Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Jedi Feedback: Jedi Powers
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VoodooExtreme
Tue Jun 15, 2004 8:34 pm
#1
Dark Jedi.
I tried Force Lightning,Mindblast, Force KD, Forcechoke, Force Weaken, Forcearmor, Forceshield, Resist states, Resist Poison, Resist bleed, Resist Disease, Force run2, Force Speed 2.
I liked Force Armor,Force run2, Force Speed 2. Without these basic skills, a Jedi cannot hope to survive.
I didn't quite like Force Lightning because it's based off the saber damage. So it's basically a Saber in lightning form. Mindblast didn't quite fit in because the master saber move like flurry also applies similar states to an enemy. Same thing with Force KD, with Saber throw 2, this power is kinda redundant and with foods like thakatillo, renders this force power useless. Force choke and Force Weaken 2are bothcool butineffective against buffed targets.
Furthermore I feel that the resist mods for the Resist states, poison, bleed and disease should be increased. I had states that stuck on me forlong periods of time even though I had these force powers activated.
Thunderheart
Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:52 pm
#2
Wereyou a light or dark Jedi?
Which powers did you use?
What did you like? What didn't you like?
izzysplace
Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:38 pm
#3
On my current build I do not have any force powers and the template needed to be robust enough to PVP so I went with Master Ligtsabre and master Defender with Synergy 4 and novice healing the regen granted at Synergy 4 though is very nive the and sabre specials seem to have been worked out and do more damage now thats good in my eyes hehe.
VoodooExtreme
Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:43 pm
#4
Dark Jedi.
I tried Force Lightning,Mindblast, Force KD, Forcechoke, Force Weaken, Forcearmor, Forceshield, Resist states, Resist Poison, Resist bleed, Resist Disease, Force run2, Force Speed 2.
I liked Force Armor,Force run2, Force Speed 2. Without these basic skills, a Jedi cannot hope to survive.
I didn't quite like Force Lightning because it's based off the saber damage. So it's basically a Saber in lightning form. Mindblast didn't quite fit in because the master saber move like flurry also applies similar states to an enemy. Same thing with Force KD, with Saber throw 2, this power is kinda redundant and with foods like thakatillo, renders this force power useless. Force choke and Force Weaken 2are bothcool butineffective against buffed targets.
Furthermore I feel that the resist mods for the Resist states, poison, bleed and disease should be increased. I had states that stuck on me forlong periods of time even though I had these force powers activated.
shagon
Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:45 pm
#5
As a G-4444 Rebel I used all the powers and sabers.
I like all the powers and stuff we had with the current jedi system on live.
Didnt like duel saber being low on dmg and unable to use pearls (fixed on revamp)
Dont like Jedi cant put out fires on themselves.
FlagJin
Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:58 pm
#6
On live- I am a dark apprentice and love the lightning trees(pve). Hitting for huge damage is what lightning is all about and I love the animation. Force throw is ok. Mindblast is awesome too but I wish in pvp it did direct mind damage as the name suggests it would. All in all though on live I don't sue these too often as they cost too much force to use and a saber auto attack seems more viable in 99% of situations.
In testing I have found that without the defense line and a majority of skill points invested into lightsaber having force power is not a viable template. I have seen testing of weaken and choke on unbuffed opponents and they seem to be very deadly but I dueled one of the council members while buffed(before the free buffs) and they could not but a dent in me with any of the force power moves, weaken, choke, lightning etc. For the skill point cost and the force pool cost these seem to be very useless. Master defense is a must for any template hoping to get into the frs. I have had a different template since every reroll and the only one I lasted with was master defense...but I'd rather if at all possible keep a template with master healer because I feel in a group it would come in handy the most and I loathe going to cantinas to heal wounds and battle fatigue.
I think that the trees even though they are spread out and all are not really useful to make a template that a jedi would be worthy of and dissolving one of the jedi profesions into the others would be a good solution to this problem...possibly using the force weilder profession as the guinee pig.
In testing I have found that without the defense line and a majority of skill points invested into lightsaber having force power is not a viable template. I have seen testing of weaken and choke on unbuffed opponents and they seem to be very deadly but I dueled one of the council members while buffed(before the free buffs) and they could not but a dent in me with any of the force power moves, weaken, choke, lightning etc. For the skill point cost and the force pool cost these seem to be very useless. Master defense is a must for any template hoping to get into the frs. I have had a different template since every reroll and the only one I lasted with was master defense...but I'd rather if at all possible keep a template with master healer because I feel in a group it would come in handy the most and I loathe going to cantinas to heal wounds and battle fatigue.
I think that the trees even though they are spread out and all are not really useful to make a template that a jedi would be worthy of and dissolving one of the jedi profesions into the others would be a good solution to this problem...possibly using the force weilder profession as the guinee pig.
TickTock
Wed Jun 16, 2004 6:42 pm
#7
neutral Jedi
Channelforce - With buffs, very nice. Without, rather suicidal.
Transferforce - It would be nice if you could choose how much force to transfer on teh command line.
Drainforce - Not sure if this really did much....
Lightningsingle - Nice, but compared to master lightsaber, not worth the force cost. It's gotten better, but it still has a way to go.
Lightningcone - Same problems as above, and for the extra cost a cone isn't really useful unless you have someone to take hte beating for you.
Mindblast1&2 - Pretty good. Damage is negligible though, and I'm surprised they even do damage.
Intimidate1,2,3 - They do what they're supposed to. They can be a bit costly on force though.
Knockdown1,2,3 - Kind've costly when it so rarely hits enemies that you actually need it on. Accuracy boost would make them more worthwhile.
Weaken - If I can only use choke or weaken, I don't think I'll ever be using this power.
Forcearmor - does what it's supposed to
Forceshield - I assume it does what it's supposed to....
Choke - Very good against a single enemy. Not sure if it's effective enough for PvP though.
Forcespeed - Does what it's supposed to
Animal scare, animal attack, animal calm - Not sure why anyone would use these powers. You don't get xp for scaring stuff off....
JMT - Haven't had a single opportunity to use it.
Forcethrow - well, it's sort've cheap. But again, outclassed by sabers.
Force Powers review - Some of the recent changes have improved it, but it needs more to be a viable alternative to lightsaber. Lightning isn't strong enough for how much it costs, compared to what I've seen sabers do. I would not mind seeing a /lightningarea in the Master Force Power box. Most of the problem with the Powers tree is almost everything it can do, Lightsabers can do better/cheaper. Why mindblast when I can dervish for faster and cheaper, and in the area right around me? Why /forceknockdown when I can saberthrow for faster and cheaper? KD2 and 3 do hit areas, but you usually can't keep your enemies down so it's only a brief delay, and as I said earlier hitting KD on enemies you need it to hit can be very hard/costly. Due to speed, Lightsaber does more damage, and costs sufficiently less than Powers to be able to use the specials more often. LS also has better area attacks due to the spin moves. The only really useful Powers abilities I feel are Choke(good DOT) and Intimidate(anti-defense stackers).
A quick pro/con list of saber vs. power
Saber
PROS
- Faster
- Comes with defense bonuses
- Unresistable
- Lower force costs
- More spins
CONS
- No intimidate(I believe)
- Limited ranged ability
Powers
PROS
- Some high damage attacks
- Better vs. groups of ranged(saberthrow will just KD individual ranged)
- More cones
CONS
- Tends to be expensive
- Some useless abilityes(animal scare?)
- Once you're out of force, there is no default attack to continue using that doesn't use Force.
- Resistable
Recommendations:
- Better accuracy mods at master(more defense penetration?)
- Lightning needs more oomph
- Lightningarea special at master? Powers has nothing for being surrounded
- Give force powers boxes extra force regen. As it is, synergy 4 is almost mandatory.
Halfblood
Wed Jun 16, 2004 6:51 pm
#8
I agree with FlagJin, I would also like to add that Force Powers are really not a needed thing. I use to like them because it made me a Jedi in character. It wouldnt really be a Jedi without having some cool looking graphical move to show off 
But with the limitted amount of skills points most of us are going to pick the best available for the amount of cost. I have also tried many different templates on TC2. The first time, I did not master any trees, I tried to dabble in all the 5 trees to try to come up with a template close to anything a live guardian would have and it wasnt happening. The new system is not kind to Jedi that want to dabble in all 5 trees since the low tier boxes are the most costly and all the benefits are at higher or master levels. Pretty horrible if you ask me, how we cant even get the minimum skills that we had on live. I just cant see a Jedi without force powers but with the new system and the way things are in this game defense means a lot and it would almost be instant death to not have it for a Jedi. If the skill point system was relaxed more I am sure you would see more Jedi get these skills and make the Jedi actually look Jedish yet not all created equal like you would like to see.
Aluvia
Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:03 pm
#9
I took the force lightning tree after the 2nd re-roll and it has improved quite nicely, the single targer version at least. I have yet to see much use in a "cone effect" attack on a melee class though. Its almost impossible to get the AE version of lightning to hit more than one target. Neat asthey might be with the severe limits on how many boxes we can learn in the Jedi trees becuase of the high skill point cost ......I dont see force powers being in any template I can imagine playing.
If your Including Force Healing in "force powers"
Force healing is very weak from top to bottom ..... todays patch did not help at all especially the nerf of the "total heals". I played the role of a healerafter todays patch with 3 other jedi fighting Krayt Dragons. I wasOOF (out of force) about a minuteor two into each fight and if twoof the other Jedihad not had the self healing line it wouldhavebeen all over but the crying.Other than mind damage my master doctor can heal circles around my master jedi healer at about 1/10 the time and effort invested In just the healing tree. The speed, and force cost vs how much is healed is still way out of wack.
TheGuru5575
Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:19 pm
#10
Light Jedi Apprentice 4/2/3/2
Force Powers i use consistently:
Mindblast (PvP)
Force Lightning Single (Gotta have that, Jedi Masters use it 
)
)All the Healing Powers (Damage/Wound/Poison/Disease Cures)
Force Knockdown
Saber Powers I use:
Saber Flurry (Owns)
Saber Throw
Saber Slash 1 and 2
Havent found alot of use for the others in PvE, but we need to be able to create a combat capable template against current normal templates that also allow us to include Force powers, otherwise we are nothing more than Master Fencer/Master Docs that use a glowing sword!!!
StringereDomani
Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:31 pm
#11
Thunderheart wrote:
Indeed...good question, TH. That's what most Jedi are wondering...and that's why most Jedi are not entirely (or even marginally satisfied) with this "revamp". What is a Jedi without Force powers? Well, basically, a Jedi post revamp...that's what they are. You're taking away most of the Force powers we have currently.
Mizry
Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:32 pm
#12
After todays tc patch I used total heal other 3 times just to heal the wounds that a friend incurred from just 1 duel with a bounty hunter. Come on, surely this isnt the planned direction you are taking with this Master only heal. Also does force speed 2 work in healing? I have noticed no difference when using it while healing, as all heals in this line are horridly slow.
kronus909
Wed Jun 16, 2004 7:37 pm
#13
In live i have a dark jedi.
Jedi powers should be just as important as having a Lightsaber, lots of ppl sway from the new force power tree , do to the high costs that they are not really as effective . Most of the specials do not work as intended in live , and the only reasons i use force throw and lightning is to get the maximum exp of lairs.
Now since im a Dark Jedi , i think force powers should there main source of power and damage . TickTock is right because sabers now can do the same amount of damage and costs much less , and is more effective. Anybody with over 50 points of any state defense can easily negate one or two uses of lets force knockdown , or mindblast. They should be made so they stick everytime , As of now u can easily spend more than 500 force just to stick a dizzy on someone, then spend another of couple extra force moves to knock them down,
I like the changes to Choke and Lightning they do the damage that are supposed to be doing in TC2 , but choke doesnt work on buffed players it seems?
i guess its a bug and is being addressed,
Lightning Cone needs to be fixed it is very hard to target a group of mobs , as they have to be in a cone area, and u have to aim for the farthest mob . And pray they all get hit . It should hit in an immediate area like 2hand saber phantom
A Force Chain Lighting would be a great addition , just like how Force Intimidate works right now , goin from person to person , and have a range of atleast 20m . That would be an awesome addition .
Jedi powers should be just as important as having a Lightsaber, lots of ppl sway from the new force power tree , do to the high costs that they are not really as effective . Most of the specials do not work as intended in live , and the only reasons i use force throw and lightning is to get the maximum exp of lairs.
Now since im a Dark Jedi , i think force powers should there main source of power and damage . TickTock is right because sabers now can do the same amount of damage and costs much less , and is more effective. Anybody with over 50 points of any state defense can easily negate one or two uses of lets force knockdown , or mindblast. They should be made so they stick everytime , As of now u can easily spend more than 500 force just to stick a dizzy on someone, then spend another of couple extra force moves to knock them down,
I like the changes to Choke and Lightning they do the damage that are supposed to be doing in TC2 , but choke doesnt work on buffed players it seems?
i guess its a bug and is being addressed,
Lightning Cone needs to be fixed it is very hard to target a group of mobs , as they have to be in a cone area, and u have to aim for the farthest mob . And pray they all get hit . It should hit in an immediate area like 2hand saber phantom
A Force Chain Lighting would be a great addition , just like how Force Intimidate works right now , goin from person to person , and have a range of atleast 20m . That would be an awesome addition .
Force Intimidate 2works nicely , but cost to much force almost 750
All the Animal Skills are useless
Jedi Mind Trick is also useless , as no one uses pets anymore or npc faction pets,
Weaken should be tweaked more , hit for more debilitaion , and faster , it takes to long for it to go in effect . it should atleast take 1k off each pool .
ForceRun2 on live or the Forcerun3 on Test - i think that every Dark/LightJedi should have this skill when they hit Knight , i think its one of the best skills to have in the game , but i really dont want to spend the points in getting it at the master box of enhance.
Over all things are getting changed day to day , which is good thing, i would like to be more of a force power user , than a lightsaber user , i have faith in the FRS to increase the skills that are compensated for the Dark Jedi , less cost and more damage . So bring some of these ideas into play , and try to make it more unique and viable to choose as people are swaying now to the master LS/ Defense / 4004 healing line .
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