Game Guides Archive
Thread: Streamlined the terrain system to improve client performance
ComCypher
Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:57 am
#105
Roeding wrote:
ComCypher wrote:
I just noticed a line in the PM browser that tells you if a PM has been read or not by the recipient. Of the 9 (yes, nine!) devs that I PMed about the issue, only 1 of them has apparently read my PM. And that person isn't even technically a dev, but the director of community relations to whom I complained about the lack of communication. The other 8 devs (which includes a player correspondent tragically enough) apparently don't read their PMs so they likely don't even know this graphics problem exists.
With all the hard work the devs are putting into this game I thought I would dedicate a screenshot to them that reflects their enormous efforts. Thank you devs!!!
My beautiful Dantooine lawn
Maybe if wesubmit some screenshots like that to Screenshot of the Day they will start noticing
I already submitted one, but it has close to a zero chance of getting displayed 
.
AEK
Wed Mar 09, 2005 5:45 pm
#106
ComCypher wrote:I just noticed a line in the PM browser that tells you if a PM has been read or not by the recipient. Of the 9 (yes, nine!) devs that I PMed about the issue, only 1 of them has apparently read my PM. And that person isn't even technically a dev, but the director of community relations to whom I complained about the lack of communication. The other 8 devs (which includes a player correspondent tragically enough) apparently don't read their PMs so they likely don't even know this graphics problem exists.With all the hard work the devs are putting into this game I thought I would dedicate a screenshot to them that reflects their enormous efforts. Thank you devs!!!
LOL, nice, even got the gimped water in there.
ComCypher
Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:15 pm
#107
Attention everyone, I have new information following Publish 14. It consists of good news and bad news. Sticking with tradition, I will give the good news first.
Good News 
The devs have improved the terraintiling in this publish. Mind you it still doesn'thold a candle upto the nice terrain we had prior to publish 13, but any improvement is a good improvement. So in summary the issue still exists but to a lesser extent (that isn't the bad news however).
Before I give the bad news, compare these two screenshots. The first is the one I took yesterday of the publish 13 terrain, and the second was taken moments ago from publish 14. You can see the lessened tiling effect but there is something else the devs decided to screw up in the meantime.
Bad News 
The devs lowered the terrain detail distance. Notice how the mountains in the distance in the second shot are less defined than those in the first. Before anyone asks, I checked to make sure my graphics sliders were in the same location as always.
So in summary, the devs slightly improved something and then screwed up something else. That is a negative net gainfrom pre-publish 13. I seriously think the guy working on the terrain should be sacked at this point. Keep in mind that everything I have just brought up is NOT mentioned in the publish 14 patch notes, the devs are doing all this silently behind our backs. If that isn't an example of bad communication I don't know what is. This war isn't over yet, we need to let the devs know we can't be fooled so easily.
Wahini
Wed Mar 09, 2005 10:24 pm
#109
I noticed it....my movements now are jerky and when I move I move 2 steps instead of just the one...and yes I too noticed teh grainy texture....
Ratel
Thu Mar 10, 2005 12:24 am
#110
ComCypher wrote:
Attention everyone, I have new information following Publish 14. It consists of good news and bad news. Sticking with tradition, I will give the good news first.
Good News
The devs have improved the terraintiling in this publish. Mind you it still doesn'thold a candle upto the nice terrain we had prior to publish 13, but any improvement is a good improvement. So in summary the issue still exists but to a lesser extent (that isn't the bad news however).
Before I give the bad news, compare these two screenshots. The first is the one I took yesterday of the publish 13 terrain, and the second was taken moments ago from publish 14. You can see the lessened tiling effect but there is something else the devs decided to screw up in the meantime.
Publish 13 screenshot
Publish 14 screenshot
Bad News
The devs lowered the terrain detail distance. Notice how the mountains in the distance in the second shot are less defined than those in the first. Before anyone asks, I checked to make sure my graphics sliders were in the same location as always.
So in summary, the devs slightly improved something and then screwed up something else. That is a negative net gainfrom pre-publish 13. I seriously think the guy working on the terrain should be sacked at this point. Keep in mind that everything I have just brought up is NOT mentioned in the publish 14 patch notes, the devs are doing all this silently behind our backs. If that isn't an example of bad communication I don't know what is. This war isn't over yet, we need to let the devs know we can't be fooled so easily.
Was there any improvement in performance this time? I've not had a chance to log on and try Publish 14 yet.
ComCypher
Thu Mar 10, 2005 1:55 am
#111
Lucee wrote:
I have shown before and after pics to some unbelieving friends. They still swear they don't have these issues since Pub 13. We all have differing cards and systems. If there is a graphics setting that changes this downplay of graphics, I sure would like to know what it is. Anyone else have friends that see nothing at all? And if so, do they have some special card or something?
If there are people claiming they don't experience this problem then I would love to see some screenshots by them. If this is true then it changes the situation entirely, there might be a setting buried somewhere that can be adjusted to cure this. I'm skeptical though, because I've personally seen the problem on two different computers that couldn't be more different--one is an Athlon machine with an ATI card and the other is a Pentium machine with an NVidia card. I think it is more probable they just aren't as receptive to the difference--even I was questioning my sanity initially as can be seen in my first post in this thread.
Impo-UK
Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:05 am
#112
I noticed this improvement, it almost looks like ingame Anisotropic filtering to the terrain.
Ortchel
Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:01 am
#113
I'm really wishing I had the ability to edit my posts right about now. I'd like to rephrase, if I may. My intention wasn't to make one of those famous "I'm quitting!" threats, but merely to say that these changes have significantly altered my game-play and that I hope they're not permanent. I always told myself that I've got no cause to complain as long as I can explore Tatooine on foot unhindered. Since this extremely basic requirement has now been altered, I'm a little annoyed. The fact that the default control scheme is now "EQ2 Style" seems to speak volumes.
Now back to your thread already in progress.
Now back to your thread already in progress.
ComCypher
Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:28 am
#114
Ratel wrote:
ComCypher wrote:
Attention everyone, I have new information following Publish 14. It consists of good news and bad news. Sticking with tradition, I will give the good news first.
Good News
The devs have improved the terraintiling in this publish. Mind you it still doesn'thold a candle upto the nice terrain we had prior to publish 13, but any improvement is a good improvement. So in summary the issue still exists but to a lesser extent (that isn't the bad news however).
Before I give the bad news, compare these two screenshots. The first is the one I took yesterday of the publish 13 terrain, and the second was taken moments ago from publish 14. You can see the lessened tiling effect but there is something else the devs decided to screw up in the meantime.
Publish 13 screenshot
Publish 14 screenshot
Bad News
The devs lowered the terrain detail distance. Notice how the mountains in the distance in the second shot are less defined than those in the first. Before anyone asks, I checked to make sure my graphics sliders were in the same location as always.
So in summary, the devs slightly improved something and then screwed up something else. That is a negative net gainfrom pre-publish 13. I seriously think the guy working on the terrain should be sacked at this point. Keep in mind that everything I have just brought up is NOT mentioned in the publish 14 patch notes, the devs are doing all this silently behind our backs. If that isn't an example of bad communication I don't know what is. This war isn't over yet, we need to let the devs know we can't be fooled so easily.
Was there any improvement in performance this time? I've not had a chance to log on and try Publish 14 yet.
I'm glad you brought that up, because I believe I have more bad news to report regarding this. I have lost a couple FPS in this publish, despite the fact that the graphics have been dumbed down. I can't speak for everyone but it isn't looking good...
Ortchel wrote:
I'm really wishing I had the ability to edit my posts right about now. I'd like to rephrase, if I may. My intention wasn't to make one of those famous "I'm quitting!" threats, but merely to say that these changes have significantly altered my game-play and that I hope they're not permanent. I always told myself that I've got no cause to complain as long as I can explore Tatooine on foot unhindered. Since this extremely basic requirement has now been altered, I'm a little annoyed. The fact that the default control scheme is now "EQ2 Style" seems to speak volumes.
Now back to your thread already in progress.
I hear what you are saying, I feel the same way. Even the most fundamental aspect of MMORPGs is being turned on its head in this game, and the devs are doing all this completely without player consent. Who is authorizing such stupid decisions within the company? I have trouble imagining some big boss telling his employees "alright, for this next publish I want to devote more resources to making the graphics look worse. I don't think players like graphics anyway so there is no reason to keep that around. And team B, I want you looking into ways to making player movement less realistic. It's necessary for future publishes to function properly."
Kinda creepy if you think about it.
Ortchel
Thu Mar 10, 2005 7:46 am
#115
Indeed. SOE is so graphics obsessed this is perhaps the most peculiar change of all. The movement is obviously the product of the SWG being added to Station access; they want all their games to have the same feel and control scheme. However this, this is something else altogether .. Once the combat upgrade goes live we won't even recognize the game anymore.
Huaracocha
Thu Mar 10, 2005 8:04 am
#116
Ouch - I'd noticed those square tiles seen in your screenies and thought "how comes I didn't notice that before?"
I've noticed also other things regarding range - not just the pub 14 reduction you mention, which I haven't yet noticed, but before that. I could swear that they reduced the range on the plants and such (non-collidable flora?) as I used to be able to stand on a hill one side of a valley and see the scrub and bushes on the opposite slope but no longer. I even went into the options thinking my slider had reset back to a low range (as it used to do ALWAYS every time I logged in, but stopped doing quite some time ago). All sliders at total max but still the annoying pop-up of plants etc at around 20m range. I used to be able to all but eliminate this pop-up, or at least send it to the distant horizon, but can't seem to any more. Anyone else having this problem?
Soooo now we're getting stealth nerfs on the graphics making them WORSE accompanied by inexplicable changes to the movement system, also impacting graphical immersion, justified by cryptic comments about future changes and "quick reactions". Has there been any official word on these texture / range issues at all yet?
Getting worried here...
Ortchel
Thu Mar 10, 2005 8:20 am
#117
Everyone, it's important we bring this to the community's attention. Don't complain about it, or even discuss it, just spread the word. Post a link in threads, show your guildmates, whatever. If enough people see this, something will be done, no one likes a graphics nerf.
To make a 'clicky link' type the following:
< a href = "URL here" >Text here< /a >
And then close the brackets. If you have trouble making links, send me a PM.
To make a 'clicky link' type the following:
< a href = "URL here" >Text here< /a >
And then close the brackets. If you have trouble making links, send me a PM.