Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: 'Having a problem with your Droid?' 'No. No problem...Why?' Version 1.1
I agree with you except up to the point where you want battle droids to be available. Personally i feel the base battle droid should be at Blueprint IV NOT III and the Adv Battle Droid should ONLY be for MDE's
Otherwise we will end up with DE dabblers as in the CH line.
Just my .02cents.
Thanks.
Sorry i have been a way for a few days and have just read your response to my idea Drashk. Will i understand what your are saying I must desagre after all we are living(ie. playing) in the Star Wars world (A tenear old boy every built a droid).From the very second that I heard about this game I invisened Playes with multiple droids in large scale battles. The limitations that you are talking about has the effect of limiting who can have droids, this does not make sense. Limiting animals is one thing, no where in the movies do you see people walking through towns will large pets following them around but you do see a lot of people with droids. The shows me that letting people have multiple droids makes sense, and for those of us who want to be able to sell more droids, giving more people the ability to call multiple attack droids would creat a larger consumer base. For those of you who will point out that this would open the door to the same problems that CH is know facing, which are people just taking a few skill trees to get the better droids the slotion is simple spread the ability to make them through out the whole profession just like the DEV are talking about for fixing CH. So again while I agree with almost every thing else you proposed I have to say that your cetf limits seem way to low for the Star War world. Like I stated above I could belive a world who people are running around with 5 droids out much more then every one having a large pet.
p.s sorry for the bad spelling
Drashk wrote:
Kollos, I looked through all of your responses, but found few comments that differed from your orginial post. I appreciate that you wish to debate the items that you brought up, however new content is a must so that this thread can keep evolving. As to item 3) The point of this porposal, just like the rest of the proposal, is to give the DEVs ideas for possible changes to the current system.
Perhaps I misunderstand the point here, then. Is this a brainstorming thread, or is this a proposal thread?
If it is a brainstorming thread, then I apologize for interrupting because one shouldn't comment on the validity of ideas while brainstorming.
However, if you are making a serious proposal that we're all going to have to live with, then you really should be open to debating your ideas. You aren't the only person with good ideas, nor are you/should you be in charge of the process. I like the fact that you are working on a proposal, but there are aspects of your proposal that I do not like and would not be happy with if implemented as-is.
So, which is it? Or have I missed a 3rd possibility?
I believe that any major changes to our profession are several months away. I am happy that the Devs are looking at our profession now, but rather than flooding them with ideas - some bad, some good - I would rather see what they can cook up. I am a software developer and a game designer, and I can tell you from experience that if we send them too many ideas that there will be a tendency for them to implement the easiest ones... not the best ones. The Plan (tm) was something of a joke and I'm waiting to see a real plan with something a little more solid in it before I get all worked up about what they intend to do.
To answer your question Kollos, this is a bit of both. A brainstorm and a proposal thread. Its a proposal in the works. What I was trying to get across to you was that I'mtrying to steer clear of the same situation that is happening with the DE-only debate, where the same arguements are being stated again and again with, many times now, only changing the words being used, instead of the ideas. WhenImade the reference tonew content, I was refering to how SinjenRandalland I have been offering point and counter point, but at the same time bring upsomething new each time.
One of the major ideas behind this thread, and the versions to come, is to offer the DEVs a number of ideas that have been offered by the DE community, but with the hopes that many of the proposed ideas could be implemented at the same time.The idea isa bit ambious and lot more optimistic than some of the ideas that I have read so far, but it also gives me, and I hope others as well, a little hope that the recent changes in feedback/response provided by Thunderheart are an indication that SOE is actually trying to change the way it has handled itself in the past.
I appoligize if there has been miscommunication. I'm just trying to keep this thread moving and evolving, but at the same time allow me to play the game a bit too..
I posted the following thread in order to gain a feel on what people think of item 1) and the concept of item 5). Anyone that reads this, please take the time to post a response on that thread, so I can offer an update to this thread later this week. Thanks in advance everyone.
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=droid_engineer&message.id=37541
Kollos wrote:
Drashk wrote:
Sure, it prevents a Master from selling a MSE droid with a high level module. But it essentially prevents a Novice from selling anything. You're basically reserving all sales for Master or near-Masters because you'll have to have the best of everything to get sales. Currently, non-Masters can get sales by putting crafting stations and the like in MSE droids... which unless I misunderstood your proposal, you would prevent.
True, MSE would not be as useful for novice DE, but Blueprints I has the Treadwell and R5.
If Astro mechs allowed crafting stations, then taking only one skill would open up that market to them.
Balancing is the key so that droid models aren't hobbled.
MSE really don't have much use (except for exploding
). They're supposed to be msg droids, so item and data modules are one thing. But I mean cummon, a crafting station that takes up a whole room being stuck in a shoe box? Ya, I know sticking one in a trash can isn't much more believable, but that's stretching things just a bit to far.
As well as these higher level DE burning us all by cramming everything into one and charging 3K for it.
Limiting the modules would put a stop to that kind of nonsense.
Drashk wrote:
I can see your point in wanting to keep the record/play functions split, however I was also looking at Droid_Engineer_Rho's suggestion about the communications module. If the record/play fuctions were seperate,a DEwould not be able to offer the holo vid transmission package in anything less than an Advanced R4. Bycombining the record/play module and using it in conjunction with the communications module, you give a Novice DE a product, in thepackagingof an Advanced R5 or basic R4, that would have a considerable market and not be level based, like the Medical module, in any way.
If the record/play modules are combined, would it be feasable toallow an Advanced MSE to have both the record/play module and the communictaions module installed? Or should it only be allowed to carry the record/play moduleso that you could send the droid to deliever holographic messages and have replies sent back?
I see now. The recorder module or playback module would be a necessary component for the communications module? I just assumed that the communications module would be separated from the record/playback module(s) because it would be a live feed, much like a pure webcam is different from a camcorder.
Maybe the communications module should be separate, so that the standalone module would still do something useful?You put one of these modules into a droid and can transmit and recieve images in real (or semi-real) time. So the communications module could be housed in a mouse droid, still be useful,but wouldn't record onto disks (without the record module). With the record module added, you could then capture the feed onto a disk, but without a playback module, you can't see the result.
I see it this way. If the three modules are separate, it still gives novices something to make that will be useful. For instance, lower-end entertainers can opt for only the recording module, lower-end fighters can opt for only the playback module, and others who don't want to skimp will opt for the full communications package (3 slots filled in a high-end R-Series droid). You will then have a wider selection of customization packages to offer. After all, we want to shy away from one droid that does everything. And even if you DO get one droid to do all that, it will be a higher end droid made by a master. Which is what we really wanted in the first place, right?
The communications module and the Holovid projector/recorder would be two seperate modules. Rho's suggestion of the Communications module started me thinking about what droids that module and the Holovid module would be best suited in and I started to think of some of the lower end droids, especially the basic R4 unit, since it was Obi Wan's R4 unit that inspired the combined useage. Having the record/projector functions in the same module seems to be more beneficial than to have two seperate modules, because it would give many lower end drodis the ability to have Holovid transmitter/recievers that players could use to have a communication with via a holo link. The Advanced MSE, Advanced R5, and R4 would benefit from having the ability to have a complete communications suite.
I also took at look at the seperate modules from a technology stand point, based on 21st century technology. Majority of the recording devices that we have now, also have a play-back feature. I know that I'm comparing real life issues to game principles, but most droid owners/customers will see it from this perspective as well. I know that we ultimately need more modules, but making a holographic recording module and a holographic projector would be less benefical then a combined module. Besides, I think the concept for the Adanced DZ70 working as a tracking/spydroid would be a great sells item to opposing faction members and Bounty Hunters alike. They wouldn't be able to function as such, if the Holovid's playback/record functions were on seperate modules.
Hmmm....just to make sure we are on the same page about the record/playback functions, I am refering to an input/outputability like a camera hooked up to a TV. The record feature is an active camera that begins to record on command, while the playback would be the holo-projection. The communications module would be just that, a means to send and recieve data to a seperate location.
How does this sound....The Holoprojector/recorder can only record one disk at a time, however when used in conjunction with a Storage module, the droid owner gains the ability to record as many data discs as their is storage? This would leave the market open for low end and high end droids, since low end droids would only be able to offer the Holoprojector (dropping the /record for sake of simplisity, but will include it in the next versions description) and the communications module, or storage module.
I was thinking of the data discs while I was at my shop a little bit ago. I have a Data Terminal near my vendors that I think looks like a mini-mall bank station, Anyways, it hit me that the data discs for the Entertainer's Holos could also be used in conjunction with the Data Terminals. I know a few RPers in game that would flip out if they could use something like the data terminal to write a personal log and save it somewhere in game other than their E-mail. Shop owners would also be able to set up a Data Terminal that had FAQs that could be more discriptive and longer than those on the details screen of an item. Tell me what you think
It sounds like we've got a few different concepts kicking around here, but let us not forget that above all, a droid is a very sophisticated computer, and take it from that angle.
Think of the modules as soldered-in PCI and AGP cards, and you'll be getting somewhere.
My computer has a hard drive, a droid can (and probably SHOULD) be made with data storage.
However, I needed to add a video capture/playback card, which when used in record mode allows me to stream that data into my data storage medium for later use.
In order to take that information though, and transmit it, I would need yet another module, whether that be a modem, an ethernet adapter, or a wireless networking card.
So I can see the use of three modules here, half-filling an advanced R3 or completely filling an advanced R4 or basic R2: Data storage, holographic recording/playback, and holonet interface.
One might decide that the 'Droid Sensor Package' component of nearly all droids should take the place of the holographic record/playback module, and I'll buy that for recording purposes, but I suspect that a display module MUST be additional. I kinda dig the holonet interface idea, since it opens us up to a wide range of future possibilities, including opening the door to remote harvester maintenance capabilities, etc.
The simplified version is probably better. I kept separating the playback and record modules because I had it stuck in my head that it had more to do with the video codecs than with the hardware. In digital video, you have to get the codec to play the video back, but that doesn't necessarily include the encoder with the decoder. With programs like Quicktime, you get the decoder for free, but you have to pay for the encoder. So maybe thinking of it this way:
The "lite" version (the holoplayer), which only allows playback, which would be available at Novice Droid Engineer, the first box.
The "complete" version (the holorecorder), which allows recording and playback, which could be available at, say, production I.
The Holonet Interface, which allows uploading and downloading data to a remote device, which might be available at construction I.
The data terminal idea is also awesome. That could be useful in many, many ways.
Since all of this is wishful thinking anyway, how about an analysis module, which cancapturedata from anunknown creature in the wild, storing that information in the droid, andyou bringit back to your house. You plug the disk into the data terminal, and the creature is analyzed. It might give you additional information on the creature such as challenge level, what its weaknesses are, what kind of meat, hide, bone it has, that sort of thing. Maybe it has data useful for a Bio-Engineer. Maybe it measures Midichlorians to tell you if the NPC is force sensitive 
. I think this would be a separate module than the record/playback module, though. But then you can have something of a "scout module", that wouldn't only benefit scouts.
I did think of a "griefing" issue with the record/playback modules. But only if players could record entertainers without their consent. I think this would be easy enough to get around if the entertainer had to direct the performance directly to a droid in order to record the benefits, though.
How far do you think it could be taken realisitcally? I don't see it as being several minutes of real live footage, but maybe more like a "snapshot" of a player (or creature)with idle animations mostly, with the blue glowy stuff emitted from the droid (or data terminal). Text data can accompany the image.
Live holorecording links could probably just do funky things with POV and displayed location to just show your current image in a different location.
It's GOT to be possible. It's just GOT to.
SinjenRandall, now we are going somewhere...hehe.
The suggestion of the Holo-player and the Holo-recorder module is a great compromise to keeping two seperate modules but at the same time having one module with both functions. I would have to suggest that both the Holo-recorder and the Holonet Interface modules be located on the Constructions or Refinement tree instead of the Productions tree. TheRealTK421recently posted a concept on the reworking of the DE skill tree and how spreading out certain modules would help to eliminate some of the DE dabblers, those that only take certain skills to produce similar droids to a Master DE. I don't agree with some of the changes that he proposed, however I do like the concept of spreading more modules to the Constructions or Refinement trees.
Now that holo debate is 'settled' , howto getinformation to and from the Data Disc needs to be brought up. My suggestion is that the Holo-player module allow for a drag and drop feature similar to the Item and Data Storage modules. Only one disc is allowed to be placed in the droid at a time and there would be a radial option to 'Get data disc from droid'. On the Holo-recorder module my suggestion would be 5 to 10 discs can be stored at a time and that the person using the record feature would need to specify which disc(s) the information is to record to, or the data can be stored in the data storage module, if installed. Text data, as mentioned in the previous post, and holo-images should not be allowed as storeable data in the datapad, since these items should only be stored on a data disc, data terminal, or data storage module.
SinjenRandall, thank you for bring up the 'griefing' issue. I would suggest that only Novice Musicians or Novice Dancers be allowed to the ablitity to create functional Holovids. By functional I am refering to the ability to heal Mind wounds during Holovid playback. Also, the Entertain has to be looking directly at the Droid in order for the Holovid to function correctly. Anyone could have their droid record someone elses actions, or their own, but only a Novice Elite Entertainment professional that is looking at their own droid, or a befriended droid, can have the ability to record a functional Holovid. I think that an 'easy' way accomplish this would be that a Novice Elite Entertainer profession 'opens up' a command function ontheirdroid equiped with a Holo-recorder.
I agree that text should accompany the video feed, as well as music from the Musician profession, which would be great for those of us who would really like to have music playing at our shops when customers are around. even ifitdoesn't offer healing properties. I disagree withthe Holo only being limited to'snapshots'. If nothing else, this game is one of the largest pieces of eye candy that I have ever seen. I'm certain that the development team wouldbe able to come up with something, even if the holosplayed by a droid are only twice as tall as an MSE andare projected as afuzzy bluehumanoid shape. People will still be interested in the ability to send/recieve Holovids from their friends. The Architect version of this idea, The Holo Suite, could offer a better quality image, since less people would own this version then the Droid version, in my opinion.
I like the concept of the Analysis module, in regards to it gving informtion about the meat, bone, and hide. It could even give the resource ratings of each animal scanned, making it so that a Scout could pick an chose its targets a little more carefully, before they attack their prey. Scouts would then be able to store this data, using a data storage module, and bring it back to their data terminal where they could put together a file of known creature reasources.
The Analysis module could also be used for non animal resources as well. A droid equiped with an Analysis module could be used to find out the stats on an given resource in the area. You wouldn't gain a sample of the resource, but you would be able to gain the stats on each resource that you select. The Analysis module would not give such data as density, but it could include the amount of time, in hours, that the resource has been present in that spot. The miner would still need to find the concentation of the resource and travel back to a place that has a Data Termial that they can access, however it would give anyone the ability to find out the quality of each available resource without having the survey skill.