Doctor Archive
Thread: What happened to the Hippocratic Oath? GCW ruins the doctor's proffession
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puppykickeris
Wed Mar 02, 2005 12:29 pm
#1
Help all, turn away none.
As a career doctor working my way up to master, this is what i always followed.
Help all, turn away none.
But this knew "uprising" of civil war has wrecked it.
A doctor can no longer be a healer in the traditional sense. Before this "civilian, combatant, special forces" update, I only had to worry about overt players. I understood this, but it didnt hurt as much because most did not go this route. Now im held to "Civilians and On-leaves" only.
This is a travasty to the profesion. I strive to heal all that come into my hospital, and it hurts that i have to look at a guy with complete blackrot, and I cant touch them because its "unwise." This means that this poor sod has to sit there and look at me with puppy eyes while I, in all my doctoral "uberness" cant even touch him. Lost XP for me, lost time for him.
In the field i can understand this, but in the inner-city clinic or the way-post, this is just completely unacceptable, so i propose this.
Make registered doctors at the inner-city clinics of in hospitals be able to heal civilians, on leaves, AND combatants. What can it hurt? It wont distroy the civil war in any way, and ill be able to heal this poor sod that walked into my clinic, even though he cant find a NPC faction recruiter.
Something needs to be done....I want to be a "doctor" again, not just a NPC.
As a career doctor working my way up to master, this is what i always followed.
Help all, turn away none.
But this knew "uprising" of civil war has wrecked it.
A doctor can no longer be a healer in the traditional sense. Before this "civilian, combatant, special forces" update, I only had to worry about overt players. I understood this, but it didnt hurt as much because most did not go this route. Now im held to "Civilians and On-leaves" only.
This is a travasty to the profesion. I strive to heal all that come into my hospital, and it hurts that i have to look at a guy with complete blackrot, and I cant touch them because its "unwise." This means that this poor sod has to sit there and look at me with puppy eyes while I, in all my doctoral "uberness" cant even touch him. Lost XP for me, lost time for him.
In the field i can understand this, but in the inner-city clinic or the way-post, this is just completely unacceptable, so i propose this.
Make registered doctors at the inner-city clinics of in hospitals be able to heal civilians, on leaves, AND combatants. What can it hurt? It wont distroy the civil war in any way, and ill be able to heal this poor sod that walked into my clinic, even though he cant find a NPC faction recruiter.
Something needs to be done....I want to be a "doctor" again, not just a NPC.
puppykickeris
Wed Mar 02, 2005 2:06 pm
#3
You miss understand the problem.
We are not talking about civilian medics and doctors being out there loading up stormtrooper killers with stimpacks.
We are talking about when your out as a combatant, hunting a bug, get deseased, and have your entire health bar blacked out. There is already a complaint about not being able to find NPCs to go on leave, but when you need to get healed, what do you do? You walk into a hospital where there are 4 doctors twiddling thier thumbs singing, "I cant help you, On-Leave and Civilians only."
So, who loses? The doctor loses out on XP and the Combatant loses out on gameplay time.
"Pick a side?" So i guess as a pure healer, i should get my butt shot off trying to get to a clinic with all of my states mitigated to mind, die, just so i could heal 1 faction. So your saying to excell as a doctor, I have to brave getting my butt kicked by faction NPCs to get to the hospital and die myself. Yea, keep your flames to yourself bud.
Sunakk
Wed Mar 02, 2005 2:47 pm
#4
Traigus wrote:
If the person really wants to be healed by a civvie, they can also go on-leave.
Well said. It's as easy as that, just have to know where the recruiters are. And since you clone On Leave, this shouldn't be as much of a problem for wounds given when dying.
Lieka wrote:
then bring back the tef system I am a Doctor darn it and want to held the sick and injured. this has ruined my roleplaying.
You can heal the sick and injured. They just have to go On Leave to be treatable. It's like lowering their attack posture. In the US, Ambulances aren't allowed to enter a scene before police because they don't want to risk their safety, even if there are injured people at the scene who need immediate help. Once a Combatant changes their status, or changes their fighting mode, however you want to look at it, then you're free to heal.
If you're in an army hospital, you can heal the wounded that come into your camp--but it's going to be the wounded from your side. And you're going to be a Combatant, as army hopsitals can be attacked too.
This system is in place to keep PvP and PvE separate and fair. Those who role play just have to add a small explanation for the new changes, and go from there.
Alyxian
Wed Mar 02, 2005 3:31 pm
#5
puppykickeris wrote:
You walk into a hospital where there are 4 doctors twiddling thier thumbs singing, "I cant help you, On-Leave and Civilians only."
Wow! You guys still have actual PC docs in hospitals?
/boggle
TarMangani
Wed Mar 02, 2005 5:14 pm
#6
Plus we have to try and remember that these rules exist due to this being a game based world. Look at the obvious I complain about...when leaving a shuttleport, I can't hop over a 1 foot wall to get out of the shuttleport.
Why is it when I run into a building, the building is suddenly hollow?
Why is it that when I train for Jedi, I'm told I have to sit and wait for three weeks before I can train on the next wave?
GAME BALANCE.
Healing is the same way. The rules have changed in order to balance the game... r/l rules don't always apply...
NoStyleGuy
Wed Mar 02, 2005 8:20 pm
#7
yah the whole police/ambulence/army hospital is a good point, but i look at myself as a Doctor in a St. Johns hospital, or a Beaumont, nota Paramedic in the field(thats probably combatmedi)
if a guy comes in from a gunfight withbullet in his thigh, i take it out, clean it out, and send him on his way(with a bill, but i buess you can't expect ppl to pay for service in SWG)
the fact taht doctors should have to brave combat like everyone else; i dont agree with, because the description of the game (in the prima guide at least) says that if u aren't one for combat, "dont worry" you can be pefectly safe in the comfines of a hospital.
basically i think doctors should be able to heal anybody, of any faction, except PvPers. and then they could give u the message if u wanna become a PvP doctor.
i guessi could even live with getting the message to be able to heal combatants, but let us heal both factions plz. i despise imperials, don't get me wrong, but since i dont use tumblers(i am tempted to use em, but not yet) i need to heal as manny ppl as possible
just some info from a novice doc
Traigus
Thu Mar 03, 2005 1:21 am
#9
First off...
No such oath in the SW universe.. Hell everyone on Earth doesn't even have to sign it.
Basically, it allows cheating on the combat side if you heal someone without any risk to yourself. You are an unkillable healer, risking nothing, but making PVP or PVE play easier as a result.
If you want to heal PVE players... pick a side, and run the risk of factional NPCs shooting you.
Healing someone who is mowing down stormtroopers in PVE (or other players in PVP) while you remain immune to attack is cheap and wrong.
If the person really wants to be healed by a civvie, they can also go on-leave.
-T
No such oath in the SW universe.. Hell everyone on Earth doesn't even have to sign it.
Basically, it allows cheating on the combat side if you heal someone without any risk to yourself. You are an unkillable healer, risking nothing, but making PVP or PVE play easier as a result.
If you want to heal PVE players... pick a side, and run the risk of factional NPCs shooting you.
Healing someone who is mowing down stormtroopers in PVE (or other players in PVP) while you remain immune to attack is cheap and wrong.
If the person really wants to be healed by a civvie, they can also go on-leave.
-T
Lieka
Thu Mar 03, 2005 1:29 am
#10
then bring back the tef system I am a Doctor darn it and want to held the sick and injured. this has ruined my roleplaying.
blacke
Thu Mar 03, 2005 5:40 am
#11
I've read most of what's been said here and on other similar threads and there are both good and bad points to both sides. Many say that this will be "exploited" to have a civilian healer that goes safe from all combat, but those who say haven't realy read everything that's been said.
Most of the suggestion are that the "heal all" mode is only when inside a medcenterand, some have said to only extend it to combatants.
So, how many battles actully take part inside a medcenter?
Also, I would like this to be extended to only affect wound healing, not damage healing. Honestly, how many bother to heal wounds during fights? Unless you are blackbared, and most times not even then, you won't bother with wound healing unless you are unbuffed.
Some compared this to army hospitals: "If you're in an army hospital, you can heal the wounded that come into your camp--but it's going to be the wounded from your side. And you're going to be a Combatant, as army hopsitals can be attacked too." Even if you are an army doctor, there still is the medical oath taken.
If I remember it correctly, not treating a wounded enemy is in violation with the Geneve conventions (spelling?).
I know we don't have a medical oath by game-rules, but many likes to play as if there charater has taken it. Secondly, this is suppose to be "Your saga", and if that includes being forced into the GCW althou you realy don't want to, then it's no longer "Your saga".
By being forced to take sides to effectivly more people, then it's not SWG: Galaxies anymore but SWG: GCW.
And tell me "just go on-leave" becouse some peps just don't want to get a buff for the purpose of going on leave becouse they need a heal. On my server, Farstar, the rebellion has taken Correlia, but in Coronet cantina, where a reb recruter is, there are ST's (5-6). To get past them, either you are lucky being aggroed by them one by one, or your buffed. Maybe a 80% comp suite will help much, but how many peps without any combat proffesions wear comp armor?
Most of the suggestion are that the "heal all" mode is only when inside a medcenterand, some have said to only extend it to combatants.
So, how many battles actully take part inside a medcenter?
Also, I would like this to be extended to only affect wound healing, not damage healing. Honestly, how many bother to heal wounds during fights? Unless you are blackbared, and most times not even then, you won't bother with wound healing unless you are unbuffed.
Some compared this to army hospitals: "If you're in an army hospital, you can heal the wounded that come into your camp--but it's going to be the wounded from your side. And you're going to be a Combatant, as army hopsitals can be attacked too." Even if you are an army doctor, there still is the medical oath taken.
If I remember it correctly, not treating a wounded enemy is in violation with the Geneve conventions (spelling?).
I know we don't have a medical oath by game-rules, but many likes to play as if there charater has taken it. Secondly, this is suppose to be "Your saga", and if that includes being forced into the GCW althou you realy don't want to, then it's no longer "Your saga".
By being forced to take sides to effectivly more people, then it's not SWG: Galaxies anymore but SWG: GCW.
And tell me "just go on-leave" becouse some peps just don't want to get a buff for the purpose of going on leave becouse they need a heal. On my server, Farstar, the rebellion has taken Correlia, but in Coronet cantina, where a reb recruter is, there are ST's (5-6). To get past them, either you are lucky being aggroed by them one by one, or your buffed. Maybe a 80% comp suite will help much, but how many peps without any combat proffesions wear comp armor?
Traigus
Thu Mar 03, 2005 8:47 am
#12
blacke wrote:
I've read most of what's been said here and on other similar threads and there are both good and bad points to both sides. Many say that this will be "exploited" to have a civilian healer that goes safe from all combat, but those who say haven't realy read everything that's been said.
Most of the suggestion are that the "heal all" mode is only when inside a medcenterand, some have said to only extend it to combatants.
So, how many battles actully take part inside a medcenter?
Also, I would like this to be extended to only affect wound healing, not damage healing. Honestly, how many bother to heal wounds during fights? Unless you are blackbared, and most times not even then, you won't bother with wound healing unless you are unbuffed.
Some compared this to army hospitals: "If you're in an army hospital, you can heal the wounded that come into your camp--but it's going to be the wounded from your side. And you're going to be a Combatant, as army hopsitals can be attacked too." Even if you are an army doctor, there still is the medical oath taken.
If I remember it correctly, not treating a wounded enemy is in violation with the Geneve conventions (spelling?).
I know we don't have a medical oath by game-rules, but many likes to play as if there charater has taken it. Secondly, this is suppose to be "Your saga", and if that includes being forced into the GCW althou you realy don't want to, then it's no longer "Your saga".
By being forced to take sides to effectivly more people, then it's not SWG: Galaxies anymore but SWG: GCW.
And tell me "just go on-leave" becouse some peps just don't want to get a buff for the purpose of going on leave becouse they need a heal. On my server, Farstar, the rebellion has taken Correlia, but in Coronet cantina, where a reb recruter is, there are ST's (5-6). To get past them, either you are lucky being aggroed by them one by one, or your buffed. Maybe a 80% comp suite will help much, but how many peps without any combat proffesions wear comp armor?
Well any personal oath you make CANNOT be used as a justification to change the rules for all players. The OP wanted this. I hate nunas. That doesn't mean the game rules should be changed so they are removed.
Combat happens al lthe time in cities, and now with the GCW changes, healign combatants ahs athe same exploitable quality as healing PVP people. The factional NPCs would nto be able to kill the doc who is invulnerably healing the combatant. That is flat out cheating.
This is not about the USA, Earth or the hospital around the corner from youre house. It is about game mechanics and cheating... nothing more, nothing less. if there is a more realistic way to do something, then I'm sure the devs would be all for it.
How would any of you allow the healing of COmbatanats by neutrals in a way that kept people from cheating? In te end, al lthe solutions would be ther TEF.. WHich al lthe neutral types hated because they would have to risk death.
You can't have the cake and eat it to.
A cobatant can be attacked by NPCs at any time. New spawn pops, probe droid scans... shuttle landings. Putting in code so you can heal him when he's fightign a spider, (bewcause the spider CAN attack you), and not allow you to heal the same guy when he shoots a stormie (because the stormie can't attack you) is a lot of work). The player flags are simpler, and easy to understand.
Wanting to heal thet guy who fights stormies, but never risking being attacked by that stormie, or other stormies that show up is simply a cheat, exploitive, and wrong. Nobody ever argues, that the spiders, krettles or ewoks shouldn't be able to attack healers, but when it comes to GCW NPCs everyone wants to hide safely behind neutrality and heal whomever they want, without any thought to the repercussions.
Before this everyone wanted to heal the PVP players without risk. Same reasons, same examples, same lack of thought about the larger impact on gameplay.
You want to stay immune from factional GCW NPCS, you gotta accept the fact you can't impact the gameplay that involves them.
-T
Gouta
Thu Mar 03, 2005 12:54 pm
#13
What about a Civilian Medic/Doc being able to heal a imperial/rebel combatant as long as they havent engaged in combat. The TEF flag still exists in the game so if a combatant has that flag the civilian Medic/Doc is unable to heal, but if that flag doesn't exist then the would be permitted to heal.
Players are starting to get used to this but a new player starting out as a medic will have a hard time getting medical xp if all they get is it would be unwise to help this patient.
EDIT: Edited for spelling
Players are starting to get used to this but a new player starting out as a medic will have a hard time getting medical xp if all they get is it would be unwise to help this patient.
EDIT: Edited for spelling
Message Edited by Gouta on 03-03-2005 11:58 AM
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