Droid Engineer Archive

/tap Daker-Naritus & TheRealTK421

I understand that you wish to make comments, but as I stated eariler this is a poll and not a discussion. X amount of posts from the same person in a poll thread will only hinder my ability to collect data effectively.

Yikes! Drashk laid some 'smack down' on me!!

I feel so ashamed.



Message received: I shall refrain from further comment.

/bow

Apologetically,

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TheRealTK421 wrote:

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Daker-Naritus wrote:

I would also add the additional droid thing:

All: 1 non-combat droid

novice elite: 1 weak combat droid

novice DE: 2 droids of any type(including 2 weak combat droids)

master elite: 1 strong (I use this term losely) combat droid

master DE: 2 droids of any type(including 2strong combat droids)

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Daker,

Doesn't the item in yellow (above) kind of bypass your stated concern on allowing the profession to become "crafters that kick butt"?!?

In the spirit of not allowing us to have the best of all worlds, I'd suspect that the items you put forth above can't happen.

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Actually, I think itisa happy medium that can happen. As I said, gurrecksweren't good for combat power, they were mostly tanks. It was a rare time when you could kill anything substantial with a gurreck. They survived and took some aggro just long enough for you to shoot some.

What I am saying is I think DEs should have double combat droid power of other classes (through multiple droids), but still less than game breaking power (I wouldn't consider having 2 gurrecks to be game breaking).

We wouldn't have the best of both worlds, but would have good products to sell + a combat perk to ease the year of suffering imposed upon us.

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Drashk wrote:

I understand that you wish to make comments, but as I stated eariler this is a poll and not a discussion. X amount of posts from the same person in a poll thread will only hinder my ability to collect data effectively.

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Oops, ok, Fair enough. But if this is a poll, we should at least have had the hybrid option among the choices. I just don't think dividing the DE community in to 'crafter or combat' gives light to a more nuanced understanding of peoples' opinions.

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Daker-Naritus wrote:

What I am saying is I think DEs should have double combat droid power of other classes (through multiple droids), but still less than game breaking power (I wouldn't consider having 2 gurrecks to be game breaking).

We wouldn't have the best of both worlds, but would have good products to sell + a combat perk to ease the year of suffering imposed upon us.

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/agree

(sorry Drashk!)

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Drashk wrote:

/tap Daker-Naritus & TheRealTK421

I understand that you wish to make comments, but as I stated eariler this is a poll and not a discussion. X amount of posts from the same person in a poll thread will only hinder my ability to collect data effectively.

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Why haven't the devs given the correspondents the ability to create actual polls within their own forums, instead of having an opendiscussion poll?

I think this debate is mis-characterized. It is not a question of whether DE should be crafters or combat. There is no question of taking away the crafter element. The real question is are we crafters and combat, or crafters only.

The opponents of a crafter/combat class have a valid argument. If there are large advantages to obtaining DE combat skills, we will be flooded with DE’s. As a result, our skills, which we have worked hard to obtain, will be massively de-valued.

For my part I think we should be combat support, not combat.

We need to be able to call at least 2 droids at once. (For repair.) That would give us a slight edge in combat, but if the extra slot is put at the top of a tree, or even in master DE, it will probably be reserved for serious DE’s only.

I believe that there must be droid certification. Without it, the devs must nerf the combat droids to keep the game from being flooded with them. However, I agree that certification should be awarded as you work up any skill tree, not just DE. This would allow certification without crowding everyone into DE. Just as the droids should be everywhere in SWG, so the certification should be everywhere. This would also keep DE from being a combat class.

Finally, I think the droids primary combat role should be in defense, not offence. Here is where DE’s could really shine in combat support. With the upcoming improvements to the GCW there should be more attacks on factional outposts. And maybe even attacks on player structures. Even as things stand there is some need to defend harvesters from nasty creature spawns. I would like to see DE’s awarded a large number of defensive slots. A defending droid, once called, stays put, even if the owner logs until, it is destroyed or runs out of power, or possibly until a certain time limit. (7 days?) A lot of tweaks would be necessary to make this viable and prevent exploits, but it is exactly the type of combat support that I think DE’s should be doing.

Ok, time for me to join in the fun. My opinion is that there should be some low-mid level combat droids usable by everyone. Not overpowered, probably about the stats of the old CL15 pets, maybe even a little lower (as long as they're above the CL 10 ones). In addition, you'd have high end combat droids that get certed with certain skills. Ideally we'd have a large variety so we could cert say.... two in the ranged support tree and 3 or 4 more in various places such as SL, BH, and maybe even any of the other elite combat professions under there tree requiring combat xp. Now, there's logic and balance that backs this up.

logic:

Yes, droids have AI, they're made to work on their own. BUT, unless these things are extremely expensive, they aren't going to be nearly as good at tactics as a person. Random crafter/entertainer/doc/DE with no combat experience is going to have no clue how to best use this droid in combat, essentially its like using a gun without a cert (and they could even implement it as such, you could call the droid but it would perform poorly). Now, someone who has combat experience (especially squad leader) would know how to best use this droid, they would be the ones certed to use it.

Balance:

Obviously you can't give high level combat droids to everyone, that just brings about more pet wars, replacing creatures with droids (better, but still not acceptable). So that leaves it to low level droids or some kind of certification system. Ok, so now it has to be decided who to cert it to. You could cert them to DE's, but then you'd have to either limit them further or cut back on some of their crafting skills (a non-hybrid profession with the minimum number of skillpoints being a great combat and crafting class would be a gigantic target for the nerf bat, and for good reason). So crafting professiosn are out, unless your willing to give up some of the crafting aspect of the profession. That leaves combat and support professions. Most of the support professions (ranger, Doctor) would have the same issues as the crafting profession, in that they are a full and seperate profession without combat, and introducing combat aspects to it without taking away from the original focus tends to draw the attention of the nerf bat.That leaves your combat professions. These are already focused on combat, so adding combat droids is not really changing them or making them unbalanced. This makes them the most likely candidate.

Now, I'm still all for the idea of give us more utility droids as opposed to combat droids, but the devs seem pretty intent on combat droids. If we're going to do this lets get it right. The last thing we need is some botched system that gets nerfed after a week and takes another 6 months to fix. And remember, the profession system and skill points are set up like they are for a reason. If you want to participate in combat, take up combat skills, if you want to craft, take up crafting skills, if you want to do both, take up both, nothing is stopping you. The whole "I need it to check my harvesters" argument does fly. A non combat character with either C12's or a republic blaster can easily, with a probot, take out just about anything thats going to be hanging around your harvesters (unless they're on dantooine/dathomir, in which case there are people out there who will go out there with/for you to get the resources... for a price).

I'm a MDE, Master Artisan, and about 3,2,3,4 in Merchant. This means I'm very very weak combat wise. I would love to be able to rely on a droid to do my combat for me. Currently, the Probot is woefully lacking in dicey combat situations, and cycling multiple probots is insulting.

With all this said, I'm really leaning towards Crafter, with one condition.

Why?

Well, I always felt like it was my job to provide others with droids of all types... and that makes me a crafter.

The times where I want a droid that can kick serious butt is when I've got those @&$^@%# annoying Spineflaps and Shaupaut Hunters schmoozing around my factories. The Probot has shown it's not very capable of taking on multiple 4000+ HAM creatures, while also getting shot by 3-4 Spineflap Hunters from a distance.

As an MDE, I should be able to pull out asingle, good droid and unleash mechanized death on these vermin. I know it's a fine line, but my combat situations really only revolve around sweeping away this trash from my factories, which again shows that my motivation to have a butt kicking droid is to further my crafting profession, not conquering the galaxy.

That's my two credits.

I see the class as primarily a crafting class with some benefits to other things. Mostly, I see the possibility of a DE being the equivalent of a Droid Medic. This would entail the DE getting bonuses to various things. So, a combat droid under the control of a DE would recover from damage more quickly. But, more importantly, if there is some sort of 'Droid Stim', a DE should get a bonus for using it that others don't (maybe 10% or 25% boost.) After all, a DE understands the inner workings of the droids better. These benefits would be slight, but might be enough to sway some otherwise very close battles.

I do think that upper level DEs should be allowed to call out more than one droid. However, the extra droid should be a non-combatant one. It is meant as a utility droid of sorts with a repair module and perhaps some of the other modules that have been discussed like the slicing module.

How I see this working in a combat situation: Everyone has a combat droid of some sort (hey, I'm optimistic about my merchant skills). The battle ensues. The pure combatants have heavy combat droids at their sides laying waste to the enemy. The medical personnel have medium/light combat droids with medical boosting abilities at their sides as they run around healing the people. And running around throughout it is a MDE with a heavy combat droid body guard and a utility droid repairing the droids of the group and providing a slicing bonus to the smuggler hacking into a system. Picture a geeky (mostly) non combatant providing battlefield repairs with his trusty R2 unit (no blaster taped to the dome) and protected by his fiercly loyal Droideka. While the Droideka part may be a little outlandish, the Star Wars movies are full of R2-D2 providing battlefield support. He slices and repairs and provides real time information throughout the movies. That is what I would really like to see.

So, my vote would be crafter with a battlefield support role. If I want to have a combat role as well, then I need to pick up combat skills. I have plenty left over for it.

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Niding01 wrote:

Well.. i for one see it like this.

Creaturehandler learn how a pet works. And can use it in battle after training. They learn to control them and the better they get the more they learn about the animals and how tocontrol tougher pets.

Droidengineers: Well.. basicly. We can build and program them.. but dont know how to use them? Dont sound good to me. This is machines that do as we program them too.. not living thing with minds of their own.

It should be optional. Those that want to craft.. craft. Those that want to learn how to control tougher droids must learn how they work first.. thus have to achive some skill in droidengineering.

Just how i see it =).

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Ok really dumb post. If i make the combat droids im pretty sure i can control them - simple as that. Other people might need to learn how to use them, but me as DE i build the friggin things and i program them and i can even change what colour they are. We know ever part that goes into them and makes them tick, we should have a pretty good understanding on how to use them

Duly noted Sodan-droiddreamer. Thats what write in ballets are for.

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dpbad wrote:

Why haven't the devs given the correspondents the ability to create actual polls within their own forums, instead of having an opendiscussion poll?

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A poll, like the ones listed on the forums main page, wouldn't do issues such as this justice. Take a look at the passion and reasoning behind many of the responses. Hard numbers are one thing. The reasons why are what will make the difference in the long run.

I want to create combat droids (and normal droids) and i want to use them as well as sell them. I dont think we should chose 1 or the other. If we can build them from scratch im pretty **edit** sure we can use them.