Fencer Archive

you'd think if they wanted to just fix the HAM costs, they would have just reduced them a little. Why they come up with these ultra complicated idiotic theories, I have no idea. I've really ceased to believe they will ever get a patch completely right, idea wise...which should notbe hard to do.

One other question...lets say the HAM cost is 25/25. That basically means that every tick I would gain back all the HAM I lost to do the special. I start with 1000 health, use my special that costs 25 health, which brings me to 975 Health Maximum. A tick later that 25 has regenerated back up to a Maxiumum of 1000 barring I didn't get damaged. Is that correct? So technically, if thats correct, if I use a weapon with low enough HAM costs, I would never actually be losing any HAM.

Also, when it regenerates...is it actually regenerating each tick during the ticks, or once the timer reachs full it bumps my Maximum HAM back to 1000 from 975 and then my action poor has to progress back up there on it's own? I just don't understand the seperate timers...and whether or not when the timer reachs full your get your HAM back or you just get the maximum allowed back. If you get the HAM back, then specials with a good enough weapon would cost nothing...if it just increases the maximum back to normal, people could still use stimpacks, could they not?

Once weaponsmiths get the efficiency experimentation fixed, we can actually use points to lower HAM's drammatically...making it even more worth while because someone can just spam their specials and not have to worry about it all?

I could actually gain my action back faster than I was losing it if I used a weapon with low enough HAM's, making specials cost nothing at all? I'm not really sure I trust SWG to get this all correct...seems like a lot of work to fix a simple request.

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1. Added to-hit bonus for melee vs. rangedweapon attacks

This is a replacement for the damage multipliers and a sub-feature for the damage mitigation addition (detailed below). If you use a ranged weapon against a melee combatant, you will be easier to hit.

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Does anyone else think this is a kinda poor tradeoff in PvP? If you can catch up to a marksman, instead of doing extra damage to them, brawlers now only get a greater chance to hit? I have never had any trouble hitting marksmen anyway, so now instead of a say a 85% chance of hitting them, I will get a 95% chance or something?

I agree with this... Holding a rifle to your chest makes you a prime target for gaderiffi through the ribcage, and i loved this feature, it meant if we could get close enough we could win. But now.. Well whats the point? None of us have any problem hitting them as it is!

Otherwise, all good. Nice work, and well written Raphayl, I actually understood it.

They are changing alot of creatures and NPC's on test to have a "larger" range, so mitigation can be more effective...The ATST is a good example...

It used to do 1240-1250 damage (I think)

It now does 700 ish-1250.........

I am guessing all creatures are having thier minimum damage lowered, or thier max raised, to the mitigation changes can be effective...

so basically what we are going to have to do is stat migrate all of our secondaries back in the health, action, and mind bars because now they don't really matter anymore, our health is going to go down to 200 get hit by a bounty hunter with some normal shot and poof we're gone with our 100/250/50 HAM bars, this is like getting temporary black rot that takes 25 seconds to go away, but 25 seconds is along time against a ranged opponent you need to catch up to ... oh well i will wait and see how it is before i say wether i like it or not, it just isn't sounding too appealing at the moment

Thought I might as well mention that the red ribbons on specials have been changed, they are now white streaked trails that create a wind like appearance. There are some variations in this as I fought a mob using a Vibroaxe and the trail on it had a red tinge to it.

I've been trying out the new system over on Test. I like it!!! Even as a Master Doc, I like it!!! Rumors as to this system's suckiness have been greatly exagerated.

What most people fail to notice is that in the old system, specials damaged all your stats, including the unhealable mind stat. You slowly killed yourself if you used specials. Now, that doesn't happen. You don't whittle down your mind. I tried spamming myself to death without armor and I failed. I just couldn't do it. Mind you, I'm only a brawler on Test, so these are not universal observations.

I also find this system mildly more intuitive.

What this system really does is encourage the pacing of specials, rather than the spamming of specials. For short fights, you can going in, both guns blazing. For longer fights, you need to use a different tactic. That's not bad.

Dr. Vema Gara

What i dont like is the fact that you dont get the health back either way. For someone who does not have a doctor with them, or a medic for that matter, this will not help them unless their damage is below what their current max is.. and if your wearing armour that wont happen much.

Now I suppose equilibrium wont work either?

Good job Raphayl,

It all sounds good. I trust that you have it all under control and will bring back to the Devs things that they should consider. Thanks for taking all this time to do this. I am sure it is very time consuming. Very good job.

the new ham-system does not seem to work as advertised in this thread. as far as i have noticed a special move will always reduce maximum and actual ham (even if actual ham is lower than the maximum).

i tried this out in a quite simple test. i have made a new marksman, picked up medic as second profession. then i went to a mob, used medical forage a few times to damage my action pool. after that i opened my character screen to see the numbers. when i used overcharge shot1 on the mob, my action pool definitely dropped - but i couldnt tell how much it dropped (and it did not drop because the mob hit me).

so one could say that in the new system the special moves take away a portion of your ham bars from the left side of the bars, returning it after a short time.

now using spice to switch off natural regeneration (ie. choose a stat migration so that during a spice-downer you secondary stats are very close to zero) would allow much more accurate tests.

Hmm... well that's not the way it was described, and I must admit that I have tried taking advantage of some of the holiday and haven't had the chance to fully test this out. However, I will tomorrow at the latest. If it appears to work as you have said then I'll be discussing it with the Developers. If it indeed does work as you say, then the entire point of the new changes are lost.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention.

Message Edited by Raphayl on 11-28-2003 06:34 PM

Hmm, From my testing of a new character on TC, your HAM costs explanation does follow what ive seen. I'm a rifleman and I was using some of the info you give to give some examples on the rifle forum. While I was doing it, i think I found a general forumula which would give an idea on how much continious (> 25) special attacks would costs. From what I know about the system, it will eventually stablized as you get past 25.

(Cost of attack * 25) / (2 * speed of attacks)

I used an example of 100 mind costs at 1 attack per second.

(100*25)/(2*1)= 1250. After you hit reach 25 seconds, if you continue doing the same attacks, you will be using the costs of the attack but getting back 1/25 of the previous 25 shots (if attacking at 1 per second).

According to how the ham costs and the regneration are subtracted/addedto the -modifiers, this could change +/- 100. If the attacks are not once per second, the limit will change between attacks, but should not go over the limit.(unless the +/- 100)

I've not tested these numbers on TC yet, as I dont have a character high enough to run this test. But from Raphayl's post, this is a good guess how the HAM should cost. If one of you higher lvl players could test it out on a long kill, please let me know if these numbers follow your example. Go try killing the new 300k hitpoint krayts.

--Rorrimot