Droid Engineer Archive

Thread: Almost enough to make you quit

Straker_Atrella
Wed Sep 15, 2004 2:01 am
#1

Be warned. Don't use Vendors for resource storage. Here is what happened to me.


I'm a Master Merchant as well as a MDE. Since i have been running low on storage space, it was my "genius" idea to move my stuff onto storage vendors, since I am well below my Merchant cap.


So tonightI started doing that.


Dropped my resource dispenser vendor in my workshop, initialized it, then put osme maint in it, to get it rolling. I then left my house, to go to my bank I think. Well when I came back, my vendor was facing the origional direction, before I had rotated it. Yet it was still initialized. Perturbed, I deleted it, then placed another, inititialized it again, as well as set it up again.


Cautious, I waited about 2 hours, before I put anything on it. It appeared to be operating normally. So then I started to move resources onto it. After a little while, I remembered I had soem Harvsa to move, so went to do that.


After I came back, the vendor was totally gone. Everything else in the house loaded and was visible, just not that vendor, my crate vendor was still there. In fact, I am able to look on my crate vendor and see my resources still for sale. I can even withdraw themfrom sale from my crate vendor, yet after they go to my stockroom, I get a "you cannot retrieve that item now" message.


I did put in a bug report, but can't put in a CSR ticket because for the past 2 hours, it still says I am "searching" the knowledge base. I have a pretty bad feeling that I am hosed. SOE doesn't usually give items back, even if it is their bug that ate them.


So be warned.


I feel sick.



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Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Atan
Wed Sep 15, 2004 2:29 am
#2

Maybe it is just a zoning issue and it will reappear soon?


As for the CSR's, they usually dont reimburse stuff from deleted/lost Vendor,

but yours still seems to be there, just not visible...


So bug the CSR's till they do something


MfG

Atan




Infinity:
Atan Schmitz (Retired Master Droid Engineer, whatever SOE calls him)
Traal (Bounty Hunter, 13 confirmed Kills)
Currently looking into renewing my Subscription.
It is tentavely scheduled for Publish 29, but it might be pushed back to "soon"©

Straker_Atrella
Wed Sep 15, 2004 2:42 am
#3

If it was a zoning issue, the rest of my house wouldn't be loaded from what I understand.


I agree with the not visible thing. That is exactly what it looks like. The bad thing is that you cna see the packs, but not the resources that are inside them. I'm really hoping they can check some logs to see what is inside them, otherwise I'm sucking.


Can't really bug the CSR's if they wont let you put a ticket in.



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Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Straker_Atrella
Wed Sep 15, 2004 2:48 am
#4

The worst thing is Server shutdown is in an hour. I guess I can hope that it fixes the problem. More then likely with my luck, the items which are still visible on my other vendor will disappear though.



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Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Malitevv
Wed Sep 15, 2004 3:25 am
#5







Straker_Atrella wrote:

If it was a zoning issue, the rest of my house wouldn't be loaded from what I understand.






I don't know if "zoning issue" is the right word, but what you describe has happenned to me with items a couple of times. If I drop an item in a house and then immediately log off, and then log back in, when I return to the house, I will sometimes find that all the items in the house will be visible to me except for the new item that I just placed. I don't know if logging off and back in has anything to do with it, but just saying that these are the circumstances under which it usually happens to me. When it happens to me with items, the item always reappears after the next server maintenance cycle and never sooner than that.


I have never had it happen with vendors though, and even if the bug that causes it is completely innocous with regard to items, it could potentially be damaging when it happens to vendors. About that I have no idea. /shudder.



In truth, this issue usually happens to me when I am trying to transfer items between two accounts by dropping an item into a building and then immediately switching to my second account to retrieve the item. When I do that, I sometimes discover that when I arrive at the building with the new account, the item is not there. The item will then be invisible to me and everyone until the next server maintenance cycle.

My guess is it has to do with logging off too fast after making modifications to a structure. But I have no idea really, and don't even know if you logged off immediately after placing that vendor or not.

Message Edited by Malitevv on 09-15-2004 04:06 AM



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In a minute there is time
For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

T.S. Eliot
Malitevv
Wed Sep 15, 2004 3:40 am
#6






Straker_Atrella wrote:

Well when I came back, my vendor was facing the origional direction, before I had rotated it. Yet it was still initialized.




On a side note: i'm not sure why this perturbed you. Vendors often fail to face the direction that they were facing when initialized. They always immediately target and then rotate to face a new player that enters within "barking range". It's quite normal to find them facing all sorts of random directions because of this. They always face the initialized direction when they first load, but once they load, they rotate quite often if there is activity around them.


Thoughwith publish 10, it wouldn't surprise me if this sort of rotation is even more frequent than it was before. I have noticed that vendors no longer target just players. Dunno if it is intentional, but with publish 10, I have noticed that vendors have developed a quirky habit of barking at speederbikes when they drive by (if the vendor is already loaded and near the wall of the building). I have also noticed that with publish 10, ifa bunch of vendors load into a room and they all start barking at once, they will sometimes target and bark at other vendors!





---------------------------------------------------------------------
In a minute there is time
For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

T.S. Eliot
Malitevv
Wed Sep 15, 2004 3:59 am
#7

On a completely arcane side note: if you have any understanding of programming Straker, I can offer a plausible explanation of how this sort of thing might happen (not saying this is how it happens). The database that manages this game very likely has multiple tiers. At the level furthest from the client would be the final arbiter, the backend database. But when you make a change to a structure's contents it likely updates a copy of the appropriate records from that backend database;a copy which actually existsin a different "mid-tier" machine that has direct access to the client andsits as a buffer between the client and the backend database. The backend database very likely is not updated with respect to these modifications to the record immediately for server performance reasons.


Given this sort of structure, a bug could very well exist that causes the contents of the structure to display improperly if the client (for whatever reasons) requests a new copy of the records that contain the structure's contents before that mid-tier machine has had time to write it's modified record back to the backend machine.



---------------------------------------------------------------------
In a minute there is time
For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

T.S. Eliot
Jjiaah
Wed Sep 15, 2004 4:08 am
#8

Don't sweat it unless it's not back after server reset.


A similar bug happens to me with disturbing regularity. I will place an item in a bag inside my house, or pick it up from a bag in the house, then close the container. When I reopen the container, it appears as though the container does not contain my items. If I put it in my inventory it will sometimes appear that the items are not in my inventory. The bag will even register 0 items and they won't count against my char max.


However...


When exactly such an event happened to me (items in a bag poofed) I had my wife run her char into my house and check the bag. Sure enough, for her they were there. She picked up the bag, and handed it to me. Everything then appeared. It was just a bug that I couldn't see it.


Technically, since a house is really not much more than a container we can enter, it sounds as though you were facing the exact same problem... just that because of the vendor subsystem you were able to see them for sale.


Disappearing vendors (I mean like really truely forever gone) and the like I'd imagine they'd replace. Under normal curcimstances itwould be difficult if not impossible to prove that that's what happened, and not that it was destroyed. But you have the vendor subsystem working for you on this.


Breathe easy till the servers come back up. If it's not back then, file a ticket. If the vendor still exists and the items still exist, but the vendor has vanished they should be able to help you with that.
babyblue_d
Wed Sep 15, 2004 5:42 am
#9






Malitevv wrote:




In truth, this issue usually happens to me when I am trying to transfer items between two accounts by dropping an item into a building and then immediately switching to my second account to retrieve the item. When I do that, I sometimes discover that when I arrive at the building with the new account, the item is not there. The item will then be invisible to me and everyone until the next server maintenance cycle.


My guess is it has to do with logging off too fast after making modifications to a structure. But I have no idea really, and don't even know if you logged off immediately after placing that vendor or not.








this is could becouse the item is question was "equiped" to the char that droped it be it in a bag that was equiped and it was taken out thien droped or droped piece of clothes.As a delivery boy for UPS i see this constantly and it never involves loging off its always the pack that we had equiped (yes we drop AFTER unequiping the packs).. tradeing it to the player that need to see it (as the one that droped it can always see it) usuly fixes the problem..


as for the vedor sorryI cant offer any help there ...


its a little known fact that the /rotate left/right comands can be used on aworkingvendor if your on house admin (NPC only) some timesIlike to makemy friendsthink there vendor is possesed heheh

Message Edited by babyblue_d on 09-15-2004 05:44 AM




Deloo Droid Works
Deloo Pabet, Master Droid Engineer Since 8/03, 2535 6446 Tatooine in the Corprate Sector
\\ 12 Point Master Artisan || 11 Point Droid Engineer || Force Crafter || Master Shipwright //

::UPS What can brown do for you? ::UPS Price Guide::DC Proposal 2.0::

Malitevv
Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:16 am
#10






babyblue_d wrote:






Malitevv wrote:




In truth, this issue usually happens to me when I am trying to transfer items between two accounts by dropping an item into a building and then immediately switching to my second account to retrieve the item. When I do that, I sometimes discover that when I arrive at the building with the new account, the item is not there. The item will then be invisible to me and everyone until the next server maintenance cycle.


My guess is it has to do with logging off too fast after making modifications to a structure. But I have no idea really, and don't even know if you logged off immediately after placing that vendor or not.








this is could becouse the item is question was "equiped" to the char that droped it be it in a bag that was equiped and it was taken out thien droped or droped piece of clothes.As a delivery boy for UPS i see this constantly and it never involves loging off its always the pack that we had equiped (yes we drop AFTER unequiping the packs).. tradeing it to the player that need to see it (as the one that droped it can always see it) usuly fixes the problem..






I've tried a dozen times and I can't make sense of that first sentence, but a bag wasn't involved in my case.



---------------------------------------------------------------------
In a minute there is time
For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

T.S. Eliot
Malitevv
Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:21 am
#11






babyblue_d wrote:




its a little known fact that the /rotate left/right comands can be used on aworkingvendor if your on house admin (NPC only) some timesIlike to makemy friendsthink there vendor is possesed heheh



This is true. You can continue to use the /rotate command on vendors after they have been initialized.




---------------------------------------------------------------------
In a minute there is time
For decisions and revisions which a minute will reverse.

T.S. Eliot
ArveMennderchukk
Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:08 am
#12

Straker,

If it's any help, I've had something like that happen, strike the fear of the Emporer into me, and then come back hours later to find that the stuff can be retrieved again.

When setting up a new vendor, I've taken to putting a single thing up for sale, waiting for several hours or a day, then trying a retrieve to make sure it works. After adopting that system, I've not had any more problems of this sort...

I hope you aren't facing something worse.
BoAbdor
Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:11 am
#13

I feel your pain. Lost my pack with all my crated subcomps just the same way. Dropped it in my house as I have done at least a million times before and when i stepped back it simply was not there. It reappeared magically this morning. Seems like we are always talking about storage issues, either the lack of or the bugs about. Any idea if there will ever be a "storage revamp"? TK? Drashk? TH? anyone?



Oteb MDE - Oteb's Droidworks near Theed


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