JEDI FRIENDS FOR CREDITS.
I want to slap whoever started that rumor you (OP) are spreading.
Skyburnbright wrote:
I think there should be some kind of penalty on the BH if they get killed by the Jedi they attack, I mean the jedi lose a load of xp if they die
Until you have played a BH in the current system and understand what it takes to track down a jedi, have your armour degrade faster than a spice downer, and lose most of the time, you really need to not ask for the BH's to lose xp when they are defeted. Since the cu, I have spend 2 million on armour, 6 million on weapons, and still have less than a 10% success rate...and I actually know how to pvp :/
I will say the same things BHs say to us.... "You chose your profession and you chose to take that risk"
Jacella wrote:
Skyburnbright wrote:
I think there should be some kind of penalty on the BH if they get killed by the Jedi they attack, I mean the jedi lose a load of xp if they die
Until you have played a BH in the current system and understand what it takes to track down a jedi, have your armour degrade faster than a spice downer, and lose most of the time, you really need to not ask for the BH's to lose xp when they are defeted. Since the cu, I have spend 2 million on armour, 6 million on weapons, and still have less than a 10% success rate...and I actually know how to pvp :/
Jacella wrote:
Skyburnbright wrote:
I think there should be some kind of penalty on the BH if they get killed by the Jedi they attack, I mean the jedi lose a load of xp if they die
Until you have played a BH in the current system and understand what it takes to track down a jedi, have your armour degrade faster than a spice downer, and lose most of the time, you really need to not ask for the BH's to lose xp when they are defeted. Since the cu, I have spend 2 million on armour, 6 million on weapons, and still have less than a 10% success rate...and I actually know how to pvp :/
There is no degradation penalty for PvP, only PvE.
blademaster30 wrote:
Ok there are 3 types of people out there that want to keep xp loss
1. the bounty hunter who will say anything to keep xp loss.
2. The non jedi that is jealous and wants to keep xp loss.
3. The old-timer Jedi that want all Jedi rare except for there’s.
4. Jedi who do not want the risk vs reward system further dumbed down, thus further weakening the Jedi profession
risk vs reward
Darka-ce wrote:
blademaster30 wrote:
Ok there are 3 types of people out there that want to keep xp loss
1. the bounty hunter who will say anything to keep xp loss.
2. The non jedi that is jealous and wants to keep xp loss.
3. The old-timer Jedi that want all Jedi rare except for there’s.
4. Jedi who do not want the risk vs reward system further dumbed down, thus further weakening the Jedi profession
The risk, however minimal, still outweighs any potential reward.
Darka-ce wrote:
blademaster30 wrote:
Ok there are 3 types of people out there that want to keep xp loss
1. the bounty hunter who will say anything to keep xp loss.
2. The non jedi that is jealous and wants to keep xp loss.
3. The old-timer Jedi that want all Jedi rare except for there’s.
4. Jedi who do not want the risk vs reward system further dumbed down, thus further weakening the Jedi profession
I put it that it is you who either not been Jedi very long or simply do not understand the correlation of the Risk vs Reward system that has been in place since Jedi made their debut. Jedi were the MOST STRONG when the risk was the MOST GREAT. They have systematically been reduced in power with every REMOVAL of risk. Allow me to recap a post I made some pages (page 7) ago:
Quote from Darka-ce:
A long time ago in a galaxy far far away...
Jedi were strong. Jedi had huge risks for being Jedi. Jedi had perma death. Some Jedi cried, perma death was changed to skill loss. A bad precedence has begun.
Jedi were still rare, and Jedi were still strong however. Jedi had hologrinds. Long tedious and sometimes random mashing thru professions for the Holy "unlock". Jedi were still strong. Some Jedi cry... "why oh why must I grind tailor and/or chef to be Jedi??" Jedi revamp comes and with it, holo grinding goes away and the village appears. Jedi no longer able to wear armor. Saber dmg nerfed. Jedi become weaker.
Clear path to becoming force sensitive becomes known. Nade grinding becomes FOTM. Jedi population explosion. Melee/Inv III BHs run amuck. BH gank squads appear along with Jedi escort posee's. Some Jedi cry, GTEFs disappear. Jedi no longer able to be protected by faction and guild members due to BH/Jedi TEF. Jedi become weaker.
GCW appears, legendary DOTs and D stackers abound. Some Jedi cry, CU hits. FRS disappears, Jedi become much weaker.
Some Jedi cry about XP loss upon death. XP loss by creature death removed, Jedi XP loss to PvP death removed. Sabers hit for Energy damage vs "saber". Jedi weakened.
BH 5 man hunt teams appear. Some Jedi cry, BHs no longer see names on terms. Jedi Healer nerfed, Jedi powers nerfed, BH/MCM appears, Jedi weaker.
Enter Jedi grinding spin groups. 1 million XP in a day. Completed Templates in weeks vs months. Jedi force regen slowed. Jedi SAC cost increased. Prem. Pearls/ Crystal drops made rare. Jedi weakened.
And now... many many lifetimes later.. Jedi weakened to a near laughable state of it's former self. Jedi dying by the dozens by MBH/MCM templates, Jedi crying about XP loss to BHs. If this too is removed, with it, the last vestiges of a once proud and powerful profession. Am I the only one to understand that Jedi has ALWAYS been about risk vs. reward? When jedi had HIGH risk, they were MUCH stronger. Now the ONLY risk to Jedi is death from BH and consequently, Jedi are but a shadow of their former strength. Remove this and you might as well make Jedi a starting profession.
I support INCREASING the risk to Jedi and with it, returning us to the strength that we once were. Most of all, I feel awful for those brave souls who were Jedi long ago, when they truly were "alpha class" and earned it with perma-death, skill loss, gank teams, saber TEF only to have subsequent generations of Jedi cry enough to have the profession brought to the brink of destruction. If I had a Jedi that could once solo a Krayt and now gets wiped soloing a Gurk lair, I'd be pretty bitter too. So be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.
Since the beginning, the risks for Jedi have been at one time or another, Perma-death, skill loss to ANY death, Saber TEFS, and BH gank squads. Since all of these have been removed, Jedi power has greatly diminished PROPORTIONALLY with our risk until now the ONLY risk we have left is the risk of XP loss from a BH death. Is it any wonder why we have many newer Jedi who now say that the reward isn't worth the risk? We have done this to ourselves, and I will ALWAYS be a strong opponent to any further removal of the risk system becuase I know what will follow. Jedi being a starting profession. Where else can we fall to? What's left?
Message Edited by Darka-ce on 09-23-2005 09:49 PM