Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: It's ok to have R2 Units with guns duct taped to their heads? Come on people...
Daker-Naritus wrote:
We killed the devs "guns on non-combat droids" idea once, I think it is an insult that devs have only half-assed listened to us and are now trying to sneak it back in, by just continuing to develop it and have noone tell us what is really going on (as in TH waiting to put out his droid report).
/nod.... Kinda makes you realize how worthless all that info gathering and voting and debating we all did in the past months was, huh?
I hope everyone is finaly realizing that our oppinions and voices don't mean squirt to the devs. They are going to do what ever they want regardless. Which is why my posts have become less and less constructive, because there is nothing constructive about 300 posts that are totaly ignored by those telling us to be constructive. Personaly Im being just as professional as the devs have been to us for 6 months.
cheers everyone, I still lub you all 
TheWoody wrote:
No! I think laser guns strapped to the heads of R2's IS STAR WARS! We should have every droid like that! Forget reasons... let's just argue about feeling. As such, are you to tell me that my feelings are wrong? That how I perceive my universe is flawed and that your rule is law?
As I stated in my posts, this only serves to benefit us and make droids even more 'swiss army' than they were before. We're not out to replace anything. We're here to provide assistance to those using the droids. Modular weaponry isn't going to be some showstopping combat thing, but an assistant to those who need a little extra firepower (especially novice DEs who don't have combat skills yet). It'll also increase sales as everyone will want that extra weapon module.
As I have stated in my previous posts, we have nothing to lose and everything to gain by letting this happen. Nothing will be destroyed. Nothing will be horribly wrecked and the profession wiped from the game. If you don't want your R2 spitting blue lasers or the like then don't build the module. But don't go around actively trying to stop the first development we've seen since beta. The devs adding something isn't insulting. Attacking them and trying to bring to a halt the first good news we've had in a while is.
Im sorry Woody but you do not represent the majority. As I remember, the majority of us were against non-combat droids getting combat capabilities. I am all for star wars BEING star wars and I for one am not goingto happily swallow this pitifull attempt by the devs to make DEs better. The only reason they are doing this is because its the easy way out for them as apposed to actualy workign to making our class better and more star wars like.
Im sorry woody but you just lost my vote because you do not represent the majority here. You represent you. Other than that, your a geat guy.
*patiently waits for bashing from woody's cirtuit of friends*
Ellewen, anyone has the right to have an opinion of their own, including a Correspondent, or someone that wished to become one. Just because a person makes a decision to stand up for what they think does not mean that they can't set aside those ideas, for the betterment of the community.Majority is a subjective word to use on any issue on these forums, since many people lurk in the shadows without posting unless something is hit upon that stirs them.
As to the entire discussion about R2 units have combat capabilities, no where has it been stated that all of the existing droids will have the ability to be combat ready. From what JustG stated and from what Thunderheart posted fairly recently, all indications point to Humanoid droids gaining combat functions and not the R series of droids. Lets face it, the Star Wars that we grew up with, and that which presently exists are two seperate entities now, due to all of the Extended Universe that has been released over the years. The one constant with the entire EU is that nothing is constant. The Star Wars Universe is vast beyond belief. It is full of infinite possiblities that are only limited by ones imagination.
When one states that something can not fit into the Star Wars Universe, that person is only thinking in a two-dimensional state of the universe, based on the limited perceptions of living on such a small plane of existance called Earth. The entire concept of a droid is non-static since it can be programed to perform a multitued of functions. Besides, we have to face the facts that nothing happens in the SWU without the final approval of LucasArts, which hasn't shown the greatest level of continuity, when compared to the films and books.
I think we should make R2D2 into the same kinda droid like on Men In Black 2 with all the gatling guns called GatBot or something.
Ya... if we're gonna go dumb... lets go dumb in style.
Anyway, on the more serious note. In all of my posts I try not to speak for all DEs, but for myself. Life is nothing more than a series of oppertunities, and I believe that the single worst thing we can do is limit our own oppertunities. Either we can make change out to be a bad thing or we can seize the change and use it to our advantage.
Officially I'll speak on whatever the populous believes, however the forum boards are not the populous in full. Quite frankly, this is a minority when it comes to droid engineers. It's the most vocal, but those here on the boards do not represent the profession as a whole. However if the entire profession demanded that they be taken out then I'd say take them out.
Unofficially, I'll say whatever I darn well please in order to stand up against damaging 'content.' As I said above, I believe in seizing oppertunity. I will not stand by when free oppertunity is wasted because some people don't like it. I don't have my FWG5 to your head forcing you to use weapon modules, it'll be your choice. If you really want to limit it then argue to take medical modules away and make surgicals the only droids to heal as well. And make R2s only have droid repair modules. Our profession is based on the idea of modularity. there is no reason to deny who we are. If we did with those examples above, our profession would truly die then as there would be almost no one interested in getting only one specific droid for each specific thing.
Alright. That should be about it, and I have to agree with one thign though.. if you're going to do anything, do it in style. What was it Jasper Carrot said? "If you're going to put your foot in it, go up to the groin"
Drashk wrote:
Ellewen, anyone has the right to have an opinion of their own, including a Correspondent, or someone that wished to become one. Just because a person makes a decision to stand up for what they think does not mean that they can't set aside those ideas, for the betterment of the community.Majority is a subjective word to use on any issue on these forums, since many people lurk in the shadows without posting unless something is hit upon that stirs them.
As to the entire discussion about R2 units have combat capabilities, no where has it been stated that all of the existing droids will have the ability to be combat ready. From what JustG stated and from what Thunderheart posted fairly recently, all indications point to Humanoid droids gaining combat functions and not the R series of droids. Lets face it, the Star Wars that we grew up with, and that which presently exists are two seperate entities now, due to all of the Extended Universe that has been released over the years. The one constant with the entire EU is that nothing is constant. The Star Wars Universe is vast beyond belief. It is full of infinite possiblities that are only limited by ones imagination.
When one states that something can not fit into the Star Wars Universe, that person is only thinking in a two-dimensional state of the universe, based on the limited perceptions of living on such a small plane of existance called Earth. The entire concept of a droid is non-static since it can be programed to perform a multitued of functions. Besides, we have to face the facts that nothing happens in the SWU without the final approval of LucasArts, which hasn't shown the greatest level of continuity, when compared to the films and books.
Yes, majority is a subjective word?!?, when your in the minority, you can surley say that in your defence. The facts are the facts. So I guess all those votes and debates we had in the past months were just fodder? You and your MINORITY need to remember what the MAJORITY voted. Les your just like SOE and here to sidetrack the truth. Swallow your pathetic table scraps from SOE if you like, I will not.
2 demensional blah blah blah... no where in any book, comic or movie has a noncombat droid had a combat (so-called) module. Stroke your self all you want, This IS NOT star wars. Heres an Idea for you.... Play "Anarchy Online", it doesnt PRETEND to be something that it isnt.
Ellewen wrote:
Yes, majority is a subjective word?!?, when your in the minority, you can surley say that in your defence. The facts are the facts. So I guess all those votes and debates we had in the past months were just fodder? You and your MINORITY need to remember what the MAJORITY voted. Les your just like SOE and here to sidetrack the truth. Swallow your pathetic table scraps from SOE if you like, I will not.
2 demensional blah blah blah... no where in any book, comic or movie has a noncombat droid had a combat (so-called) module. Stroke your self all you want, This IS NOT star wars. Heres an Idea for you.... Play "Anarchy Online", it doesnt PRETEND to be something that it isnt.
Ellewen, please explain to me were I stated that I was either for or against the introduction of combat modules being used for droids.I'm not for or against the concept at the moment, since at this stage it is nothing more than a concept still. I don't see any of these changes on the Test Center nor do I see a detailed description of what is being done at this time.Everyone is running withoff with information that was quite vague.
No where any any of the EU is there reference to crafting stations either, so your unthoughtout comment has no weight in such a discussion. If you have ever spent any time reading the RPG books from both West End Games and Wizards, you will take note that there are tons of variations of each type of droid. What a droid can do is not based on what purpose it was orginally created for. BlueMax, Bullox, 4-LOM, Leebo, R2, and 3PO are classic examplesof a droid going beyond what it was originally designed for.
I'll state it here and now, that I don't care for the concept of any of the existing non-Humanoid Droids currently in the game gaining combat functions, but not because of it would be un-Star Warsy.I don't care for the concept because there isn't enough justification to add such an ability to a droid that can't manipulate its surroundings like a Humanoid droid can. Sure you could add a blaster of some type in one of the R series compartments, but it would be far easier to simply reprogram a humanoid chassis. A Protocol droid or LE with Assassin sub-routines is seen in a number of locations in the EU, simply because they are designed to emulate the human range of motion and can be handed a weapon and told to fire.
It is quite obvious in your rantings that you don't have a clue about the SWG extended universe, so let me quote one for you: The core rule book from the current WoTC D20 version of SWRPG. Specificallly, the droid section where you can custom tailor any droid. Specifically, I'm quoting from the RCRB, first edition
Page 361 GM Character Droids:
"Like ordinary GM characters, a droid has one or more classes. Nearly all droids are professionals: diplomats, experts or thugs.... Every droid has a base attack bonus, base save bonuses, skill points... "
So, to start with, all droids can attack or do whatever they want. There is no limitation. A GM throughing an R2 at you with a laser hidden inside is well within the possibilities of this George Lucas approved extended universe.
Pg 364 Droid Appendages:
"Droids can use their appendages (probes, instruments, tools, claws or hands) to make unarmed attacks."
Pg 366 Modifying Droids:
Adding equipment not specifically designed for droids is a bot more problematic. For example, replacing a protocol droid's right arm with a vibro-ax would be extremely difficult. The DC for the Repair chaeck in such cases is 30"
So, there we have one explicit example of a Protocol Droid with a weapon.
PG 367-369 Droid Accessories:
Electroshock probe
This small appendage emits a breif electrical discharge, sufficent to short out a single computer terminal or security lock. Witha successful melee touch attack. the electro-stunner deals 2d6 damage to a mechanical being. It acts as a stun weapon on organic targets"
Flamethrower
The flamethrower is a ranged weapon that shoots a cone of burnin chemicals 8 metres long by 8 metres wide....
Weapon Mount
A droid is equipped with an appendage that has a weapon attached. The cost of the weapon is added to the cost of this equipment
Welding Laser/Cutting torch
... The welding lazer or cutting torch can be used as a melee weapon that deals 1d8 points of damage
For the effects of stun, note what happened to Leia at the start of ANH. She goes unconscious for a while. There are other clear examples here of droids of all types having weapons, or using their existing appendanges as weapons. There are no limitations on the abilities of droids other than what their core skill point set is. In addition, when the different droid types are listed as sample types, the first sentence is always "typical". For example on Page 371:
"Second Degree Droids
Second degree droids are typically experts. Specific models include the astromech droid. "
So, it seems you are mistaken about a great many things, particularly with regards to droids and combat. Indeed it is entirely possible that any droid can be fitted with combat capabilities in the universe. Unfortunately your clouded mind is not willing to accept this fact and only want to enforce your idea of what a combat-capable droid (not a combat droid, different thing) should and should not be.