Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: The Only Viable Alternate Future
So let me get this straight:
1. We'd have one of the highest skill point costs in the game.
2. We wouldn't be able to compete with crafters because no one else can use our combat droids.
3. We wouldn't be able to compete with combat classes because our combat droids are still crappy.
Drashk wrote:
I appoligize, but from my point of view, what you propose is not an alternative at all, but rather a death warrant to the future of the Droid Engineer profession that I wanted to be a part of.
Drashk,
You know I got nothin' but love for ya, but this is exactly the problem. You are not here to represent your views on what the DE profession should be, you are here to represent our views to the devs and TH. Period. As I mentioned in a post a few days ago, you should NOT be taking sides in our internal disagreements. It's one thing for you to have an opinion, but to express it and try to use it to influence the dev process is, quite frankly, an abuse of your position and what we all feared about the correspondent program all along. Even if we all wanted the DH profession and you disagreed, you should still tell the devs that that is what we wanted and leave it at that. You should have no more influence on the development process and the future of the profession than any other DE.
Jenden is already selling probots for 12k, man. How much worst can it get? DEs should have been able to sue combat droids all along. The devs just took their time adding the content.
Drashk wrote:
Not if the DE numbers swell to triple of what they are now, which is a pretty good estimate, if you compare it to the number of people that have drifted around CH. Asking to turn DE into a combat profession will have a negative effect of allowing anyone to sell droids and at the same time have combat abilities.
Sodan-droiddreamer wrote:
They could still sell probots, medic droids, BH droid, crafting, item storage and utility droids.
CapnSteve wrote:
So let me get this straight:
1. We'd have one of the highest skill point costs in the game.
2. We wouldn't be able to compete with crafters because no one else can use our combat droids.
3. We wouldn't be able to compete with combat classes because our combat droids are still crappy.
1. Correct.. solves the "must spend skillpoints to obtain combat cabability" issue.
2.We don't just make combat droids. We are the only classthat can make droids, so I fail to see how we "compete with crafters (in general)" anyway.. we already only compete with our own profession.. perhaps CH a little.
3. Why do they have to be crappy.. have you seen how well a CL 29 Stormtrooper Commando works? Two or three of those guys, that's plenty enough power for me.. if I want more powerful pets, I take up CH instead of DE.. I want droids, not animals though.
All this proposal does is introduce decent combat droids into the game, without imbalancing existing combat professions, and without losing any existing crafting options for the DE's.. I think some of you have been trodden on too long now, and you just accept that stuff has to be bad for DE's.. Why can't we have combat droids ADDED to the DE profession, if we can find a way to make it "cost" more..
All I see here every day is "I don't sell enough droids to make a living" posts.. people say they sell resources, or vehicles instead.. so it's already obvious that we must be pretty low powered crafting class as it is.. I think there is room for improvement of both the crafting and the addition of combat droids in DE.
It doesn't have to be one or the other. It can be both, and we just need to be strongly voiced of that idea.
Isn't this just a more fleshed out idea that was originally rejected with the resounding sentiment that DE is a crafting class and not a combat class. I think this proposal does little more than give DE some combat ability they don't really even want.
I like these other ideas better. Better droids should be available to everyone, it is Freaking Starwars.
A. certs are still an idea that i think would work, but would require much balancing
B. The idea of droids having there own skill trees and such
C. give combat droids to CH, lol
But you know what? I've given it a bit more thought, and read a bit more from TH over on 'In Live' now, plus I've gotten some food into my system. Now I say: Why compromise so much? It sounded like the developers were/are potentially willing to give Droid Engineers a line of handling, and to be honest, we could use SOME use for that awfully empty-looking third tree of ours.
Besides, when negotiating, it's not your job to worry about the other side's limitations and concerns. It's your job to get as much for yourself as you can! So I say give all Droid Engineers DL150 Droideka certifications, with one additional callable droid per trained box in the third line. In addition, give masters two additional callable droids (for a max of 6) plus the ability to craft and use DL250 Hailfire droids.
Now I put the ball into the developer's court for a counter-proposal.
I've said it before and I'll say it again....
Anything but a Droid Handler class. It's an insult! I'd rather have to live with R2's with Rocket Launchers strapped to their domes, and you all know how much I hate that idea...
SkybaneInc wrote:
I hate to break it to you Woody but I'm MA and was MDE I also had enough points for Master Swordsman. An elet combat profession. I couldn't even begin to tell you how powerful I would be with MDE, MA,MS and two high level combat droids at my side.
Sorry Dev's aren't going to allow that.
Your proposel is nice and I'd rather have combat droids in DE buteven withMDEand MA rquired there are still to many points left over for an elet combat class.
Looking it up you would have 18 points left after mastering Artisian, Droid Engineer, and an elite combat profession. If the pets are limited to two CL25 this combo would be a complete waste of time, as you can master an elite combat profession and master creature handler and still have 52 skill points remaining (with two CL35 pets).
Woody I actually pictured the bonus DL to be in one tree, so other crafters could chose to dabble in DE instead of a combat profession if they choose. Looking at it: Novice Pistoleer cost 35 points, getting say Droid operation IV would cost 20 points (which would be about DL22, the final +3 DL resides in the master DE box).
Looking at Drashk's concern about MDE+MCH being the ultimate pet machine (with 4 remaining points) be a concern? Since the player will have no direct combat ability. It may have some balance issues, but I think a master pistoleer+ master CH would be more deadly. If there is an issue perhaps limit MDE droids to DL20 (+2 per box).
Of course it will all need balancing.
Droid_Engineer_Rho wrote:
I was going to guess that a plan like this one is about as good as we're gonna get. When I first read it, I didn't post because I was short of time, and now I'm glad I didn't.
But you know what? I've given it a bit more thought, and read a bit more from TH over on 'In Live' now, plus I've gotten some food into my system. Now I say: Why compromise so much? It sounded like the developers were/are potentially willing to give Droid Engineers a line of handling, and to be honest, we could use SOME use for that awfully empty-looking third tree of ours.
Besides, when negotiating, it's not your job to worry about the other side's limitations and concerns. It's your job to get as much for yourself as you can! So I say give all Droid Engineers DL150 Droideka certifications, with one additional callable droid per trained box in the third line. In addition, give masters two additional callable droids (for a max of 6) plus the ability to craft and use DL250 Hailfire droids.
Now I put the ball into the developer's court for a counter-proposal.
If you weren't so furry, I'd kiss you!
The single Droid tree-line won't work for the same reasons they reworked the CH class to begin with. people will just take engineering, then that line, and get all the benefits with none of the drawback.
as far as CH + MDE, sounds interesting. Balance is down to the Devs, though. However a top-line limit on creatures is not that hard. As TH supposedly believes, droids and pets are the same thing. leave the limit to what it is now (3 creatures and a droid). It's a bug, but not one that's shown to be gamestopping.
Obviously some combos exist, but where there's a choice, MCH would be a far more ideal choice for the combat person than MDE.
1) (Drashk) More Droid Engineers doesn't hurt the Droid Engineer's selling power. Lack of meaningful things to sell hurts the Droid Engineer's selling power. There could be half as many of us, or twice as many, and it wouldn't change much for the *average* Droid Engineer's economic outlook. Lets face it - when there's nothing meaningful to sell, you're not going to be making so much money. A dabbler who comes for the combat power is unlikely to spend money selling MDE items at cost - they can get more for the resources on the bazaar, most likely. Thus, I have no concern that more Droid Engineers makes each Droid Engineer sell for less. It didn't happen with Doctors or Bio-Engineers, I don't see a threat here.
2) What's to say that we couldn't deter over-dabbling by having combat droids benefit from a lot of maintenance and upgrade work, and benefit at the same time? If you need an engineer to repair the droid, and a lot of combat bonuses come from DE-crafted Weapons Packs, I think we'd see a lot of sales internal to the profession. Many Doctors buy medicines from other doctors rather than manufacturing them themselves - why is it so improbable to think that if a Droideka's gun only lasts 5,000 shots(think powerups), and only a Droid Engineer can assemble and put in a new one, perhaps we can get a major increase in sales?
3) DL 25 is unacceptable as a maximum. We need to be able to have combat droids that are highly competitive on any battlefield as primary weapons. Otherwise it continues to be Creature Wars, and I hate that. We put in a lot of points to make droids, and we'll put in a lot more resources to get them - we should at least get a good product out of it.
Come on, people - you're selling the potential of the profession short. There's no reason why we shouldn't be able to make exceptionally powerful DL 70 combat droids - it's the devs' job to decide how to limit their commonality, not ours. What the Droid Engineers need to be doing is pushing to make the absolute most we can of the Droid Invasion, and stop trying to artificially limit ourselves.
In the debate over combat droids and Droid Handlers, a lot of very good other ideas have been pushed aside. The pro-utility droid crowd is so pissed off about Droid Handlers and are spending so much effort trying to stop combat droids that they're sacrificing their own agenda.
This community would be much better off if we asked for the stars and settled for the sky, than we will be if we ask for the mountain-top and the devs are offering the sky. Because sometimes you get the stars when you do the former, but you always end up getting the mountain-top when you do the latter.
Now is the time to say, when the devs are paying close attention: Hey, while you're at it, fix X, Y, and Z as well.
TheWoody wrote:
The single Droid tree-line won't work for the same reasons they reworked the CH class to begin with. people will just take engineering, then that line, and get all the benefits with none of the drawback.
as far as CH + MDE, sounds interesting. Balance is down to the Devs, though. However a top-line limit on creatures is not that hard. As TH supposedly believes, droids and pets are the same thing. leave the limit to what it is now (3 creatures and a droid). It's a bug, but not one that's shown to be gamestopping.
Obviously some combos exist, but where there's a choice, MCH would be a far more ideal choice for the combat person than MDE.
I think the single line will work well as this is not the same as the old creature handler dibacle. Dabblers in CH were able to get up to CL60 (I believe) in only one tree. This gave them most all of the benefits of the entire class if the had someone give them a trained uber-pet ready to go. We are not talking about very high level pets for DE only slightly better (DL20-25). For Scouts, Rangers, and Bounty Hunters it was only a 20 point cost for huge pets. For the same points (20) we will be offering slightly improved pets to mostly crafters.
Think about it. Crafters usually pick up a combat skill to help in their ability to survive and make their harvestor runs. They will now have a choice wither or not to get a combat skill or buy a better bodyguard to help them without going into the combat professions. Sure some prefer some combat experience, but pure crafters may not. If it is balanced then why not.
Crafters who dabble just to get a better droid will need full to by them from a MDE. This separates the serious droid crafters from the droid users and increases the market for droids needed; all good. As far as the influx of new DE's, I think that this would definately increase the number of Novice Droid Engineers, but if the pets are only slightly more powerful then the number of dedicated master DE's will not change a whole lot.
Thoughts?
Star_Ranger wrote:
Crafters who dabble just to get a better droid will need full to by them from a MDE.
Bah no edit....
Crafters who dabble just to get a better droid will need to buy them from a MDE.