Droid Engineer Archive

Ack-Ack2003 I agree with you. But on the other hand, the devs need to see that people either agree or disagree with their brainstorms so they dont add a system that will ruine the game for people.

This is why I posted this... to show my dis-taste for this idea.

And don't get me wrong, I *WANT* combat droids in the game. I would *LOVE* to be able to build battle droids and droideka. However, I DO NOT want them to be limited to DE. I want to be able to build and SELL them, not just build and use them.

I'm an Engineer and I want my engineering profession to stay as an engineering profession. If i wanted to be a pet handler I would have chosen to be a CH.

There will no longer be a market. There will no longer be a reason to build droids unless you plan on using them yourself.

Lets see... the current market is... mouse droids for all functions, portable crafting stations, and some basic medical use options in the world instead of only at the medical facility.

Our combat capable droids right now are a joke. Droid have a 15 minute battery charge instead of one full day of operation. Well this doesn't seem to change much when you add in a droid that can hold it's own in combat. WE ARE STILL LIMITED TO ONE DROID so far and DE doesn't seem to be getting additional ones for use.

What you speak of makes little sense to me... droids have no handler profession, they have a master who tells it what to do. We get to control one at a time and thats it... so where does "combat droids" ruin the profession? I think it just opens our market up a little and starts pointing people away from creatures to make the game more like star wars...

I don't understand what the big problem with combat modules is.....

Everyone is complaining that DE is a crafting profession and not a combat profession, and that players will take DE just to use the combat droids. (ala CH)

SO WHAT!

I doubt many people will master DE if 'droid usage' is added to just one branch of the DE tree - they'll just take that one branch so they can use higher level droids. And maybe another branch so they can store and use more droids. (ala CH) And if both these things are on the same branch, all the better.

SO WHAT!

Dabble, dabble, dabble...

SO WHAT!

People can take a few boxes in DE to get just what they want. That's what we all do with base and elite professions - we take what we want so that we can do what we want. That's the way the skill tree is designed. Despite what anyone 'accidentally' or purposely says about exploiting.

SO WHAT!

Making combat modules usable only by DE will force us to become a combat class???? Where the heck is this coming from? No one is forcing anyone to fight! If you want to make crafting the focus of your gameplay and not combat THEN DO THAT! Just because you can use combat modules doesn't mean things will suddenly run up to you and start attacking you.

SO WHAT!

If done properly, and experimentation works, this one item on the plan will NOT negatively impact our profession. It will increase our market. More people will purchase droids because they compare to other pets. You won't have to use creature pets just because there's nothing better. You can use droids because they're cool, and yes, they're star wars.

WHAT ARE OUR OTHER MARKETS??? Crafting stations? Ya right, very limited and once saturated it's dead. You can't sell any more once every crafter has one. Medical? OK, same thing.

Combat droids that remain 'broken' after so many deaths (a reasonable number like 50, not something stupid) would provide a continuing market and provide the customer with something truely useful. And at a good price too I think.

If you're worried that the DE profession as a whole will become more popular because it now has more options to offer the player base, well then, yeah, maybe it will. Just like any other profession.

Combat droids and modules need to be HIGH levelthat dabblers can USE but not MAKE.

I do object however to placing combat modules into inappropriate chassis. Combat modules should go in combat droids. NOT surgical droids, or repair droids, or power droids, or R units. That's just plain stupid.

(yeah, I know, I posted this on a thread in another forum - so what)

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Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:

No one profession should allow you to do multiple play-styles. Not even Combat Medic allows this, since the healing side of "Combat Medic" you already gained from the "Medic" profession.

........

Just imagine if Armour could only be used by Armoursmiths. As an armoursmith, would you like that idea? Imagine how many players that consider armour an "important part of their game play". Those players would then be FORCED to gain armoursmith abilities so that they can wear armour. Of course, now they have abilities to build their OWN armour .. so why pay someone else to do it, when you can make it yourself for a cheaper price. Sure, may not be as good.. but its a far better feeling to know you are wearing something YOU built and not someone elses handy work. But hold up! You've been an armoursmith for over 4 months now. You put a LOT of time and effort into becoming a Master Armoursmith. You've put a lot of time and money into building a shop and to increasing your skills as a businessman. You enjoy standing in cities selling the seads of your labour. But now you are being told that no one wants to buy your armour anymore because;

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CH are the only ones who can TRAIN and USE their own products. What is the point?

Has the CH profession been ruined or do people only take a few boxes so they can USE creatures???

And DE is an elite profession, so people will have to waste points taking the entire Engineeringbrancheven to get into it.

If combat types have that many points to waste, I don't see many of them going any further, and wasting any more points,than that.

In fact I DO think making these modules available only to DE to be pretty useless.Not because they'll ruin the profession. But because NO ONE will want to take the points just to use them. And that means the same thing everything else in the DE profession eventually means - no one will BUY them.

Ya I do see what you are saying but I dont think that it is the end of us. I do wish that they would make CERTAIN combat droids available to the other professions but maybe keep the highest level droid reserved for the DE. In a matter of thinking we would become like a CH but we could still sell the lower level combat droids to people in other professions so that we are still able to make money off of selling our droids.

-IceBullit

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Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:

Droid-Creator, what part of "Droid Engineer" includes "Adventerer", "Combatant", "Squad Leader", "Master of the Universe", "George Lucas' Mom"?

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Actually, wasn't Darth Vader a droid engineer? hehe.

I'll tell you plainly, I just want any form of change, and sooner then later... that's what would make me happy.

And frankly I don't think the changes would make them a 'Combat' class... they'd be a support class, like CH. And while it would change the dynamic of DE, it wouldn't kill it... you could still craft/sell... but it also opens the door for people who don't just want to sit around clicking boxes all day.

Think positive people!

-Azerin Dangerflirt
Colonel, Imperial Army

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Soren_dVinn wrote:

*SNIP*

I can't believe such a state of disconnect exists between the players and the developers of the DE profession. It's truly amazing.

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I think you better alter that to say I can't believe such a state of disconnect exists between MYSELF and the developers of the DE profession. Don't you start talking for me, pal. I like what they're saying for the changes to DE. When I bought this game, it was because I found out you could build droids. I didn't care WHAT kind, just that I could. That hasn't changed a whit. I'm still fired up to be a DE and make droids all day. Which means that I don't care how bad YOU think it is, I'm fine with the skill tree.

Think about that the next time you decide to make blanket statements like the one above.

AR

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Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:

There are three main issues this creates. They are as follows;

1. It will create a HUGE influx of new DE's. This, in turn, will not only reduce the market current DEs have to sell, but will also likely form a new "money crisis" amoungst DE as n00b DEs who arnt really interested in the crafting side of DE sell off their products cheaply to try and make money out of their grind to hit whatever combat droid they are after. This is the issue I am most concerned about. It can potentialy kill off the entire DE market. Its already hard to sell droids for more than 15k as it is ... why should we have to sell for less?


2. Imagine how many players will ask you to build them a Droideka, and you reply "I'm sorry. Only a Droid Engineer can have and use combat droids" ... as if we don't already have enough things to convince the buyer they don't want to buy a droid from us.


3. DE becomes the new CH and becomes equally as hated ... this makes selling droids harder, and forces the DE to reduce prices (yet again).

I'd just like to point out: a Power Droid requires a Power Core. A Power Core can only be crafted by an architect. On Starsider, the standard price architects are selling power core's for are 8k. That means, before you've even begun to construct the Power Droid, its already cost the DE 8k. Add to that the prices of resources and then the possibility of the droid getting a crit failure (and having to buy a second power core) a Power Droid alone could easily fetch around 15k in costs.... Imagine trying to sell that droid in a universe well 60% of players are atleast novice DE, the reamining 40 either dont want a droid or already have one.

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And here is where I do my dead level best to tear your argument apart, brick by brick.

1. So what if there is a huge influx of new DE's? You make this sound like someone picking up a basic class skill? They not only have to get level 4 engineering, but if I'm reading these schematics correctly, the really good stuff requires master level artisan components. But we'll get to that in a second. Let's concentrate on your main arguement for this point, which is 'I can barely make money selling what I do now,' to which I say, how does that make you any different than the so-called usurper DE's that are going to be coming over in droves? They want to make money, you want to make money. They earned the skills through hours of grinding out mouse droids and power ups and so did you. The only thing that you have going right now is the excuse that you were there first. Sorry, pal. Seniority counts for bupkiss. Try making a better product than the unwashed masses and capitolizing on that.


2. If you're catering to people who aren't going to buy from you because you refuse to give them something they can't use, then maybe you need to find a new class of customer. Everyone wants the Massive Robot of Destruction +10 (TM), but not everyonecan have it. So use a little salesmanship and sell them a probe droid. And while you're at it, quit whining.


3. So DE becomes the new hated class. So what? Are you in this for the "prestige" of being a Droid Engineer? Well, then I guess you're just going to have to suffer with the rest of us when the critter stigma hits the DE's. We're going to be the Flavor of the Month until something new comes out and all the cheeseheads move on. But who cares? Someone wants to bitch and whine about how DE's are overbalanced? Let 'em come say it to my face. And then I'll cut them off and see how loud they cry THEN. My CH friend did it and her buyers quickly learned to shut the h*ll up about it. Are you in this for the money? Learn some salesmanship and networking skills. I don't have to worry about money because I a)network and get my name out there, b)have a pretty solid client base that I sell to and c)I'm not too good to do money quests. But the REAL reason I do DE stuff is not because of the money or the rather non-existant prestige of being a DE. It's because I think DE is cool and I want to be a part of it. They could bust me down to making nothing but mouse droids, R2 units and donks and I'd STILL be a DE.


4. And as to your last point which was NOT numbered, see above comments about networking. Make some friends. Or maybe go into Architect yourself and make your own components. Crit fails are a fact of life. New DE's are coming. Get over it. The prices will drop until this glut that is supposedly coming abates. Wear a helmet.

In summation, stop whining. If you can't handle change, quit the game and go play checkers or Parcheesi or something.

you know what vibe I'm getting from this thread....

He wants DEs to get cool new stuff....but he doesn't want us to get anything that will attract new players to the DE profession. Face it, for the most part we can charge just about what we want for droids and people will pay it. We are a very rare breed. If something were to attract new players to the class then there would be more competition....no more charge 25k for a probe droid, you would have to be more reasonable. Frankly, I'd like to see more people in the profession, especially when/if they get experimentation and material quality working for DE.

Experimentation and resource quality alone could seperate masters from dabblers.

Also if you are afraid of dabblers, just put that Droideka Advanced cert in Master DE.

Dabblers didn't kill the CH market for selling creatures....hell, they made it stronger.....just put the worthwhile combat droid components high in the trees...and require things from all 3 trees, that would pretty much eliminate them making their own as dabblers.

Just wanted to put my .02 into the mix. I'm a crafting character only. I like the crafting, customers (sometimes) and the merchant aspect of the game. I really, really hope that DE's can sell their creations to adventurers and have them useful. I by no means want to take my own creations into battle but I would like to provide Combat Droids to the market.

On another note, if it is true that to have a combat droid you need to be a DE does that mean that everyone in the SWG universe that used a combat droid is or was a DE? Who knows...maybe they were.

hmmm I like the idea of combat droids, how about only droid engineers can use the non-combat droids with the combat pod. And the combat droids can get upgraded firepower thanks to the combat parts.

There is one thing I have always been wondering, why do bionary load lifter have the thickest armor if they don't have to fight.

I was wondering if combats droids could be part of the millitia of a city.

Very few people have the desires or the discipline to grind out over 600 MSE droids just to reach the first box. Even if Droidekas were added, people would just as soon buy them before they would grind all the way up to the top of the tree. Sure, given there may be a handful of people that would decide to go to the DE profession, but out of the handful, I'd say only 50% of that handful would actually pursue it to the top because of all the grinding required, and the little xp that each component gives out.

As of now, DE's already have a death warrant: we can't produce anything useful. We can barely sell our products, and we can barely give them away. Until either more droids are added to our schematics or vehicles are added (I'm dreaming big here), we're already underdeveloped / ignored. The devs have made pets so much more significant than droids and that's the way it will probably be fora very, very, very, very, very, very, long time. Because guess what, there are more creature handlers than there are droid engineers so you can bet they aren't going to listen to a small group of DE's. We're just the step children of SOE.

Just want to say that I agree with Vampiric_Hoshi, at least in the basic sentiment.

However, as the recent blast of information settles in over the last few days, I feel there's no reason to be concerned anytime soon. For the following reasons:

1. The Joke, a.k.a the DE 'Plan', is just a few wild-eyed long-term proposals. Given SOE's statements regarding game priorities and development resources, you're looking at a minimum of 6 months before any of The Joke is even ready for TC. And, by then, with player cities, mounts, and vehicles fully implemented, I'll bet further that SOE will turn their development resources to their first expansion pack. So this means realisticly you're looking at significant changes 1-2 years (yes, years) from now.
   
   


2. The propsed DE changes are very significant, probably on par with the current efforts of player cities, mounts, etc. If you watch the entire development timeline for these enhancments, you'll get a good sense of how long these changes will take to implement. The entire timeline includes proposals, plans, development, implementation, TC, roll-out, bug fixes, exploit fixes, stability.
   
   


3. There is an emphasis from SOE to limit the number of pets that players control. This, I believe, will translate into behind-the-scenes efforts on the part of SOE to minimize droid combat capabilities.
   
   


4. I have faith that somewhere deep within SOE there is adult supervision responsible for maintaining the game's integrity, especially in regard to their overall vision of the professions/skills system. This system is in some ways still an experiment, a deviation from the traditional RPG classes system. A cornerstone of the profession system is the simultaneous division and interdependence of player abilities as manifested through economic functioning of all chosen professions.