Force Sensitive Archive

I just pm'd your Jedi Correspondent with some advice. This is in response to the people who complained about how he presented his questions that he expects answered. Honestly, I felt your complaints had merit. I see no hard Data being collected, no real information is being passed on to the developers besides (HEy this ain't working! fix it!)

Your Jedi Correspondent might wish to try gathering volunteers to generate and record accurate data concerning the problems within your profession, using these forums as a median. He should then be stickying each post regarding the information so that each person here can comment or check the data for themselves and add comments or discuss issues. Then he should be compiling that data and basing his questions upon said data.

For instance, you might be able to prove that pearls aren't dropping enough if you could show the developer team, that say, pearls drop 1 per hour, are of GOOD quality, and only 1 in 10 tune well, and if it takes 4 pearls to fill a 4th gen saber. Then you've had to spend 40 hours collecting 40 pearls just so you could have enough to fill (1) lightsaber.

Anyway, this is the message I pm'd him. You guys really ought to think about this. I realize none of the other correspondents bother with this kind of testing anymore, but at one time it was a standard practice and a decent way to at least get the issues acknowledged and perhaps a few comments from the developers.

If your correspondent comes off bad, then he will largely be ignored by the developer team, this also used to happen a lot. They're not interested in opinions, they're interested in cold hard data. Show them your problems, show them your proof of said problems, then squeeze them until they answer. That's the way it needs to be done.

Hey Bro,

I saw your list of things that you submitted to the developers. Just some advice from an old SW:G Beta Tester if you don't mind? You might find they are much more responsive to hard data.

Concerning Pearl Drops: I think it would have been better to get 5-6 Jedi together who were willing to hunt for crystals/pearls at all the known locations and record:

Like this EXAMPLE:

Mob Hunted: Canyon Corsair's Cl40-45 Corsair POI.

Loot Hunted: Crystal

Quality of Item: 5 Fair, 2 good

Hours spent hunting: 7

Average Tune: (Data here)

Server: Chilastra

Then you take this data, compile it, average it out, and hand it to the dev's. And THIS way, they can see what the problems are. Perhaps pearls don't drop enough? perhaps too much? etc. etc. etc.

You have to back up all your statements with Data in order for them to listen to you. Otherwise you are just wasting your very valuable time.

You need to go out on the forums and hunt for volunteers to run some of these tests. Such as the issues with Force Powers. Damage Vs. Time spent, Vs Lightsabers. etc.

All these are valid complaints but you've got no hard data to give to the dev's, you need responsible and accurate data collectors. And I'm sure if you just asked you'd find at least 4-5 people willing to help you collect data for presentation to the developers.

Message Edited by Grunzer on 07-09-2005 12:11 AM

---

Tamianx wrote:

Bluntly you need to stop 'pervceiving' what each tree's role is and project the concerns of those players as -they- see fit, not your top concerns. Next time you go to the devs I suggest you post the questions here and let > US < tell you what the priorities are. MPowers need some functional changes and you can see my suggestions in other posts .. take THOSE as a suggestion to the devs, not some if the lower priority bs you have listed.

---

Being a correspondant / liason between the community and devs is a fairly significant task (as evidenced by the minimum number of volunteers for the position). I don't beleive Baciacca is listing "his top concerns" over anyone elses, but rather his interpretation of what the overall community is trying to achieve. I think it is a bit arrogant to ask him to take your suggestions specifically to the devs as if yours or anyone else's are any better. I believe the role of Baciacca is to determine some sort of consensus opinion and try to rank them to the best of their ability. The correspondant also needs to be diplomatic with the devs so that the devs will lenda listening ear. There are obviously many issues currently with the Jedi role in this game, and if you ask 10 different players what they rank #1, you will probably get as many different responses. I think Baciacca is taking the right approach ... take a handful of frequently voiced concerns, try and get those addressed, then come back and get some more. He will obviously not please everyone, but in time he will make much more progress than trying to take on the entire profession at once. We just need to support the effort and be patient to see how things work out.

Because of how many pearls I had to buy (pre-cu so the cost has only gone up since then) I've spent over 50 MILLION CREDITS to make my saber the craptastic weapon it is today. When is saber damage going to be proportional to the cost of the weapon?

My 12 point Master Weaponsmith alt makes T-21's that do up to 1k damage and they sell for 40,000 credits. But my saber will only do a max of 600-ish and it cost me 50 million? Yeah that seems fair.

---

Baciacca wrote:

Questions for the Devs from the Community:

I realize that there are alot of questions here. Any answers would be appreciated by the Jedi/Force Sensitive Communities. Thanks.

Jedi Profession:
1.When are the Pearl drops getting fixed? Jedi is a worthless profession without decent pearls to equip Lightsabers properly. This is obviously needed to be able to fend off the multiple BH encounters especially with the inadequate healing abilities of a Jedi at the moment and/or the every day grind. From what I hear this has already been fixed... since your the Core I would have thought you would have known that...

2.Are there any plans for Startle Shot and Concussion Shot to be fixed so that the “Chain root/warcry” effect does not happen? This was fixed already... again... Dont you keep up with the current game?

3.Any chance that the Healing delays will be reduced or if not will heals in general be improved (ex. 4xxx Healer could give 2k heals instead of the 1.5k heals now); if so will this be in the FRS.

4.With regards to Jedi Cloak, will the following be fixed:

a.Jedi while on Force Cloak are /tar-able. Fixed in Publish 20 on TC... Do you not pay any attention?
b.Jedi while on Force Cloak can be agro’d by NPCs while running around in dungeons and in the wild.
c.Jedi while on Force Cloak can be seen just by the shadow below them that do not disappear if a player is looking at shadows underthesimpleoption.
d.Jedi are able to attack single and multiple targets while cloaked; combat spam will say nothing about what is happening because of this. Never seen this...

5.Jedi Discipline – Force Healer:
a.This profession costs far more than any healer profession to grind Xp wise yet is less efficient. How is this going to be fixed?
b.Also the xxx4 line of healer because Jedi very rarely worry about the effects of Poisons and Diseases let alone bleeds which do next to nothing worthwhile at the moment.

6.Jedi Discipline – Force Enhancer
a.The xx4x (resist buff) line in enhancer seems to be worthless due to the lack of state effects actually doing anything at the moment(other then the fact that they all do something atm.. sure)and also poison and disease resists seem to not work either.

7.Any chance of a comment on the implementation of a Master/Padawan System?

Force Sensitive Profession:
1.Will the old Mind Buff Crystals ever have a use again? This was a long and hard quest to get a now worthless paperweight.

2.Phase 3 Capture Enemy Leadership - Sith Commander moves way too slow and refuses to climb hills making only 1 base (the one nearest the Village) viable to complete the quest. Any Chance of getting this fixed?

3.Can we get a break down of what each Force Sensitive skills are supposed to do exactly? Some of them have less than accurate descriptions that are often misleading.

4.The first attack after the Old man visit has 3 Sith attackers with level 75 and Up. This is not possible for people without near finished templates. Think we can tone those attackers CL down a bit?

5.Some FS trees are broken, (such as the healing tree giving mods no longer needed and one tree in crafting which lowers the chance to fail while assembly when that was removed many publishes ago)

6.Will there be a chance to convert jedi xp to FS xp?

Message Edited by Baciacca on 07-08-2005 03:52 AM

---

---

Geodan wrote:

---

Tamianx wrote:

Bluntly you need to stop 'pervceiving' what each tree's role is and project the concerns of those players as -they- see fit, not your top concerns. Next time you go to the devs I suggest you post the questions here and let > US < tell you what the priorities are. MPowers need some functional changes and you can see my suggestions in other posts .. take THOSE as a suggestion to the devs, not some if the lower priority bs you have listed.

---

Being a correspondant / liason between the community and devs is a fairly significant task (as evidenced by the minimum number of volunteers for the position). I don't beleive Baciacca is listing "his top concerns" over anyone elses, but rather his interpretation of what the overall community is trying to achieve. I think it is a bit arrogant to ask him to take your suggestions specifically to the devs as if yours or anyone else's are any better. I believe the role of Baciacca is to determine some sort of consensus opinion and try to rank them to the best of their ability. The correspondant also needs to be diplomatic with the devs so that the devs will lenda listening ear. There are obviously many issues currently with the Jedi role in this game, and if you ask 10 different players what they rank #1, you will probably get as many different responses. I think Baciacca is taking the right approach ... take a handful of frequently voiced concerns, try and get those addressed, then come back and get some more. He will obviously not please everyone, but in time he will make much more progress than trying to take on the entire profession at once. We just need to support the effort and be patient to see how things work out.

---

I would have to disagree, and the items (especially in order of the list -and- the text to go with it) detailed prove that point. Prior to any submital of a 'request' to the Devs he should be creating focus threads to build what -we-, the community, feel are the important changes are. He should also be paying attention to those acpects that have been fixed, have stated they are being fixed and watching feedback from TC.

Bluntly, MHealer is functionally useless and MPowers is no match to MLS even without Prem Pearls .. yet thats the most important item? Please dont state that it is because there are more MLS then MP, or I can just come back and state well maybe if MP was made viable that would change that situation. I dont negate the importance of the pearl fix, but by god dont keep focusing on one of the 3 only viable trees in the profession, when there are two huge gaping holes in theother two trees. And please dont tell me that mobs following a cloaked person (/target is already slated to be fixed in Pub 20 btw) as MPowers main concern.

For us to make progress, as a profession, we need to project our top concerns and continue to follow them through. By continualy going back to the Devs with more, and minor, issues we will not be able to get the critical changes we need to occur done in a reasonable time period. Top priorities are just that, the major issues with a problem ... and MHealer and MPowers were not described as that in the text he posted.

Tamianx

I am not saying that I disagree with you, however, right now Baciacca has the job because it seems to me, no one else wanted it. Its easy for us to not volunteer, then just sit back, make suggestions and critisize the job they are doing. If you feel so strongly about this, maybe you should take the time and prepare this list for Baciacca to take to the Devs. In the mean time, it will be a nice exercise to see if the devs actually listen to Baciacca and solve some of these issues ... they may not be the most important issues to you or according to your assessment, but they are important to someand if he is successful its a win-win for all of us.

---

Tamianx wrote:

---

Baciacca wrote:

Questions for the Devs from the Community:

I realize that there are alot of questions here. Any answers would be appreciated by the Jedi/Force Sensitive Communities. Thanks.

Jedi Profession:
1.When are the Pearl drops getting fixed? Jedi is a worthless profession without decent pearls to equip Lightsabers properly. This is obviously needed to be able to fend off the multiple BH encounters especially with the inadequate healing abilities of a Jedi at the moment and/or the every day grind.

>>MLS is owning MPower in every respect without some simple changes, giving MPowers tatical (Not dps) options. While Pearls are an important fix, to request the status without even mentioniong Powers is truely hypocritical. <<

2.Are there any plans for Startle Shot and Concussion Shot to be fixed so that the “Chain root/warcry” effect does not happen?

3.Any chance that the Healing delays will be reduced or if not will heals in general be improved (ex. 4xxx Healer could give 2k heals instead of the 1.5k heals now); if so will this be in the FRS.

>>There is indication, not in the notes but from TC responses/parses, that Healing is down to a 4 sec delay.<<

4.With regards to Jedi Cloak, will the following be fixed:

a.Jedi while on Force Cloak are /tar-able.

>>Fixed as per Pub 20 Patch Notes <<
b.Jedi while on Force Cloak can be agro’d by NPCs while running around in dungeons and in the wild.
c.Jedi while on Force Cloak can be seen just by the shadow below them that do not disappear if a player is looking at shadows underthesimpleoption.

d.Jedi are able to attack single and multiple targets while cloaked; combat spam will say nothing about what is happening because of this.

>>This is an 'Real Issue', the above two need to be fixed but surely cant be more pirority then other issues (MP, see below) on the table.

5.Jedi Discipline – Force Healer:

>>This issue should be number 2, right after fixing the abiltity to attack while cloaked <<
a.This profession costs far more than any healer profession to grind Xp wise yet is less efficient. How is this going to be fixed?
b.Also the xxx4 line of healer because Jedi very rarely worry about the effects of Poisons and Diseases let alone bleeds which do next to nothing worthwhile at the moment.

>>While states and such mean nothing, we really should wait and see as to what the Devs are implementing in that regard before asking for changes or removal of those skills <<

6.Jedi Discipline – Force Enhancer
a.The xx4x (resist buff) line in enhancer seems to be worthless due to the lack of state effects actually doing anything at the moment and also poison and disease resists seem to not work either.

>>See above .. why is this even an issue on the table right now? <<

7.Any chance of a comment on the implementation of a Master/Padawan System?

>>Give this a rest ... there is no need for it without FRS and with the Group Vis system in place as of Pub 20 .. there are far bigger issues to address <<

---

I pointed my fustration with your statements and priorities in this post here:

---

---

Baciacca wrote:
I like this idea.

---

memberg wrote:
This message follows a previous thread, In that thread the poster felt like his long accomplishment of pre9 jedi holo grind has been forgotten. Fellow jedi have gotten to unlock in a much shorter time. Reading the responces I came up with an AMMENDMENT to an idea posted there.

How about being reconized for your JEDI's age. Like veteran rewards for the oldest jedi? IE: the 1yr mark, the 2 yr mark, and THE OLDEST jedi on each server. These rewards might be a choice of a special robe, or colord crystal, or perfect tuned pearl. Any number of player rewards for the time put into being a jedi.

---

Some how I doubt the Devs would allow this because when asked about custom robes at fanfest they clearly stated: "That is what the FRS robes are for" but it cant hurt to ask.

This would be a very cool reward that im sure most would absolutly love to get. (Silver or Black would be some cools choices.)

This would probably be the most wanted reward if any and because of the current drop rates probably the most needed reward.

---

Not trying to be rude, but your job as a correspondent is to help liason the concerns and ideas of the complete (past, current, and future) population in regards to the profession. Further, as our representivite you 'unstated' duty is to find coheision between the population and help focus discussions to the postive. Making statements like the above really does not seem to fall in either of those categories and honestly the last thing that should be brought to the devs attention when there are enough issues on the table that need to be resolved.

Bluntly "This would probably be the most wanted reward if any and because of the current drop rates probably the most needed reward." is what triggered my post as what your saying with that is 'reward' older players with a perfect tuned pearl, of which they already have hadthe ability to obtain, when the current layer of players cant hope to even acheive one?

Lets stop focusing on the past, stop focusing on the changes that brought us here, and start focusing on the needs/changes/fixes/(insert whatever here) to address viablity/use of those trees that have outstanding concerns.

---

Bluntly you need to stop 'pervceiving' what each tree's role is and project the concerns of those players as -they- see fit, not your top concerns. Next time you go to the devs I suggest you post the questions here and let > US < tell you what the priorities are. MPowers need some functional changes and you can see my suggestions in other posts .. take THOSE as a suggestion to the devs, not some if the lower priority bs you have listed.

---

.............. . .. .. ..........

You complain about the RESIST LINE! when enhancer is agrueably the most viable profession atm. The only complaint your sending in for questions is the FRIGGIN RESIST LINE IN ENHANCER!?!@?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!!!!!!!!

Are you NUTS!? How about improving powers or fixing the other 3/4's of the healer profession?

---

Jediforcefighter wrote:

I remember looking at the chart and the info about the "new" CU when it was in testing. Jedi wasn't even on the chart neither was there any information about it. It makes it seem that things were being kept hidden from the public and jedi to hide the truth about jedi. As we see on the game reviews on gamespot and other interviewing game sites, they all talked about how great the non-jedi life was and input false sayings as well. There was nothing said about jedi in the reviews about jedi because alot of the people that their sole purpose of getting SWG was to play as a jedi would be discouraged and would have second thoughts about it. But as you can see, if you look at the interviews that allowed gamers opinions, Jedi's reponses were almost all negative and many players warned potential buyers that if you wanted jedi not to choose this game. What it seems is that when the CU was brought up, Jedi was not something they were thinking about and given thought. And so still today jedi is going to dramatic changes and the FRS ideas not being considered until now(no more respecs with big changes) because jedi is just now being thought about and CU was pushed too soon.

---

Message Edited by antares_Kauri on 07-09-2005 07:17 AM

if they up jedi healing then up the force cost and its fine .

multiple bh comming is not a valid point to make your profession godly .

your professiosn takes more xp to take because everyone and their mother wants to hold a light saber.

force cloak should not last forever , this is not world of warcraft and you guys are not rogues ,besides when getting really close you guys should be seen (yep like the rogues in wow)

healing delays are fine , you enjoyed your nice i win button for a while , with nearly imposible way to kill a jedi , i dont know if you noticed , since its easy to be selfish and want to be over powered over anyone else , but have you noticed the amount of pvp lately after publish 19 ? there are normies and jedi pvping side to side , and everyone is having a good time .

no not everyone wants to be a jedi (i droped all my fs boxes when i came back) , no not everyone wants to grind 1 year to start having fun pvping , get this trough your head , once you guys are balanced with the rest of the full template professions there will be less jedi , before publish 19 the only way to pvp was for 3 bh to pick one jedi , because going overt while holding a rifle or a sword was like holding a US flag and screaming "here i am guys" in a terroirst camp , yes you guessed it , not fun.

jedi are powerfull , but even after publish 19 they are near unkillable one on one even with a doctor template if the jedi has some good pearls , also know that everyone are padawans , so a tera kazi master cannot be as powerfull as a jedi padawan? now when one of you become jedi master and get soloed by a "normy" as we have been crudly labeled now then you have a reason to whine and cry .

if you dont want to have the whole server be a jedi you ahve to bite the bullet and admit that you cant have a class that anyone cant beat and expect people to want to compete on it , also you cant separate jedi from normal classes in pvp because then whats the point of been a jedi ?

learn to win by using timed skills and strategy like us "normies " have ,have people win because they are good , not because they grinded 1 year afk(or not afk i dont care)jedi should have a slight advatage , not a god mode set on them.

sometimes i have a feeling that some jedi are like counter strike kiddies that couldnt beat people using skills so instead of having fun learning while fighting , they go spend a wholeweek looking for hacks , and when they find onethey laughon how powerfull they are while winning ,