Entertainer Archive

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Thunderheart wrote:

7. Do you feel that it is acceptable that the role of entertainers is being completely filled by people impersonating NPCs, leaving those who play the class with nothing to do? Do you plan to do anything about this, such as an auto-logout or making healing a more active process?

We understand the nature of this issue. In essence, we can’t prevent AFK people from playing, but one thing we are doing is looking at different ways we can encourage at-the-keyboard play.

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NinjasLovePirates wrote:
The alternate to AFK is ATK. You can be either At The Keyboard or Away From Keyboard. Also, you can be logged in or logged out. If your problem was that they were logged in, then you've got a different problem altogether than AFKers (you want this game all to yourself).

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MatBrown wrote:

In reading about the Cantina Shakedowns, I thought there were going to help address this. I seem to recall reading somewhere that when the Stormtroopers came in to shakedown the cantina and started hassling people, that they would open fire unless they got a response. I was looking forward to this going Live and the first time I walked into a recently shakendown cantina, the floor littered with the bodies of the AFK Entertainers, leaving only the Real Entertainers still standing. Did I misunderstand the Cantina Shakedowns? And if so, is there any chance of getting them to work this way?

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You see Karquile, I'm not concerned about making weaponsmith money, I'm concerned about making ANY money. Because when you get right down to it, AFK dancers and musicians are SUPERIOR in every way in a game mechanics sense to a live player, and there is no way we can prove otherwise. They work 24/7. They can heal. They can buff. And the biggest selling point is that you can stiff them and not feel bad, because nobody will know or care. Now tell me. What if I were to tell you that you had to somehow buy everything you need by selling your weapons, when 90% of the weapons produced on your server are simply given away, perpetually available, and are every bit as good as the best weapons you could make? There'd be no reason to buy from you, yes? And what would your argument be? It would be its not fair that some are able to get the same benefit from not working as hard. The same advice you gave me to get out and do missions to "earn a living" would be the same argument that would be leveled at you. This is what is happening to our professions RIGHT NOW, and nobody seems to care.

Now, the biggest insult I have heard from you and numerous others concerning my profession is that I should go out to the mission terminals and get a "real job." However, while you may not realize it, my entertainment profession IS MY WORK! Its not like I go out in front of the Coronet Starport and spam "give me credits." I work just as hard at being a good entertainer as you probibly craft, or a pistolieer shoots, and believe me, the ones that really take this profession seriously will tell you that entertaining well is HARD work, and I never needed a gimmick name like Ima Skankyho to do it, either. Let's see you juggle ten different conversations at one time, while trying to be attentive, cordial, funny, and respectful to each and EVERY one. Like a good improvisational actor, it takes practice to be good at it. Now, does this hard work show up in the game mechanics? Of course not. However, it doesn't mean we don't work hard to make your stay in the cantina enjoyable.

Logically, economically, there is no reason for the people on the servers to seek out live entertainment, because unattended entertainment is just so much more available and costs NOTHING. The appeals we have to the player base is not logical, I admit. We appeal to a sense of aesthetics, social content, and fairness. And the main point is this: That having a person giving you the dignity of being at the keyboard; looking at you through the monitor; and acknowleging your existance in the virtual world SHOULD BE VALUED. That's all. Currently, most people treat us as trash, merely as an NPC resource that can be utilized and abandoned at THEIR pleasure, the entertainer notwithstanding. You say that I should just do missions then, but dear, if I'm spending all my time doing missions outside of the cantina, why even do entertainer in the first place? Why even have an entertainer class? Sure, I'm good at it. Sure, I enjoy it. But how can I compete with a 24/7 buffbot who doesn't charge for services? Its impossible.

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PoetDancer wrote:
I'm not concerned about making weaponsmith money, I'm concerned about making ANY money.

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I think it was sweatyclimber thatsaid she makes 100k per hour selling buffs. Sounds like good money to me. You and all the other poor entertainers must be doing something wrong.

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PoetDancer wrote:
I never needed a gimmick name like Ima Skankyho

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LOL

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Tiaga wrote:

You misunderstand me.

If someone does things AFK, by definition, they only do it when they are not playing, correct? Most people still play the same amount, and use AFK to fill the time they aren't playing with advancement or a service. The exception would be mules used as heal bots which wouldn't otherwise be played. But in either case, it is a time when the character wouldn't normally be played. AFK is something you do instead of logging out, not something you do instead of playing ATK.

To illustrate this point, lets look at Johnny. He gets to play 4 hours a day. So every day, he longs in, plays for four hours, then logs out. He decided he wanted to be a combat medic. So he starts grinding through to master medic. By the time he's done with it he's convinced it's an awful grind. He starts on range support, and when he gets up to range support 3 he decided to help his friend who is working towards doctor. So now instead of logging out, he sets up a tumble macro for his buddy. He still only has 4 hours a day to play. But now he plays for 4 hours, then sets his macro up and stays logged in for another 10 hours. He is still ATK just as much. The AFK time is replacing logged out time. Thus, the alternative to AFK is logged out. They are the two choices you have when you are not playing.

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this thread has become pointless to read... its just the same old afk debate when it was suposed to be questions and answers from the devs... problem is we all expected rebutle from the dev's and they being as out of touch with us as they are figured if they half @ss answered some questions for us then they could leave us alone.This being the case they might as well ignore the musician and dancer ones because if there is no give and take then its not really a discussion. If there is no discussion, nothing will be done. So lets just cut the crap because its obvious that they were just an exersise of time... I wish they had just said they didnt have time to answer them cause they were working on other professions and wanted to get done with those before spending time on ours cause at least that way maybe maybe in a few years they would get around to us... at the pace they seem to work on proffesions the time it took for them to answer these just cost us 3 more months delayed...

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PoetDancer wrote:
Now, the biggest insult I have heard from you and numerous others concerning my profession is that I should go out to the mission terminals and get a "real job." However, while you may not realize it, my entertainment profession IS MY WORK!

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I have no idea who told you to get a "real job" - it certainly wasn't me. I said run some missions. There are all kinds of professions out there where running missions is an occasional responsibility. Tailors do it to keep their factories running. Rangers do it to be able to afford good weapons. And so forth. Why should Entertainers be exempt?

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Its not like I go out in front of the Coronet Starport and spam "give me credits." I work just as hard at being a good entertainer as you probibly craft, or a pistolieer shoots, and believe me, the ones that really take this profession seriously will tell you that entertaining well is HARD work, and I never needed a gimmick name like Ima Skankyho to do it, either. Let's see you juggle ten different conversations at one time, while trying to be attentive, cordial, funny, and respectful to each and EVERY one. Like a good improvisational actor, it takes practice to be good at it. Now, does this hard work show up in the game mechanics? Of course not. However, it doesn't mean we don't work hard to make your stay in the cantina enjoyable.

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I'm sure this was lost somewhere in the thread, but I'm a Master Dancer (pre-holo, thank you) on Kauri, along with my other SWG careers. I know how the profession works. And I know that the above sounds like an outtake from the Golgafrinchan Telephone Sanitizers scene in Hitchhiker's Guide. "Let's see you juggle ten different conversations at one time," indeed!

Let me ask you a different question, since you're so concerned about the plight of the starving .

How do you think a Mayor makes money? I'm a Master Politician with a city of 116 citizens as of this morning. I don't make a dime. I probably juggle more conversations in the course of a day, and have to be "cordial" to more people, than you ever will. But if I want to buy a better robe, I have to get down off my little throne thingie and run some missions like anyone else.

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You say that I should just do missions then, but dear, if I'm spending all my time doing missions outside of the cantina, why even do entertainer in the first place? Why even have an entertainer class?

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Right, so now we know what the problem would be with you spending all your time doing missions. I wonder if there are any alternatives? Spending some of your time, perhaps? Maybe we should have a, meeting thingie, about that

Reading this thread it is obvious to me that the primary enemy of the entertainer is not the developers who have been ignoring us, but that portion of the player base that hates us and would like to see us disappear in favor of NPCs or the removal of the necessity of our services. We're vastly outnumbered. Achievers apparently don't want socializers in their game.

The developers are pretty much caught in the crossfire of a battle which they inadvertantly caused to erupt.

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Karquile wrote:

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PoetDancer wrote:
Now, the biggest insult I have heard from you and numerous others concerning my profession is that I should go out to the mission terminals and get a "real job." However, while you may not realize it, my entertainment profession IS MY WORK!

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I have no idea who told you to get a "real job" - it certainly wasn't me. I said run some missions. There are all kinds of professions out there where running missions is an occasional responsibility. Tailors do it to keep their factories running. Rangers do it to be able to afford good weapons. And so forth. Why should Entertainers be exempt?

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Its not like I go out in front of the Coronet Starport and spam "give me credits." I work just as hard at being a good entertainer as you probibly craft, or a pistolieer shoots, and believe me, the ones that really take this profession seriously will tell you that entertaining well is HARD work, and I never needed a gimmick name like Ima Skankyho to do it, either. Let's see you juggle ten different conversations at one time, while trying to be attentive, cordial, funny, and respectful to each and EVERY one. Like a good improvisational actor, it takes practice to be good at it. Now, does this hard work show up in the game mechanics? Of course not. However, it doesn't mean we don't work hard to make your stay in the cantina enjoyable.

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I'm sure this was lost somewhere in the thread, but I'm a Master Dancer (pre-holo, thank you) on Kauri, along with my other SWG careers. I know how the profession works. And I know that the above sounds like an outtake from the Golgafrinchan Telephone Sanitizers scene in Hitchhiker's Guide. "Let's see you juggle ten different conversations at one time," indeed!

Let me ask you a different question, since you're so concerned about the plight of the starving .

How do you think a Mayor makes money? I'm a Master Politician with a city of 116 citizens as of this morning. I don't make a dime. I probably juggle more conversations in the course of a day, and have to be "cordial" to more people, than you ever will. But if I want to buy a better robe, I have to get down off my little throne thingie and run some missions like anyone else.

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You say that I should just do missions then, but dear, if I'm spending all my time doing missions outside of the cantina, why even do entertainer in the first place? Why even have an entertainer class?

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Right, so now we know what the problem would be with you spending all your time doing missions. I wonder if there are any alternatives? Spending some of your time, perhaps? Maybe we should have a, meeting thingie, about that

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Elam,

I think the point of that original post was that every other proffession has ways to make money while doing their proffession. I am a mayor as well. I run a large city on tatooine. My city is very prosperous and I could if i wanted take pay. I could easly pay myself the cap/ day and no one would complain. We have gained 10mil in the treasury through taxes. Therefor in that profession, i can do my proffession and make money. At one point I was a crafter on the side. In that biz, i could simply craft to live. I have an alt who is a fighter. He fights to live. What the original poster was saying is if were entertaienrs, why cant we entertain to live. I don't have the same concerns, my entertainer makes hundreds of thousands of credits a week entertaining. However, most are not so lucky. As for juggling conversations, you should know that is work. As a PA leader, Mayor and famous entertainer; I for one will never say it isn't. Now to the point of the post. Why is it that everyother proffession can do their proffesion and make money yet the entertainers are expected to run missions which are set up for another proffesion? (you and i both know the 45-100cr) entertainer missions dont cut it.

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sweatyclimber wrote:

Elam,

I think the point of that original post was that every other proffession has ways to make money while doing their proffession. I am a mayor as well. I run a large city on tatooine. My city is very prosperous and I could if i wanted take pay. I could easly pay myself the cap/ day and no one would complain. We have gained 10mil in the treasury through taxes. Therefor in that profession, i can do my proffession and make money. At one point I was a crafter on the side. In that biz, i could simply craft to live. I have an alt who is a fighter. He fights to live. What the original poster was saying is if were entertaienrs, why cant we entertain to live. I don't have the same concerns, my entertainer makes hundreds of thousands of credits a week entertaining. However, most are not so lucky. As for juggling conversations, you should know that is work. As a PA leader, Mayor and famous entertainer; I for one will never say it isn't. Now to the point of the post. Why is it that everyother proffession can do their proffesion and make money yet the entertainers are expected to run missions which are set up for another proffesion? (you and i both know the 45-100cr) entertainer missions dont cut it.

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Last point first - no, I agree that the "Entertainer Mission Terminal" is a joke. I put one in my city just because people asked for it, but it's just a sand ornament. (Giving Entertainers some REAL missions or quests would be in my top 5 for the profession.) You have to get Pistol IV and do Surveys, or get Novice Art and do Vreni Island Crafters, to make steady mission money without major combat skills.

As for "every profession getting paid" - it's not really so. Squad Leaders don't get paid. Politicians don't get paid. (You can say that as a Mayor you could *take* pay, but there's no formal pay mechanism, you have to withdraw from the treasury, every citizen is emailed about it, and few cities can afford to make their Mayors rich - most Mayors I know get their money by other means, or just rely on their top crafters and looters to give them what they need.) Arguably Combat Medics don't get paid except by informal agreement with their huntmates.

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly in favor of Dancers and Musicians getting paid for their legitimately performed services. I *am* a Dancer. But I do not think that "running ten conversations at once" is a legitimate service within the game that needs to be paid for, and I also do not think that you'd ever be able to pay Master performers on a scale comparable to some of their fellow Masters in other professions without turning the game on its ear.

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Karquile wrote:The only thing I don't much like is the buffbot. I think they should modify /setperf so that you must supply a performer name (perhaps abbreviated). That way you can't set autojoin and macro loop Ctrl+2, /setperf, /pause, etc.

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For once, I can agree with you. If an unattended performer can heal you, buff you, be on 24 hours a day, and does not care if you tip them or not, then people like me will be relics.