Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: Please help me understand your change of heart.
It won't matter, as who knows how many DEs will be left after this. It's one thing to impliment a change no one wants. It's quite another to impliment it, lie to the general public by smearing our names across it as the reason, then lie to us again by claiming ignorance.
There's two arguments at stake here. The first is that the general population does not want this change. we can say that is something that can't be disproven and can't be more obvious.
The second argument is the personal insult made against all of us. As I said, he knew all the facts, but said it anyway. Here's the proof (Sorry GnomeAD):
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=droid_engineer&message.id=52500
Personally, I don't thinkthe community willbe happy till both issues are resolved. And it may take more than an apology this time Thunderheart, because of this post. Start coming up with ideas mate, because this is the perfect example of a politician class "Critical Failing"
/agreeCompletely
I'd be happy with more non-combat droids and options as well. Sure I'd like to see a Probot with 15% to 25%more oomph, but I'd love to see a slicing module or an entertaining module or something like that as well. Something that would EXPAND the markets...after all, DEs are here to make droids to SELL to people. The more people we can sell to, the bigger the market, the more variance and specializations we have availble to us, the happier we are!
loomis001 wrote:
whos we? i support the DH idea
Here's your "overwhelming support" TH. This guy didn't even know you need MA parts to make droids. I daresay much of the support for the DH profession comes from the less knowledgable among us.
Here is a link to a thread creating an easy certification system that most DE's would agree with that is impossible to exploit.
4 levels of droids. Probots (everyone, level1) to heavy (level 4).
You earn ceritifications for higher droids when you earn a higher mitigation level.
When a BH gets investigation 1, he earns Ranged mitigation 1. This would allow him to use a light (level2) RANGED damage droid.
When a TKA reaches master, he will recieve MELEE MITIGATION 3. This will allow him to use a heavy (level4) droid that will do MELEE damage.
The only way templates will help is to have certifications for both melee and ranged droids. But since you can only have 1 out a time, whats the big deal?
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=droid_engineer&message.id=53358
Thunder have you ever actually read what our corr have said, or maybe the forumns?
Were are all these months and months of brain storming that has been done.
Were are the top 5 things we came up with and your responses to well this wont work because ir this is a good idea.
Lets call this exactly what it is.
YET ANOTHER STALL.
Isnt it true that the database just cant handle any changes.
Change of heart, really were was this ever EVER said this is what we want, and were was the communication with us from you to see if it really was.
You said we were next, you said you wouldnt let us down, you said we would like it. Well you cant please everyone but my gosh how about at least maybe 2 percent of us.
No i wont give you anymore information, you have 7 months worth, how about you acually do somthing with what you already have, rather then try to jam the same old junk down our throat in a differnet wrapper.
Frankly you could gain a whole lot of credibility if you would just communicate with us, if it wont work it wont work, lets come up with a new plan, but YOU caused this by no information to us, and then creating somthing out of thin air as a way to solve the number one broken prof since beta.
Sorry if you find my post unappriciative but it took you at your word and you let us down.
Mapai wrote:
One nice compromise would be to give Master DE the use of 1 DE specific Combat droid(could also be used as a DH). The DH proffesion could still have more types and more power droids so combat people would not flock to DE to gain the use of the DE combat droid, as those points would be better spent on DH. But the DE still have something Cool that we can use.
I disagree. In poll after poll and discusion after discusion, the majority of DEs have stated that they want to be able to use all the droids they can build, except fro skill-based droids like BH droids or medic droids (unless they have those skills). Whether we get an extra, DE-onlydroid is another matter and not as important as beign able to use and sell ALL of our droids.
This IS NOT my dream or plan. I also like the cert system and the plans that our correspondent and fellow DE's like. But I do feel that that option is not on the table. If we can't work together to find a "win/win" that the Devs will accept, then we will be STUCK with the current plans, that I think most of us don't like.
Interesting thread... yet in all your clamour to become the MDE's that you crave you forget one simple fact.. the cert system will make most professions far more powerful than they already are, meaning what was hard now, would be easy then. And if you tone anything down, there would be outcry from the other classes (a clear majority), or if you tone down the combat droids, no one will bother actually buying them.
I like the cert system, cause it makes my profession uber, not because I give a **edit** about MDEs. I suggest if you don't want Droid Handler, then suggest a non-game breaking solution instead, as the cert system would destroy the game.
Thunderheart-
There is no change of heart. There is however, miscommunication. Every player whom has ever taken the Droid Engineer profession has wanted to control ANY droid they make - that is why you'll more than likely only see Droid Engineers with Binary Load Lifters an Power Droids in their data-pads.
Creature Handler is 90% combat 10% mount-trainer (based on approximateexp required to achieve the respective skills).
Droid Engineer is 100% crafting,and 15% ofdroidshave minorcombat ability.
So by definition then- DE's were a combat profession prior to the Probot "nerf"..
And to correct a previous statment, yes, I know DE's make BH probes + seekers - forgot to add that.
I should add that even though I support adding a DH class in ADDITION TO allowing DE's to control and command their own creations, such a DH class is only viable if the droids themselves are on par with and comparatively powerful to high end creature pets. Shoot, they should be more powerful if you really want to move away from Circus Wars and get back to iconic Star Wars content.
No one will pursue a DH class unless the class is truly powerful in combat.
Lodacai
Marc_Deltram wrote:
We have almost ALWAYS (and reasonably unanimously) have asked for a cert system. Now, while I can see why Drashk's system may not be possible to implement (crosses a lot of profession and skill boundaries, somewhat complex,and the system may just not be set up to handle that), the fact is that there already is a cert system in place for weapons. Take a look at the whole Marksman/Rifleman/Carbineer/Pistoleer tree. Certs are in, and they work. Sure anyone can use any weapon, but if you pick up one you are not certed to use, it is just not the same as using a certed weapon. Not even close. And that is how it should be.
Okay, I don't understand here myself. Droid=Pet. Pet=Droid. The skins are different but the mechanics are the same. How can a cert system resolve the skill points a CH has to spend on the same CL pet as a droid I'm certed for at Master Pistoleer? What you are proposing will gut the CH profession because droids will be the always superior option. Do the math. How many skill points would a master pistoleer have to spend to use a CL25 pet? Now you're saying that certing him in a CL25 droid isn't unbalanced?
Within the parameters of the game, how do you resolve getting to use over CL10 pet/droids? You have to spend skill points on it. The cert system is using already spent skill points. So, do DE's get droid handling? Then you can't sell your high level droids because the people that would buy them are the ones that use them. So Droid Handler is about the only option. Unless you can come up with a skill point expenditure, within the parameters of the game, that comes to an equitable resolution with CH.
Thunderheart wrote:
Marc_Deltram wrote:
As of Pandora1982's response, the score stands as follows:
- No: 265
- Yes: 28
- Abstain: 7
That's exactly 300 votes, TH. How many do you need?
Note: This count includes vote swaps (people who changed their votes one or more times).
Well, I'd like to understand the change of heart.
Way back when, when I asked, DE's proclaimed that they were a "crafting professions" and not a "combat professions". Correspondent aside, this opinion was driven by post on this board. I see a big change of heart now.
What's your motivation?
This is an important thread. Off topic posts and rants will be deleted.
As others have stated, there was no change of heart, but rather a different point of view entirely.We view Droids as Tools that anyone should be able to use. A "Creature Handler" class makes sense because Creatures are animals that must be trained. Droids are tools that are constructed for a specific purpose - their use does not require special training, and as such anyone should be able to use them.
Now, we understand that Game Balance is a very important issue --that is why we support a Certification System. Relegating Droid use to a separate, completely artificial (and non-existent in Star Wars) "Droid Handler" class is both insulting and not necessary.
Additionally, why must we pidgeon-hole the Droid Engineer as a "Crafter" class? What's wrong with it being a hybrid "Combat/Crafter" class? After all, a lonely DE with a pet Droideka is only as strong as the droid - take out the droid and the DE doesn't stand a chance. If you need more balancing, just use anti-droid weapons (Ion rifles, EMP grenades, etc.).