Doctor Archive

Thread: Changes on vendors(merchant skill change)..Please read

SpunkyKuma
Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:14 am
#53
Wow greatly expressed on that last post, I'm glad it's being fixed that you cannot retain vendors and drop the profession. I have master doctor, was musician 4000 and now working on pistoleer 0044 along with artisan 0040 and merchant 4000 to host 2 vendors. I'm sure there'll be alot of empty vendors in houses that has an entry fee disappearing after the fix.

Although I think a master doctor should be allowed to host a vendor in a medic center for a higher maintainance fee, I'd be happy with that.



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Mordeth123
Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:16 am
#54
Vendor in a hospital is a great idea actually

And Homebreu, if there's anyone that needs to grow up it's you, I try to keep this discussion civilized, but kids like you don't know WHERE THE CAPS BUTTON IS


Anyways, I didn't start this thread out of greed, sellfishness or anything like that. I started this thread because I care for those who have to buy our overprized med supplies. And I'm affraid the prices will be even higher when this bug gets fixed. I'm however glad they fix the bug, but Docs must sacrifice so much more than elite artisans professions have to do. What I want is that there is some merchant skills added into the doc skill tree, just something that could give people alteast one vendor. If that doesn't happen, well I'm sure there will be alot less doctors selling medical supplies, and that is not a good thing.



___________Etilania's Stims and Buffpacks___________
Top Quality Buffpacks, Stimpacks and Woundpacks made by Etilania at:
The Desert Oasis Mall: Tatooine, Bestine, -1900 -3875 and
_____StarWares Mall: Naboo, Theed, -3971, 4579_____
lIn-Game Names : Etilania and Archeonl

Radar-X
Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:32 am
#55
How many times are we going to re-visit this topic?! If you want to sell stuff you need to be a merchant. What purpose is Merchant if you can't? They have stated since forever this was their intention and somehow miraculously people still keep coming out of the woodwork shocked and appalled. They are not going to create "special doctor merchants" or "pharmacies" or any of that other crap. If you want combat skills and to be a doctor your not going to be selling meds outside of the bazaar anymore. You can petition, complain, etc all day about it but this is what is fair to the merchant class. Open up your eyes and take a look at the larger picture. Sorry if this sounds cynical but this has seriouslly been beaten to death more than once.



Klabra


"It is only one who is thoroughly aquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on"
Scoooter
Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:15 am
#56




Agent001 wrote:


nope, not mastered


thats the point of having a skills based system, it lets you mix and match differnt parts of different proffessions to get what you want. But you stillhave to make compromises. You cant have everything.

Message Edited by Agent001 on 05-30-2004 02:21 PM





Yes but doctor/cm is a little different in that it is one of the few professions that require mastering the basic professions.


All other crafting professions have enough points to master a combat prof in addition to their elite crafting profession and get business and survey.


Doctors are hampered because they must master the basic profession.


Now it make sense that you must master medic first, but since the medical professions are not based off the artisan tree they are hampered which is why on the top 10 medical survey and medical vendor types always keep coming up.


Doctors get excluded form content that other crafters can get to because thay can master a combat profession along with their elite crafting skill because they have to take a huge skill point hit to go up the artisan tree even one box (novice artisan is 15 of the 19 extra points).








Scoooter - Master Pilot/Master Politician
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Radar-X
Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:30 am
#57




Scoooter wrote:



BTW that is also why thes have always been a balance issue that we are not on a level playing field with other crafters.






You got problems with that statement right there and I think thats what a ton of you upset about this are missing. We as doctors are not crafters. Just because we can make our medicine doesn't make us a full crafting class. How many Smugglers do you think you are going to find referring to themselves as crafters? Doctor's are hybrids pure and simple. I know its been said higher in the thread but no crafting class has any skill other being able to manufacture something. Doc's have combat related skills. You guys have got to stop comparing yourselves to WS, AS, Chef, etc because its apples and oranges. Smuggler and Doc are both hybrid classes which combine combat and crafting skills into one class. Granted Smuggler takes nowhere near the amount of SP's but how much demand is there for Smuggler's vs Docs? You are either going to have to be a Doctor and a Combat class or a Doctor anda Merchant. There is no way to give credibility to the Merchant class any other way. Besides even if they gave you guys your "one merchant" they would probably institute a item limit eventually and you would complain you couldn't stock 500 items on your one vendor anymore. Either way constantly complaining about this isn't going to change what they are going to do. Anyone that has been reading the forums knows the direction the Devs are heading....



Klabra


"It is only one who is thoroughly aquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on"
Radar-X
Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:31 am
#58




Scoooter wrote:



BTW that is also why thes have always been a balance issue that we are not on a level playing field with other crafters.






You got problems with that statement right there and I think thats what a ton of you upset about this are missing. We as doctors are not crafters. Just because we can make our medicine doesn't make us a full crafting class. How many Smugglers do you think you are going to find referring to themselves as crafters? Doctor's are hybrids pure and simple. I know its been said higher in the thread but no crafting class has any skill other being able to manufacture something. Doc's have combat related skills. You guys have got to stop comparing yourselves to WS, AS, Chef, etc because its apples and oranges. Smuggler and Doc are both hybrid classes which combine combat and crafting skills into one class. Granted Smuggler takes nowhere near the amount of SP's but how much demand is there for Smuggler's vs Docs? You are either going to have to be a Doctor and a Combat class or a Doctor anda Merchant. There is no way to give credibility to the Merchant class any other way. Besides even if they gave you guys your "one merchant" they would probably institute a item limit eventually and you would complain you couldn't stock 500 items on your one vendor anymore. Either way constantly complaining about this isn't going to change what they are going to do. Anyone that has been reading the forums knows the direction the Devs are heading....



Klabra


"It is only one who is thoroughly aquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on"
Greenbulb
Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:38 am
#59
Half of the Doctors Use All the Crafting Skills they have and sell them in a vendor. Where do you get your Buff packs? Craftin them or buying them from a crafting Doctor?



-------------------------------------
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Ledao
Wed Jun 02, 2004 1:10 pm
#60

I'm fairly amazed this debate is still raging...


To me, it seems like a complete waste of energy to complain about Doctors' (and CMs, of course) lack of a vendor. Vendors are an artisan based skill, Docs and CMs are medic based. You can rationalize it however you'd like, but giving Docs and CMs vendors would totally contradict the skill system in place (and everything the devs have ever said about it...), and isn't likely to happen for that reason.


The merchant fix is going to happen, at some point. No matter how much we cry... That's why it's a "fix", not a "nerf".


What we should be taking about, I'll assert, is support for consignment sales. If there was a reliable (and relatively painless) mechanism for both listing consignments and distributing revenue, coupled with the removal of vendors from non-active merchants, all of our shopping (and selling) problems would be solved. More merchants would crop up, and it would cease to be a choice between requiring a merchant to buy products in advance, and thereby limiting stock levels, or giving him stuff, and trusting that you'll be paid.


Our energy, as a community, should be directed toward a) making the devs aware that they cannot implement the vendor fix without simultaneously adding working consignment sales, and b) determining how such a thing might ideally work...


Ledao




Ledao Bohi, Master Doctor
Now with 3 locations: Ledao's Meds in beautiful downtown Galatorbria, Rori (327 -1770), Ledao's Fine Pharmaceuticals @ UAT City, near Coronet (970, -5590), and Ledao's Premium Meds and Resources on Tatooine @ (-1922, -4041) just 750m SW of Bestine.
Comprehensive Stock and Price Listing Here
Mordeth123
Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:07 pm
#61

Some very nice ideas you have there.


Would just like to add AGAIN, that I'm all for the merchant fix, what I'm concerned about is that this change will discourage people to become master doctor(more than anyother profession)and selling medical supplies, and that will give higher price on med stuff, basiclyyou could sayI'm taking the customers side in this discussion The price bump is what I want to address on this thread, though people doesn't seem to understand that, maybe I'm just very bad at explaining what I mean





___________Etilania's Stims and Buffpacks___________
Top Quality Buffpacks, Stimpacks and Woundpacks made by Etilania at:
The Desert Oasis Mall: Tatooine, Bestine, -1900 -3875 and
_____StarWares Mall: Naboo, Theed, -3971, 4579_____
lIn-Game Names : Etilania and Archeonl

Anuk
Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:17 pm
#62




DarthXanthic wrote:

I think agent is 100% right.


The way it is now is a joke in the face of the merchant profession.


What if you could master TKM, then drop TKM and keep the skills?


Merchant is the only profession that you can drop it and keep the skills.


There are two options: do what Agent said, or buy a second account (like I did) and master merchant with him.





Vendors are not skills it is an object! Anyways, I really believe that Master Doc and MCM should be granted 1 Vendor at Master.




Anuk Se'Namon (Daragon V Ahazi)
11 POINT MASTER DOCTOR/TERA KASI MASTER
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Scoooter
Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:21 pm
#63

Ledeo,


I dont see anyone complaining that this is a nerf. It is in fact a fix. It should have never been that way in the first place.


Any talk of consignment sales and such should probably ne in the Merchan forum since it does affect not only docyors, but Rangers,BE,resouce vendorsand any other class that sells their wares


The fact there are balance issues with Doctor that do not place us on a level field does not alter the fact that the change to merchant is a correction to an existing problem. It just brings it out more. Just as the medical survey issue.


However what has always been proposed is a medical vendor type. Well that is a proposed solution,not the issue. The issue is not also that merchant is being fixed.


How a balance issue is actually solved does not necesarily mean that a solution we propose is the one selected to fix it.


A different solition could be found.


In the mean time SOE is making a lot of money on alts that are Artisan/Merchant lol.





Scoooter - Master Pilot/Master Politician
ScootBacca - Master Creature Handler/Master Rifleman
Co-Leader - mVa
Mayor of Mos Vegas, Tatooine, Valcyn
Ledao
Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:35 pm
#64




Mordeth123 wrote:

Some very nice ideas you have there.


Would just like to add AGAIN, that I'm all for the merchant fix, what I'm concerned about is that this change will discourage people to become master doctor(more than anyother profession)and selling medical supplies, and that will give higher price on med stuff, basiclyyou could sayI'm taking the customers side in this discussion The price bump is what I want to address on this thread, though people doesn't seem to understand that, maybe I'm just very bad at explaining what I mean







I just don't see it.


With the current (miserable, painful) vendor/merchant system, most paid merchants seem to get no more than 10% of gross revenue. I pay somewhat less than that for mine, and after the fix (which, we have to suppose, will come with a revamp of the vendor interface to make everyone's lives easier...) we should expect that percentage to do anything but rise... At any rate, enough of the big crafters will take merchant themselves (and thus avoid paying a percentage) that prices will remain roughly constant.


For doctors specifically, it must be remembered that we have two distinct types of products: enhance packs, and everything else.


Everything else (which generally has a low profit margin) is cheap enough to sell on the bazaar. If you're moving enough stim andwoundpacks and the like to warrant a vendor, well, you could probably get away with raising your prices 5-10%to make up the difference.


Enhance packs, of course, provide a sizeable profit margin (although, sadly, nothing like armor...). Competition (and the number of major medical crafters that either have, or will have, merchant alts) will keep prices roughly where they are.



Now, all this aside, I think certain medical products could certainly stand a general price increase. A set of buffs continues to be the best deal in the game... Three hours of being able to kill more or less whatever you want: 10-15k. And, of course, because buffs are so cheap and easy to obtain, stimpack sales are nothing like they were last Fall. If buffs increased in price to the point where people had to seriously consider whether or not to get them, not only would stimpack sales increase, but a market would re-emerge for doctors working their way up to master to sell B or C enhances...


Anyway...




Ledao Bohi, Master Doctor
Now with 3 locations: Ledao's Meds in beautiful downtown Galatorbria, Rori (327 -1770), Ledao's Fine Pharmaceuticals @ UAT City, near Coronet (970, -5590), and Ledao's Premium Meds and Resources on Tatooine @ (-1922, -4041) just 750m SW of Bestine.
Comprehensive Stock and Price Listing Here
Ledao
Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:48 pm
#65




Scoooter wrote:

Ledeo,


I dont see anyone complaining that this is a nerf. It is in fact a fix. It should have never been that way in the first place.


Any talk of consignment sales and such should probably ne in the Merchan forum since it does affect not only docyors, but Rangers,BE,resouce vendorsand any other class that sells their wares


The fact there are balance issues with Doctor that do not place us on a level field does not alter the fact that the change to merchant is a correction to an existing problem. It just brings it out more. Just as the medical survey issue.


However what has always been proposed is a medical vendor type. Well that is a proposed solution,not the issue. The issue is not also that merchant is being fixed.


How a balance issue is actually solved does not necesarily mean that a solution we propose is the one selected to fix it.


A different solition could be found.


In the mean time SOE is making a lot of money on alts that are Artisan/Merchant lol.


(emphasis mine)




Scoooter,


Here's the thing, which I suppose I glossed over in my earlier post: There is no balance issue. I'm glad you brought up medical survey, in fact, since that one has been addressed both directly and clearly by the devs in the past... No crafting profession (well, except master artisan, I suppose) gets vendors, they merely get more ready access to them by virtue of already having novice artisan. Similarly, they don't get surveying...


As many, many people have already brought up, Doctors and Combat Medics are compensated in other ways for their difficulty in accessing the artisan skilltrees. I won't waste space by listing them again...


If they are to add a medical vendor for master doctors, shouldn't they also add an Organics and Camps vendor for Master Rangers? Why not a resource vendor for anyone with surveying 4?



Whether we like it or not, class interdependency is an important part of the game. Doctors are not meant to control all aspects of the production and distribution of their wares. Just as we all hire hunters, or miners, or surveyors, so too should we all hire merchants.


Ledao




Ledao Bohi, Master Doctor
Now with 3 locations: Ledao's Meds in beautiful downtown Galatorbria, Rori (327 -1770), Ledao's Fine Pharmaceuticals @ UAT City, near Coronet (970, -5590), and Ledao's Premium Meds and Resources on Tatooine @ (-1922, -4041) just 750m SW of Bestine.
Comprehensive Stock and Price Listing Here
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