Fencer Archive
Thread: I love fencer, but i think it's doomed. Here's why
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raditz_farstar
Fri Jul 02, 2004 8:15 pm
#1
Hullo everyone, i don't post often on the fencer forums but i adore the profession and have been one for a long while now. My problem is, in high end pvp fencer is no longer useable as an attacking profession. Someone with full buffs (entertainer and doctor)in full stun armor with an effectiveness slice, a psg, 2 brandyand synthsteak can no longer be damaged AT ALL by a fencer. There is literally no way to damage them, kd'd or not. Bear in mind i use a 300min dmg aclay baton, and also have tried with gaffis similar to these stats. I invite any of you to try this post patch, there is no move that does damage if your opponent is well prepared.
I know that scatter hit 2 was bugged, and that it was a fix. However in pvp just now there are only a few professions that can do any real dmg against buffed and well armored opponents (lets face it this is most people now) and fencer was just struck off the list.
I think the damage output needs to be raised for tk, fencer and pike significantly to be any challenge to the awesome dps of a rifleman.
Or to be cliched, "maybe the combat rebalance will fix it" I'm not a fotm fencer, and i was more than prepared to stick with the profession if it had lost its edge. But its not just lost its edge, its become useless. Fought a tk for 20 minutes solid and did 0 damage, as he did to me also. Dots eventually ended it - but is this really what we want?
I love fencer, this isn't a whine. I just really want to be able to be a fencer, and i don't think i can be anymore if i want to defend bases on our server effectively.
Piet
RSA
Farstar
Message Edited by raditz_farstar on 07-02-2004 08:21 PM
LuapLink
Fri Jul 02, 2004 8:26 pm
#2
1. Our next question to TH is about high end PvE mobs
2. Armour is getting a nerf in the CB
3. Buffs are getting a nerf in the CB
4. The speed equations will be totally changed in the CB so that you will nolonger see riflemen spaming specials at the speed cap.
FallAM
Fri Jul 02, 2004 8:32 pm
#3
Both good points. What we have is PVP in a very sad and helpless condition. Those that are prepared with the equipment that is commonplace can eliminate themselves from taking significant damage from a range of professions. A rilfeman has to work hard if you have a high effectiveness slice on your stun helm. A rifleman has to work harder if he can't heal his intimidate. This means it is possible in a non-dot fight to keep going until someone loses the effects of their mind/focus willpower food and drink.
This doesn't mean fencer is useless, this means pvp is useless. I'm going to go heavy swords for the second time to focus on fighting mobs and the occasional atst. I could always master fencer a 3rd time but I dont know if I would.
MagicalHAt
Fri Jul 02, 2004 8:34 pm
#4
I agree that we need to do more damage.
LMFAO
FALLAM
RiseFM
Connection<>_<>??? shifty
FallAM
Fri Jul 02, 2004 8:35 pm
#5
Im not him but he was the premier ahazi to corbantis troll with 10k posts when I started this forum acct.
Straker_Atrella
Fri Jul 02, 2004 9:07 pm
#6
Just beat on him until his steak runs out and psg burns up. Not like he can hurt you either.
Brainplay
Sat Jul 03, 2004 8:27 am
#7
Either increase our damage types or one-hand damage bonus or add some more AP1 items into our weapons list.
raditz_farstar wrote:
Hullo everyone, i don't post often on the fencer forums but i adore the profession and have been one for a long while now. My problem is, in high end pvp fencer is no longer useable as an attacking profession. Someone with full buffs (entertainer and doctor)in full stun armor with an effectiveness slice, a psg, 2 brandyand synthsteak can no longer be damaged AT ALL by a fencer. There is literally no way to damage them, kd'd or not. Bear in mind i use a 300min dmg aclay baton, and also have tried with gaffis similar to these stats. I invite any of you to try this post patch, there is no move that does damage if your opponent is well prepared. The AP issue has been eating at us for a long time now. Since the viborblade is our only AP1 weapon that doesn't take an automatic 50% and is also our weakest weapon we've been hurting badly in the damage department vs. any sort of stun defense. Against any stun defense your 300damage baton was more like a 150 (then calculate -30% resist). The synthsteak is great for short fights but after 20-30 hits its gone but thats still enough to determine most fights.
I know that scatter hit 2 was bugged, and that it was a fix. However in pvp just now there are only a few professions that can do any real dmg against buffed and well armored opponents (lets face it this is most people now) and fencer was just struck off the list. That also strikes all ranged minus rifleman and thats only because riflemen attack an unhealable pool (i.e. the MIND).
I think the damage output needs to be raised fortk,fencer andpikesignificantly to be any challenge to the awesome dps of a rifleman. HAHAHAHA rifleman has one big advantage and thats the fact that he attacks the MIND. And of course even with entertainer buffs your MIND is still going to be weaker than your health and action and their substats ever will. TKM get a +250 unarmed damage bonus. Even without VK's they can still match our damage output thanks to their bonus. Pike do incredible amounts of damage but their accuracy and speed are lacking. We fencers need either a) better vibroblades or b) new weapons with ap1. Even pistoleers republic blasters outdamage our vibroblades and thats an AP1 weapon.
Or to be cliched, "maybe the combat rebalance will fix it" I'm not a fotm fencer, and i was more than prepared to stick with the profession if it had lost its edge. But its not just lost its edge, its become useless. Fought a tk for 20 minutes solid and did 0 damage, as he did to me also. Dots eventually ended it - but is this really what we want? When theykeep armor from reaching into the 80%+, remove melee mitigation, and give more than one profession in the entire game the ability to cure DoT's. Well the first two are going into effect soon or with the combat revamp, if the last one also made it DoTs wouldn't be an issue.
I love fencer, this isn't a whine. I just really want to be able to be a fencer, and i don't think i can be anymore if i want to defend bases on our server effectively. Against a TK or another fencer with all that you listed you'll be hard pressed to beat them. Against any ranged (with a some pik pie and/or stun layered helmet) you can take out any ranged profession easy. Swordman and Pikeman are tough calls and depend on their own preparations.
Piet
RSA
Farstar
Message Edited by raditz_farstar on 07-02-2004 08:21 PM
Tymothi
Sat Jul 03, 2004 8:40 am
#8
I don't mean to be cliche at all but all of our issues will be touched upon in th cb. While you do bring up good points it makes me ask, what do you want to devs to do about it now? They're a couple months from completely revamping the whole combat system AND several profession. When the cb comes out we'll get our fix, it's just a matter of waiting until then. Whether or not you stay fencer while you wait is up to you, I know I will.
Brainplay
Sat Jul 03, 2004 9:40 am
#9
Tymothi wrote:
I don't mean to be cliche at all but all of our issues will be touched upon in th cb. While you do bring up good points it makes me ask, what do you want to devs to do about it now? They're a couple months from completely revamping the whole combat system AND several profession. When the cb comes out we'll get our fix, it's just a matter of waiting until then. Whether or not you stay fencer while you wait is up to you, I know I will.
Until the latest post by our new correspondant I haven't heard anything in regards to the Fencer profession. Other than the HAM system and melee mitigation being removed (both are general changes not fencer specific) there has been no mention of fencer being changed or adjusted.
If anyone has any info from the fanfests please post! I'd like to more whats in store for us other than general changes which affect every profession.
cswoodbury
Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:20 am
#10
I think we'll see a lot more Fencers running around with Gaffi sticks that are enhanced come Combat Rebalance. And if the Stun layer on the Armor isn't getting nerfed then Fencers probably won't be seeing much use in that weapon unless they somehow get a Light AP weapon (thats any good). Thats really all Fencer needs. If they get a Light AP weapon that has DECENT damage then I'll be content with it. As it is without AP we are getting fairly shafted. I had to drop Fencer due to the demands cashwise on the Acklay bones... but I can't STAND not having it. I'll be picking it up here again within the week heeh.
Pire
Sat Jul 03, 2004 12:17 pm
#11
fencer will be affected by the weapon speed calculations. remeber that our weapons are pretty fast. given that armor and buffs will not be as effective as before, and our DPS will remain the same i think ( actually improve due to the armor and buff thing), and the big weapons of other professions will be much slower and brought more inline with ours, i think we will do very well.
however, i do realize and definetly think we need help in high end PvE. we need some better AP, plain and simple. i think they should make vibroblade ap2 and keep same stats and make it certifiable at master or something, or keep it ap1 as is and double the dmg. something along those lines.
Straker_Atrella
Sat Jul 03, 2004 2:26 pm
#12
I don't think we need an AP weapon better then we have. Werea DEFENSIVE profession, not offensive, if you want to hit harder, go swordsman. Hitting weak isn't glamorous, but you wear them down, you hit them more then they hit you.
I don't understand why you guys fear Rifleman so much, they are great don't get me wrong. I'm Rifle/Fencer, but believe it or not, I kill far more people in Fencer mode. Whenever I always use my Rifle, people charge me, if I try and Kite, my accuracy drops, plus I get hit a lot more often in Rifle mode. So I switch to Fencer. In Fencer mode, I simply hit people more then they hit me.
If we cry to much for AP weapons, and get them, then we start to become an offensive class and move away from being defensive. I want Defense.
veegen
Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:36 pm
#13
If you think about it, fencers (defense stacking fencers especially) are getting a good "buff" with a few CONFIRMED upcoming changes.
Armour will be nerfed, meaning that you wont see any more 80-90% composite armour. Lets say that the average PvPer will have like 60% armour instead, now things like Dodge and getting missed, will play a bigger role cuz now you will actually be taking damage when you get hit (which you wont now with good armour + PSG). So with fencer beeing the best at avoiding beeing hit in the game (through melee/ranged defense and high dodge+ CoB stats) the armour nerf might improve things for fencers vs. other proffesions.
And the nerfing of Doc Buffs which I think is confirmed, avoiding hits plays an even bigger role, thus making fencers dodging abilities even more helpful.
Maybe these changes wont have a as big effect as I think, but they could 
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