Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: Can we all......
TheRealTK421 wrote:
From what I understand, Rangers and DEs both are often in the head-banging mode.
CikMatt wrote:
Sigh, I was hoping to not have to do this..
/banghead
Do all professions feel like the red-headed middle child, or just us?
TheRealTK421 wrote:
What's that, Shian?
Come up with the magic bullet idea that will balance DE Hybrid perfectly so we can have it?
What should I do or sayexactly to force them to change their minds and see the error of their ways (...cause if you have it, I'd love to know)?
Quit? Yea..that won't work.
/bow
Respectfully,
See your problem TK, you are no good when you get patronizing.
IF they told us why it wasn't balanced, maybe Sodan, me and everyone else would have a fighting chance --and THEN we might be able to tell you what to say to make it happen - your 'magic bullet'
Nobody says you can Force them to change their minds - but you can be honest and say when that corporate mind was set
Representatives 'quitting' over a principle is standared practice in the UK, you believe something is wrong, you resign either in protest or as a matter of honour. Perhaps it doesn't apply here but it would shake them up..they couldnt replace you and everyone would know why...anyway you wont do, it so nevermind.
Bottom line here is you are all trained to listen to Dad...- but no, Dad says it isn't balanced so listen up Kids. Sir, yes Sir.
Never dare to ask why?
/sadly
AudioOrgana wrote:
Pfft.
The rangers didn't have not one but TWO publishes advertised as their big "revamp", nor were their actual products misrepresented to the entire playerbase in the launchpad (and still are almost three weeks later since the Corvette is still MIA).
AO
Yes, rangers were given a long list of new things the devs were going to add a few months after launch....including new traps, camps, /track and several other nice new things.
Only problem is, the devs flat out forgot about most of them. Greenmarine was moved to another project and the only promised additions that made it into the game were /camo (useless and bugged) and /areatrack (limited usefulness). I don't think that /areatrack constitues a compete revamp.
So yes, rangers are familiar with the devs making grand promises and then not following through.
Shian_Tavkin wrote:
TheRealTK421 wrote:
What's that, Shian?
Come up with the magic bullet idea that will balance DE Hybrid perfectly so we can have it?
What should I do or sayexactly to force them to change their minds and see the error of their ways (...cause if you have it, I'd love to know)?
Quit? Yea..that won't work.
/bow
Respectfully,
See your problem TK, you are no good when you get patronizing.
Yes, that only works for Raph Koster - and barely even then. (Remember, show regret
)
IF they told us why it wasn't balanced, maybe Sodan, me and everyone else would have a fighting chance --and THEN we might be able to tell you what to say to make it happen - your 'magic bullet'
True, but it's clear from public statements and private messages that it was never going to happen, it was just a feign of attention to the DE community.
Nobody says you can Force them to change their minds - but you can be honest and say when that corporate mind was set
One cannot do this while they see the corporate mind as the ideal that they strive for, that they will defend no matter how silly it makes them look.
Representatives 'quitting' over a principle is standared practice in the UK, you believe something is wrong, you resign either in protest or as a matter of honour. Perhaps it doesn't apply here but it would shake them up..they couldnt replace you and everyone would know why...anyway you wont do, it so nevermind.
But we all know how much TK loves his self-titled "elevation", to hope that he would make any drastic statement like that is folly.
Bottom line here is you are all trained to listen to Dad...- but no, Dad says it isn't balanced so listen up Kids. Sir, yes Sir.
In this case it's not even the training, it's the DEFENDING of the offender. That is what really gets me - not the egotism but the blatant justification and support of moves that are CRIPPLING us ("Problem soved! Publish 8 will allow you to make a full droid for display instead of your cost-effective, forward compatable chassis you all know and love!").
Never dare to ask why?
It's not even about asking why. It's just the saddest thing in the Galaxy that TK has directed his occasionally mildly amusing "breakdowns" to the players instead of the Devs. If you read TK's posts directed towards us, his twist of logic and facts is much like he used before against the Dev team.
We are lost, Shian. We don't have anyone fighting for us, but it seems against us - every time we are told that we should be excited about the "goodies", or that somehow this new visual deed system is a good thing and not the bad thing it is (as long as it's implemented INSTEAD of the system we already had, not in addition to it will be a bad thing overall) we seereaffirmed who is working for our side and who is working against it by worshiping at the altar of Dev and making excuse after excuse for them while attempting to patronize the victims.
I think this might be the grand plan - since I feel like about the only long-time DE (who has never dropped a single skill box) who hasn't said "I quit" over this.
I'm going to sell droids and make as much money as I can while I empty out my large amount of stock. This weekend the sales have finally begun to go down post-invasion, so even that isn't a salve anymore.
I wish I had the words to express how sad this is - that in our moment that is supposed to be of shiny glory, we get stuck with the same tarnished profession we always had, only now nerfed, and one of our own spends their time defending the very mis-deeds that brought us to this place.
Uttlerly depressing.
/sadly
AO
ReptileSpit wrote:
AudioOrgana wrote:
Pfft.
The rangers didn't have not one but TWO publishes advertised as their big "revamp", nor were their actual products misrepresented to the entire playerbase in the launchpad (and still are almost three weeks later since the Corvette is still MIA).
AO
Yes, rangers were given a long list of new things the devs were going to add a few months after launch....including new traps, camps, /track and several other nice new things.
Only problem is, the devs flat out forgot about most of them. Greenmarine was moved to another project and the only promised additions that made it into the game were /camo (useless and bugged) and /areatrack (limited usefulness). I don't think that /areatrack constitues a compete revamp.
So yes, rangers are familiar with the devs making grand promises and then not following through.
/sigh
Again, I am not saying they don't have reason to be upset.
However, every time TK replies about this topic he says, "Well, so and so has it bad too"BUTwhen the example falls in our favor (Chef, BE), he says it's irrelevant.
You can't have it both ways; you cannot compare our plight to one profession (that isn't even a crafting profession!) and at the same time say that the two successful ones (Chef, BE) were irrelevant. TK is contradicting himself here, though I'm sure he will have a spin-worthy retort that will reenforce everything I have said here. This is a perfect example of the situation, and this double-talk that is frustrating the heck out of many.
The fact remains, we are in the middle of the DROID INVASION and are waiting for DROIDS REBUILT.
The Rangers did not have two publishes not only dedicated but named after them, the rangers didn't have their new abilities falsely advertised in the launchpad to EVERY SINGE player in SWG, and the Rangers aren't THE most Star-Warsy of professions (save Jedi and Smuggler).
Sorry if "Rangers have problems too!" dosen't fly in here; it's not so much that it's not trueas the fact that TK says it. Every single comment like that serves to provethe point - we have gotten tons of lip service, they aren't following through with anything meaningful, and TK is enabling them to do so.
It's not TK's fault that DE is in the state it is, but it is his fault for trying to preserve the status quo over the misery and departure of virtually every veteran DE on these boards. It doesn't matter now, TK got what he wanted - now it's just going through the motions as always so he can preserve his "elevation".
I think this may be the "plan" - get rid of us old foggies, delete the posts that promised us the world - go try and find Sintrosi's "DE PLAN" - you will find a link in a thread called "DE PLAN CONCERNS" - but somehow, mysteriously, the plan that promised us medical droids that actually healed, droids that had actual function, and a real combat system has disapeared. Odd, huh? "This message has been deleted."
I honestly think this is the new "Droid Plan" - get rid of many of us as possible, and get a whole new group in to lead around for nine months or more with promises and talk of true usefulnees only to say, "Sorry, it's too hard..." resetting the cycle anew until people that aren't obsessed with MIddle Earth-style fantasy hopefully make a game called SWG2 where droids actually matter and have some presence.
So sad.
AO
AudioOrgana wrote:
<<Lotsa valid points snipped to save space>>
Agree 100%.
One of the main reasons I started this game in the first place was to be able to use droids in useful and meaningful ways. Unfortunately, the most meaningful way we can currently use droids is as mobile crafting stations....hardly what I had in mind. And unfortunately looking at the list of upcoming 'utility' modules to be added in the next publish, I still can't really see anything that will be useful to me.
While they've broken promises to other professions, I agree that the way they've handled this 'Droid Invasion' has been the biggestinsult.....not only to DEs but to every player who has been looking forward to it since they claimed that droids would be their 'primary focus' for the first 2 months of 2004. Unforunately, based on their past record with my own profession I can't say that I was totally suprised.
Last time I checked, during this time period Jedi were supposed to be ultra rare and droids plentiful. The fact that there will soon be more Jedi in this game then droids is proof that the devs priorities are totally messed up.
ReptileSpit wrote:
Last time I checked, during this time period Jedi were supposed to be ultra rare and droids plentiful. The fact that there will soon be more Jedi in this game then droids is proof that the devs priorities are totally messed up.
Message Edited by AudioOrgana on 04-03-2004 08:41 AM
A few points...
1. I still support TK. I'm sure he knew long before he posted that we would not like the killing of Sodan's Plan.
2. Plus if I recall correctly ...we drafted him...he didn't go around saying, "pick me, pick me".
3. The correspondent system is a poor solution to a diffcult problem. It's main purpose seems to be to take a respected member of the forum and make them take all the heat for the Dev's. TH serves the same purpose. The Dev's are busy but not that busy. They seem to post on lots of lesser topics. They could hire more people and visit more often if they wanted too.
4. Fighting with each other is part of the Psy-Op of this forum. Don't fall for it. We must stand together.
5. The Dev's did give us the short end of the stick in many ways. They will pay in the long run with their jobs like so many other games have. They may be in trouble already.... The Space Expansion may be the last gaspof a really flawed game.
6. There won't be a DH profession. Runesabre said as much. It is a waste of time to "define" one or give any input on it unles they come here and help.
7. Expect the Dev's to go into Crazy mode as E3 approches. They are going to show the SE there. A bad review will hurt them. Since this game is rated pretty low, they have a lot to worry about.
8. Oh yeah and its just a game we play for fun. I hope they add some in soon.
Edsoni, Metallic-CH Wanderhome
Well theres bound to be this sort of backlash from such frustration as we are feeling now. TKi hope understands thatbearing the brunt of the fire isall part of the job description. Ive come to believe that the alterior motive behind the correspondant system is to shield the Devs from us.
Its healthy to release anger and frustration (TK, "Come young DE, STRIKE ME DOWN") and i dont think it gonna break us apart as a community, rather we can come thru this and be stronger. But Shian you dont need to start a trans-atlantic war here. You know what my pa always say, "Dont go shootin tha messenga now."
From what I understand, Rangers and DEs both are often in the head-banging mode.
CikMatt wrote:
Sigh, I was hoping to not have to do this..
/banghead
Do all professions feel like the red-headed middle child, or just us?
/bow
Respectfully,
So FUC*ING do something about it instead of just accepting it !!
God almighty, I swear I'm glad I'm not American - the Government says and - Sir, Yes , Sir
/bow
Shian_Tavkin wrote:
So FUC*ING do something about it instead of just accepting it !!
What's that, Shian?
Come up with the magic bullet idea that will balance DE Hybrid perfectly so we can have it?
What should I do or sayexactly to force them to change their minds and see the error of their ways (...cause if you have it, I'd love to know)?
Quit? Yea..that won't work.
You once said (many of you did) that you trusted me....didn't you?
That I'd do a good job of representing what would be in the best interests of DEs, gathering info and gauging the attitudes? That I'd be able to champion positive results, communication and such?
That I'dbe a positive force for DE changes in the same way I tried to help build/maintain the DENets and DEA?
If so, what happened?!? I've only been at this for a relatively short time, Shian. It's not as if I can personally change everything on a dime.
God almighty, I swear I'm glad I'm not American - the Government says and - Sir, Yes , Sir
Hmmm....yea, two totally different things (though not without their similarities).
Military vs. Privately held and operatedsoftware/entertainment company.
Yea, I can see that comparison.
yeah I dont suppose this will be popular, but in Europe we actually challenge things. Hmm
Okay, so...I need to challenge them and basically argue for argument's sake about a dead horse?
Is that what you're putting forth?
This would turn into a "Argument Sketch" (Monty Python). "Yes it is!", "No it isn't", "Yes it is!", "No, it isn't"...
"Ugughg....This isn't an argument!"
"Yes it is..."
There's no point in challenging this. I'm telling you, straight up...we're more likely to see a DC profession that will get OUR touch/changes/proposals into its design and implementation.
There....I said it. Sorry. No, I don't think it's wise to challenge them on this Shian. I think that making DC what WE can make of it holds the best option. We know that they are leaning toward it and would be receptive to proposals on making it cool and NOT a metallic CH.
I have every confidence that a lot of the crowd I know here can do that. I've seen a good number of posts where some people state it is probably better and healthier for the Devs to simply say "No." and put down their foot.
This is one of those situations (sad though it is...since all the parties really wanted this to fly).
Respectfully,