Fencer Archive

Personally, a Fencer should be fast and accurate and have access to more BLADED weapons. I know that most professions need more weapons and more damage styles (energy sword anyone). I loved the post dealing with different stances/styles, perhaps one to increaes dodge and the other increase accuracy. Plus, the Equilibruim reference, if we could fight like the Grammaton(sp) Clerics did in the three sword fight sequences, it would cry nerf even though I would love to own an opponents face at the end of PVP.

Some up- different weapon damage
Stances- great variety

1. differentiate between fencers, pikes, tka, and swordsman.

-tka: best against humanoids, and generally basic damage wise, with advanced and specific specials

-pike: best against large creatures, high damage, with more basic specials

-sword: best against mutiple creatures, high damage, basic specials

-FENCER: best againstONE creature,medium damage, lots of specific low-ham specials. This is deffinetly the class you want to be to solo a nightsister. The majority of specials should be non-AOE. (Of course there should be AOE specials, but hey should be basic) This should include damage, counterattack, blocks, parrys bonus when in melee with only one enemy, as enemyies swarm the bonus and damagedecreases. Same with COB... Now the point isnt to gimp fencers against multiple opponents, they will still do fine, but there needs to be specific differences between all the mele classes.

2. Address kiting issues.

-a nice special would be a short-lived burst run that takes action ham, and can be done repeatedly or every 30 sec, meant to close to the target. Maybe this special adds bonus to "posture down" when implimented.

3. Address weapons, and certs... (sample weapons)

-it would be nice to have an array of weapon damage type, that way we could affect advanced mobs. All weaps should be useful or desired by different players styles.

- sword 120-150 30/20/20 spd:2.4 kinetic

-curved sword 70-200 15/35/20 spd: 2.5 kinetic

-vibroblade ap1 70-150 10/10/10 spd:1.8 kinetic

- ryyk blade ap1 50-180 30/30/20 spd:3 energy

-gaffi stick 120-220 50/20/15 spd: 3.5 kinetic

-rantok blade ap 2 100-200 40/15/30 spd: 3 kinetic

-stun baton ap1 60-130 15/35/25 spd: 2.5 stun

NEW: vibro saber ap1 80-180 15/15/15 spd 2.2 elec (get this at novice fencer)

NEW: mono-filiment whip ap3 60-160 10/15/25 spd 2 kinetic range ideal +10

4. Specials:

-disarm: opponent cannot use a wep for 10 secs

-stab: opponeont has increased ham usage when using specials30 secs

-stick: opponent cannot run for 10 secs

-issue challange: the fencer questions the honor of the opponent, causing it to attack the fencer

-stun

-duelist focus (like cob works for a length of time) it increases the block/counter attack/parry/dodge against the single target being attacked by the fencer

5. Group Role:

- to take on the most single baddest enemy, and hold it up, or keep it from damaging friends, while they handle the rest, and to quickly pick off enemies that are swarming friends

6. Duel Wield:

- at a certain level the ability to use one weapon in each hand. The second will not be used for weapons, but will attack at the wielders speed doing normal damage.

7. PvP Role:

-disrupt the enemy by displaying a presence to take on anyone in a one vs one situation. This would make them reorient their tatics by having to shoot the fencer, or take more players to help out. However the mods for fighting multi-targets at once, and for fighting one vs one be reduced in pvp.

8. Notes:

- i really like the anti-light saber sword idea, or a sword that fencers could use to block ranged energy attacks

- it would be nice to have some sort of defence against force powers, like choke, and flying debris

What should be special or unique about Fencers that set them apart from the other 3 melee professions?

Each profession should have a certain amount of culture toit. I think it would be great if there were special clothing designed just for fencers. Something fanciful, to give us that musketeer look (can you say "silly hats"?). Furthermore, we need more ornamented weapons, a larger variety of shapes for swords. And a more incremental system of dealing out certifications. The better you get, the more you can handle special weapons. Also, since fencing is a finesse approach at battling, it has elements of what we currently attribute only to rangers. A fencer knows the weaknesses of animals, and understands the anatomy of the human body as well. Therefore, they should be allotted some sort of "critical hit" or "sweet spot" type of ability. A rare critical hit could result in an absurd magnification of the normat hit. Kind of like famous cliche of the lone swordsman taking down a dragon (let me reiterate, extremely rare).

What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks?

This is pretty good as is.

What kind or style of weapons would you like to see Fencers use?

More swords of varying color and shape. Maybe swords that can have optional special ingredients to give them more of an tone of specialization (EX: A krayt scale improves ability against krayts, bile on the sword may poison people occasionally) Maybe some swords that offer more of an extreme variation of encumbrances). A light sword may damage quickly but cost hardly any HAM. Maybe even allow weapon powerups that provide temporary increases in blinding, stunning, knockdown, poison, etc..

Do you have ideas for how future certifications should be spread out?

How bout winning some special swords by doing special missions. Everybody loves the feeling of finding that special mystical item, or being honored with a gift for completing a special mission. And not some junky Rantok #$@#.

What kind of group role should a Fencer typically serve?

Tanker with a twist of sudden immaculate skill!

What should be special or unique about Fencers that set them apart from the other 3 melee professions?

our speed. Our weapons dont do damage like the rest, and for a while, we may be able to hold our own, but once we reach that speed cap, we not only become like the rest of the population, but we also lose our force given rights to being one of, if not the fastest professions in the game in regards to attacking.

What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks?

"basic flavor" hmm this I think would be the VERY unique fighting style that we all have grown to love and enjoy watching. The flairs to me arent that special, everyone has them, just different, but the actual style our animations for our specials sets us apart. I brag alot about that, I love this aspect. I am a fencer, its about style, not substance =)

What kind or style of weapons would you like to see Fencers use?

I think we could do with more edged weapons, while Fencer in regards to SOE was taken from a conglomeration of different one handed fighting styles, swords are by far the best looking and most interesting weapon, at least in my opinion. Theres just something about the sword that makes people think "oh wow, he/she has a sword" and especially in SWG, where the main attraction is the gun, a sword wielder is close to non-existant, which also adds more to our flare =)

Do you have ideas for how future certifications should be spread out?

I think the gaffi stick should be moved up further into the tree, and the stun baton be removed from its high rank at novice fencer and moved into the 1h brawler area. Id also like to see an addition of other "fencing" type of weapons, and maybe adda florentine style of fencing into maybe novice or master. Not to outbalance our profession, but to allow us to get more of that DPS from our speed, so we can at least be on par with the other melee classes

What kind of group role should a Fencer typically serve?

first or second line tank. We are more defensive than any of the other professions, we get hit less, thus take less damage.

What kind of battlefield (mass PvP) role should a Fencer hold?

this one is hard to outline, since I view fencers as more of the soloists. Not saying they arent good in mass BF or GCW fights, but as a fencer, I dont think we should get any type of ability that will allow us to aid our comrads other than us being there, thats what the squad leader was built for, leave everything group related to them

What kind of HAM cost dispersal should a Fencer's weapon typically have?

alot less, a TKA doesnt even take up as much Ham cost as we do. I havent looked at the other weapons yet, but if my memory as a weaponsmith serves me right, other weapons have a lesser ratio to ham cost over damage than we do with our fencing weapons.

What kind of utilities would you like to see Fencer's have?

i love our bleed, and i like how it works, with the no damage up front and damage later, gives it a sense of realism. We are a maneuvers based class, yet most of our attacks arent maneuvers based. We have no knockdown unless we decide to go master brawler, even the pistoleer has a knockdown...isnt getting shot in the kneecap the same as getting sliced on the achilies heal? hehe I think we need more maneuvers based moves. Maybe an attack that slows down an opponents run speed for a very very short time, (name it hamstring)

But I would really like to see our DPS fixed and a cool way to fix that is to add a second weapon to our hand, i dont know, just a thought =)

Dodge Animation: The dodge Animation needs to be more Dynamic: Flipping, Spinning, Twistingand Rolling without actually stopping completly. When i run up to fight a mob and i actually dodge like the first 3 hits. I don't want to jump back 10 feet i wanna flip and Twist up in that shyt while im still attacking. Make it actually look like im dodgingand fighting at the same time, (yes im talking about some Matrix type crap, im not talking about all the slowed downcrap and sittin in the air for 20 seconds) im talking about the actually dodging and fighting at the same time and actually style that a fencer(the master of the one handed weapon)would have in battle against mutiple targets and single targets as well... And with saying that let me take you into my next idea

Dodge Attacks: Yes Dodge attacks, this mean that when you do a dodge attack Special u automaticly dodge the next upcoming attack, and you get one of these tight animations, not that you have to do a dodge attack special to get one of the animations, you just get a better one with more dmg when you use a dodge Attack Speical...

Weapon Selection: I don't think the master of one handed weapons is only going to have one type of sword to choose from... The Curve sword should be actually curved.. they should look different, i don't care if they all do the same dmg, i just want to have a sword that looks good and a variety to chose from..I would love to see the Gaffi and Curved sword stats switched by the way.

New Era of Fencers: Jedi's are starting to pop up now and i think its time for Elite Proffesions also, as well as other professions than Fencer. Note this part is notnecessarily about fencers and i know what the title of this thread butthis isto helpBrawler proffesions alike. No im not talking about a fencer that can go toe to toe with a jedi master but how about 3 or 4that could? Pistoleer Dodge can stack right now with fencers, how about instead of Nerfing it, lets make it an Elite Proffesion and buff it up a bit and lets give them the Title Fencer Elite... How about a Fencer dat can Duel Wield? He is the master of one handedweapons so why not have two... Ofcourse that means he will lose some accruacy stats and ham cost and other things for that but it would be cool..And i know giving us Elite Proffesion wouldnt be fare to all the other brawler proffesions, but i know the people in the TKA Thread can come up with something (Off Topic Example), how about a TKA artist that could go into different stances, like Shaolin, master arts of movements like Tiger, Leopard, Dragon, Snake and Crane necessary for both health and self defense.

More Specials: I would like to see more fantastic specials that are just beautiful to watch. How a special that is specific and can be done onlywith the weapon you have chosen at the time.. A special for the curved sword types, a special for gaffitypesand stun baton. Notice i said types because im hoping we get a more variety of these types of weapons to choose from. The same old curved sword and gaffi gets old.....

Shields. Gungan shields. All kinds of shields.

I'd like to see different 'reactive' animations against different attacks. Such as combat equilibrium against Force knockdown, for example. TheFencer is thrown ontothe ground, butperforms a backward roll and springs backonto his feet, a few meters away from the Jedi using the power. For Knockdown Defense against F. Knockdown, the character appears to lose his balance for a moment, but quickly regains his footing, ready to fight. Against a Teras Kasi Artist using Spitting Rawl (that *is* the attack that involves the TKA twirling around and kicking three times, right?), assuming the attack hits but it doesn't knock the Fencer down, the Fencer performs a flourish of dodges, avoiding the first two kicks, but being hit by the last one.

Of course, I could go on forever with this. This is certainly not on the top of my priority list, but I'm so sick of the generic MMORPG combat flavor: two combatants smacking each other around with generic swings and thrusts until one of them dies. Sure, SWG has very cool-looking special attacks, but the opponent of the character using them offers no reaction other than a slight reel. I'd simply like combat to be more exhilarating and dramatic. I can only see Cho Mok being performed in rapid succession so many times. Adding different music compositions would be a nice touch, too. Perhaps different music will be played depending on whether you're fighting a player, a Jedi, an NPC or a really big creature. All these bells and whistles get old eventually, but there should be different animations for different professions against different attacks, so there's enough variety, especially in PvP, to keep the tension high.

Yeah, yeah... none of this is gonna happen. I don't care! Let me have my dreams!

Rosar Lightingwave, Blademaster

• What should be special or unique about Fencers that set them apart from the other 3 melee professions?
  With a simple word defense, where other melee characters make up for this in brute strenght and toughness we make up for in defense.
  
• What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks?
  Less AoE attacks, more delay/boost moves. boosting defense dodge with cost to ham, or delay ourselves with boost to defense.
  
• What kind or style of weapons would you like to see Fencers use?
  For gods sake more swords. Less sticks i hate going into battle with a cattle prod
  
• Do you have ideas for how future certifications should be spread out?
  Currently it really doesnt matter what order since all of the weapns do the same thing with the exception of stun baton. IF and that is a big if they balanced weapons out to do more types of attacks maybe something like this
  Brawler line: Novice - Dagger, Combat Knife
  1st Box- Sword
  2nd box- nothing
  3rd box - Quest item rantok sword
  4th box - nothing
  Fencer tree Novice - Rykk Blade
  1st Box:Nothing1st Box:Vibro Blade 1st Box: Nothing 1st Box: Gaf Baton
  2nd Box:Nothing2nd BoxNothing2nd BoxNothing2nd Box:Quest Weapon
  3rd Box: Stun Baton 3rd Box: Nothing 3rd box: New Weapon 3rd Box: Nothing:
  4th box ALL -Mission for quest schematic part ( 4 parts )
  Master - Schematic to assemble quest item. ( parts from 4th box plus resources ):
  
• What kind of group role should a Fencer typically serve?
  Delaying Mob or NPC, and defending others.
  
• What kind of battlefield (mass PvP) role should a Fencer hold?
  Drawing atention to himself of the masses, defense of strategic locations, medics and such
  
• What kind of HAM cost dispersal should a Fencer's weapon typically have?
  Very little, should be less damageing and faster ( or not allowing 1 sec cap to other proffesions ) very very very little HAM. Where we should use up our HAM cost is in new defesive moves and delay moves. Not in our attacks
  
• What kind of utilities would you like to see Fencer's have?
  Not sure on this one, dont really know what u mean

most has been said already. But i do have some thoughts of my own

Weapons


Reduction of the speed cap. my Gaffi is 3.5 speed. when i apply the speed formula my default attacks are 1.18 thats with only master brawler and expert foot work (+65 speed?) at master foot work we get +20 to speed witch would throw me WAY past the cap for default attacks.(dig up the blade dancer thread great thoughts on this elite elite)


Craftable rantok swords. master fencer Cert, I love how the rantok looks but you can ONLY get it via jabbas palace and thats only if you steal it. craftable rantoks would of course (hopefully ) be better than the One from jabbas



i think its absurd that the gaffi is our (best) weapon. grated you can have a gaffi that is 300+ damage but the ham is crazy. I personaly would preffer a lower damage weapon,with AP possably with another damage type. Yes we have stun witch i love but i rarly use it outside of PvP. seldom do encounter a MoB that has high enuff kintic resists to warrent use of my stun. even then 50%+ kinetic mobs tend to have stun resist also. an idea would to give the stun AP1 although that may seem over powered in PvP. A 200 damage weapon that no one has resist to + 50% damage, it could get ugly.

ohh yea ... umm swords for fencers? what a novel idea, wait no i use a gaffi 99.9% of the time. if you have played jedi academy gaffi sticks are 3 times bigger honest.


Graphics



i realy like the idea of a jedi like block Vs ranged weapons. At least just graphicaly. If you block hits the blaster shot shoots off in to oblivian.

i also would like the addition of a non-combat flourish. if you have ever entered a duel and just stood there in combat mode. you toss your weapon back and forth from hand to hand. Looks super cool. expanding on this we could have a full fledge fourish. possably a Practice mode. IE /fencerpractice. then you can spam you comabat moves to show of. no ham cost ECT. would focourse include a command such as /stoppractice ,and as soon as you enter combat you cue emptys and you exit practice mode


Combat.

like every one i would love to see a reduction of HAM cost.
possably keep our wepons main ham cost in the same freaking pool. Gaffi hit your health, Stun batons eat your mind for breakfast (no good at all in PvP)




other than that ... its been said .. or retstated by me.. take care

What should be special or unique about Fencers that set them apart from the other 3 melee professions?

They should be the fastest and the best and AVOIDING attack not "tanking" in the conventional sense, less hits thus less damage...

What should be the "basic flavor" of Fencer special attacks?

This is a hard question I prefer the swashbuckler type of flair but I also know that there are equivilant styles in othere cultures, (in the Movie "The Princess Bride: the Dread Pirate Roberts and the Spaniard Indigo Montoya are both different but also we need to see more Princes of Persia with the big One handed curved blade *can you say Indiana Jones?*) there are also Japanese and Chinese one handed items and styles...
My preference is the western swashbuckler from europe in the lat 1400's.
BUT... Maybe the weapons should decide the flavor, like a big curved sword should have moves and specials that take on a persian air, while a wakisashi (Japanese one handed blade) would have Japanese flavor and finally the sword or rapier should have a European look (swashbuckler anyone?).

What kind or style of weapons would you like to see Fencers use?

Swords, swords and more swords...ALL makes ALL models, European, Japanese, Chinese, Persian and heck why not even Aztech weaponry... Nuff said

Do you have ideas for how future certifications should be spread out?

On that, more complex weapons means better fencer. For example a longsword is fairly basic as is a shortsword, but a rapier and a main gauche are mush harder to be effective with, if you were to use a rapier like a longsword you would soon find yourself weaponless as it would bend or break unter the slashing impacts.

What kind of group role should a Fencer typically serve?

Second line of defense and/or retreat coverage. Let me explain: Like in foot ball the middle linebackers, a lot faster but not near as tough. As for retreat coverage, if only the big guys are left to cover they are dead... but a fencer is fast of foot AND movement so he can use delaying tactics to slow the enemy while friends escape and then have a better chance of escaping themselves using those same tactics.

What kind of battlefield (mass PvP) role should a Fencer hold?

All I have to say on that is "stick and move". Simple hit and run tactics with minor crowd control.

What kind of HAM cost dispersal should a Fencer's weapon typically have?

On that I am under the impression that fencers do not get tired... have you ever saw a movie where the fencer is swaeting and panting? I have not so I am focusing on action costs and maybe some mind costs for less conmbaty moves like maybe an insult line (angers the opponant and maybe makes them easier to hit or takes away from center of being ("You are to angry to concentrate right now.") other than that I cannot comment.

What kind of utilities would you like to see Fencer's have?

Well, I am not sure what you mean by utilities but I will assume you mean specials.

*Insult: angers opponant, makes it harder to concentrate thus reducing defence and to hit but does more damage if they do hit, or does not allow concentration moves like CoB, Aim or meditate for a short time...

*Blinding: A cut across the eyes for example...

*Painful cut: A cut in a place that hurts alot thus reducing any dodging speeds and slows the enemy for a short time (similar to the trap that causes pain for scouts).

*Impressive move: cause the opponant to pause in awe for a couple seconds (maybe 3 or 5)

I do realize that some of these could not effect animals or noninteligent beings but this class is one that came up from human warfare not survival hinting so more moves should be geared for humanoids and intelligent beings.

Otica (the wookiee with the most)
MAW Industries
(Intrepid galaxy: 4660 -3545 Moenia, Naboo)
First Wookiee
"YES, I AM a yeti, and I AM from Yavin 4"

Master Artisan
Brawler 4/1/0/0
Medic 0/0/0/3
Marksman 0/4/0/0
Scout 4/0/4/0
Smuggler 0/0/0/4
Creature Handler 1/2/1/1

1. I personally do want more animations of any type. Not unless I can be guaranteed they won't cause delays in combat.

2. Speed- both in terms of offense and defense. This is, imo, one of the mostdistinguishing characteristics of a Fencer, yet we certainly donot stand out to any degree with respect to this.

3. Special Utilities -- we should have a greater chance atevading fire/poison/disease type damage.

4. Role in PvP - Hard to assign us a role in a battlefield. PvP is just too chaotic, and we are too easily picked off by kiting when closing a large distance (even with COB - spamming mind shots (while the COB drains mind) makes us easy pickings). Battle in close quarters is another thing entirely. That's where we shine. If the Devs are determined to move PvP into the battlefields, they need a way to allow us to close large distances without our mind being shot to hell.

5. Weapons- Definitely rapier. Small battle axes that could be duel wielded. NO FOILS FOR THE LOVE OF GOD.Bladed weaponsthat do acid/heat/bast damage as we have discussed in the past. Flamberge (here's a picture-- the curve in the blade could be exaggerated for appearance's sake)

http://www.thesteelsource.com/html/mr1526.htm

Scimitar. One handed scythe. Russian Kindjal ( http://store.yahoo.com/greatsword/russiankindjal.html)

Small swords/court swords.

6. Our specials should continue to work as they already do -- decreasing the damage that an opponent does to us, allowing us the time to wear them down.

7. Weapon HAM costs. Mind absolutely, positively, must be the lowest. Our minds are the most vulnerable. Other professions have the advantage of being able to target our mind pools specifically (while we do not). We have to make more strikesto do an equal amount of damage as say a 2 handed sword.... exposing our minds to their targeted attacks for a proportionally longer period of time that our opponent's mind is exposed to our UNTARGETED scatter shot. Add to that the increased HAM costs because we must hit MORE to deal out the same amount of damage. ALL HAM costs should be lower because of the way we have to win a fight (more frequent hits over a longer period of time).

Seena

oops number 1 should read:

I personally do NOT want more animations of any type.

Seena

My 2 Cents:

Fencer Skills:

Dual Wield - But only a smaller weapon with a larger one or two small weapons.

Dual Wield - A buckler shield, remember the Gungan shields in Episode 1? Smaller versions of those.

Dual Wield - Pistol/Sword. This would be a new Hybrid Profession = Master Fencer + Master Marksman = Swashbuckler

--------------------

Fencer Speed:

Drop our speedcap or raise everyone elses.

Dashing Run -Not as long as burst, but able to use a few times. This will help against kiters.

---------------------

Fencer Attacks:

Disarm- Plain and simple

Weapon Parry - A COB type effect where you deal no damage but can defend all incoming attacks for 10 seconds.

Weapon Break - Only PvP or PvE against other Ihanded/2handed/polearm combatants.

---------------------

Fencer Fun Stuff:

Scabbards - Poison scabbard, sharpening scabbard, etc.

Sheathing Animations

--------------------

Fencer Weapons:

Stiletto, Saber, Rapier, Vibro+ any and all current swords, and most importantly ..... LIGHTFOIL from Expanded Universe

Thanks for your hard work Raph,

The32ndGuru

Naimad Sotnas

Bloodfin