Development Cycle Archive
Thread: ID#2: Two Changes to Bazaars and Vendors
Breigh wrote:
XanEldarie wrote:
Isissa wrote:
I feel that 150 items on a vendor is a very bad idea. It means constant restocking for the person with the vendor, and that can be hard enough as it is because if you only have 150 items, some people with a high demand for their goods can be sold out in a few hours..
I do think it's a VERY good idea to raise the price limit on the bazaar, but I also think it would be more helpful if it was upped to more like 20k as 6,000 credits doesn't honestly amount to anything & if you don't want to make your own vendor then it's hard to sell things on the bazaar. A lot of the time people are forced into spamming "this & this for sale, send tell if interested" & that gets very annoying after awhile.
Constant Restocking = Constant Attention. Isn't that what all customers here want? To know that the item they want is there? And that the vendor they are shopping at isn't a "set and forget" vendor?
As far as the 20k thing... They already told you that its NOT to be used for big-ticket items, and I think they've explained themselves well enough to show why they aren't raising it more...
Give an inch, you people want a mile... They should have never mentioned it, and stealth-patched it. That way, people would just accept it as "good enough". 75% of people want the cap raised, so that much is clear. So, they should just do it as they see fit, and be done...
So tell me Xan, you are a droid engineer yes? How many different items do you have to create?
From what I gather (if this is even working properly.. been a while since I had it done) you can't color droids until the owner has them out and tamed etc.
SO if that were not the case.. and they were bought already painted from you. Would you keep a stock of EVERY single droid in EVERY single color because that's what your customers want? Probably.. that would be a pretty well stocked vendor (or vendors) indeed!
Now.. are you a merchant? Do you have enough merchant skills for multiple vendors to spread around all these multicolored droids once the 150 item cap goes in? You are supposed to please your customers yes? So if someone shows up wanting such and such a droid in raspberry red, no reason you shouldn't have it in stock, limit or no limit, am I right?
We, as crafters, work pretty darn hard at what we do.. but we like a break sometimes as well. I know the change from 7 days to 30 days for the actions made a TREMENDOUS difference in my gaming day.. to make this 150 item cap, together with the amount of items I sell each day... I don't know how I'd do it.
Tailors have SO MANY items we can make.. hundreds.. take that and imagine that we can make EACH of those HUNDREDS of items in what? 55 colors... of course some items have up to 3-4 colors.. SO, that's hundreds of items with how many different color combinations?!
One major problem for me right now with my craft is finding the time to fill my vendors AND keep up with the demand of custom orders. My vendors have TONS of items in them.. hundreds.. many different varieties of pants, shirts, dresses, jackets, cloaks.. whatever.. but I STILL get endless tells and emails for custom orders.
So when people visit my vendors and they have only 150 items in them, logic tells me I will get even MORE tells, so not only will my vendors sell out quicker but people will not find the selection they once did.. hence giving me way more orders.. I just can't keep up with that regardless of HOW much I enjoy my profession or HOW good I am at it.
I mean come on.. cut us some slack.. you're talking like we are miracle workers who should be able to make the best of anything thrown at us. Not all crafts are like yours.. have some pity on those of us who really DO need to be able to stock our vendors well to please people..
As for this post, I had a reply, but I was logged out during submission, and I lost what I had typed up. In a nutshell, Stop Being So Selfish. Think about OTHER people, not just how the changes effect YOUR skill. You don't hear me whining about all the batteries I sell on my vendor, or how quickly they are purchased. With a 6k Bazaar, I can start putting my battery crates on that, NOT my vendor.
XanEldarie wrote:
Breigh wrote:
XanEldarie wrote:
Question:
What percentage of items do you sell on your vendor for less than 6k?
Ya know, the more of your posts I read the more I question your common sense.
My tailoring items are all between the prices of80 credits and 7900 credits. My website is www.Breigh.com with all my clothing and prices listed. The only items above 6000 in my shop are my master items.
Striking me as a little narrow minded there Xan, ya know not all crafts are alike and not all of our items cost a fortune. Tell me, who would pay MORE than 6k for a pair of dress shoes or a hat? Hmm?
Common sense? You fail to miss a simple point.... And I won't explain it again. If you habitually miss the 15-Mile-Wide target, no one can explain to you how to hit it.
Oh how very witty! Very clever indeed 
I still think you lack common sense because you speak like every craft is the same.. like each and every one of us should be able to deal with this change in the same way and that is just simply not the case.
I wasn't even arguing the point about the bazaar, but I can understand it. I'm not at all fussed about people selling things for less than 6k on the bazaar because as most tailors can agree, 99% of the people who visit us are returning customers who probably never even look on the bazaar anyway.
My point was though, you were asking what percentage of items we sell less than 6k, I answered your question, did I not?
About the Baazar price cap:
Instant sales should be capped. However, auctions should have no cap, outside of the initial starting bid. This way, there is an *in-game* mechanism to sell high value loot items. As it stand right now, when you loot something like a nice skill tape, Krayt tissues, etc., you have to resort to web forums to auction your item, which is visible by a much smaller portion of the SWG community on your Galaxy.
I'm all for the instant sale cap, as it protects vendors and their owner's interests. But auctions should have no cap. Either that, or there needs to be some other mechanism to sell off high value loot in-game.
Breigh wrote:
Whatever he/she wrote...
You tell me, since we are in the "tell me" game, do you REALLY have to put every single color item and every single article of clothing on your vendor? How about more refined sales? And, if you don't visit your own vendor often, and you are selling enough clothing the require EVERY SINGLE COLOR AND TYPE, how are you accomplishing that business at all?
Doesn't take much wits to figure out what sells and what doesn't....
I agree that raising the cap on the bazaar is a bad idea
I completely disagree with the limits on the personal vendors. i alone stock over 150 items of resouces on my vendor on any given day. I like the idea of having it corespond with your skill level but please do not lower it to such an absurdly low number. PLEASE
eesefeakop
Master Architect and Resouce supplier on Bria
XanEldarie wrote:
As for this post, I had a reply, but I was logged out during submission, and I lost what I had typed up. In a nutshell, Stop Being So Selfish. Think about OTHER people, not just how the changes effect YOUR skill. You don't hear me whining about all the batteries I sell on my vendor, or how quickly they are purchased. With a 6k Bazaar, I can start putting my battery crates on that, NOT my vendor.
Selfish? I'm stating my concerns for myself and others in my profession and trying to help you (and others who are saying it should be easy to deal with this proposed change) to understand it from our side. I am not showing a LACK of concern for other professions, I don't KNOW enough about other crafting professions to comment either way, I will leave that up to THEM to state their case.
As for the batteries thing, well you're quite right, you can do that.. just because it's an option you consider doesn't mean it's something for everyone. I put a LOT of work into my shops (and I don't just mean the vendors) I am a member of a roleplay city and I try quite hard to make my shops an experience of their own to visit and get quite a lot of comments on it. It is only a part of what I enjoy about tailoring. Another part I enjoy is making the items I sell.. why would I want to mass produce items to sell on the bazaar.. that just takes away from the experience I have in running my shop, do you see?
XanEldarie wrote:
Breigh wrote:
XanEldarie wrote:
Question:
What percentage of items do you sell on your vendor for less than 6k?
Ya know, the more of your posts I read the more I question your common sense.
My tailoring items are all between the prices of80 credits and 7900 credits. My website is www.Breigh.com with all my clothing and prices listed. The only items above 6000 in my shop are my master items.
Striking me as a little narrow minded there Xan, ya know not all crafts are alike and not all of our items cost a fortune. Tell me, who would pay MORE than 6k for a pair of dress shoes or a hat? Hmm?
Common sense? You fail to miss a simple point.... And I won't explain it again. If you habitually miss the 15-Mile-Wide target, no one can explain to you how to hit it.
Oh, you mean that 25 item limited bazaar is supposed to make up for the loss of 1000 or so items on a vendor. Good logic there. 150 items over 6k + 25 items under 6k still isn't = to the total number of tailor schematics, let alone a selection. Plus that's really good business sense. Oh, you want shoes with that, sorry you'll need to run to town for those. Black hat for your make me look cool outfit, not enough room you'll have to run to bazaar or wait til I finish the other 30 ordrers ahead of you. I'll let you know as soon as I start working on orders, I've spent the last hour travelling back and forth between bazaar and the vendors myself. Oh, nm, I just sold my last cool black hat off the bazaar, you'll have to wait anyway.
People want to buy everything they're looking for in one place. Even with the bazaar cap raised to 6k that won't happen. And incidentally, where is everyone supposed to store the stuff to restock in between?
KazeyW wrote:
XanEldarie wrote:
Breigh wrote:
XanEldarie wrote:
Question:
What percentage of items do you sell on your vendor for less than 6k?
Ya know, the more of your posts I read the more I question your common sense.
My tailoring items are all between the prices of80 credits and 7900 credits. My website is www.Breigh.com with all my clothing and prices listed. The only items above 6000 in my shop are my master items.
Striking me as a little narrow minded there Xan, ya know not all crafts are alike and not all of our items cost a fortune. Tell me, who would pay MORE than 6k for a pair of dress shoes or a hat? Hmm?
Common sense? You fail to miss a simple point.... And I won't explain it again. If you habitually miss the 15-Mile-Wide target, no one can explain to you how to hit it.
Oh, you mean that 25 item limited bazaar is supposed to make up for the loss of 1000 or so items on a vendor. Good logic there. 150 items over 6k + 25 items under 6k still isn't = to the total number of tailor schematics, let alone a selection. Plus that's really good business sense. Oh, you want shoes with that, sorry you'll need to run to town for those. Black hat for your make me look cool outfit, not enough room you'll have to run to bazaar or wait til I finish the other 30 ordrers ahead of you. I'll let you know as soon as I start working on orders, I've spent the last hour travelling back and forth between bazaar and the vendors myself. Oh, nm, I just sold my last cool black hat off the bazaar, you'll have to wait anyway.
People want to buy everything they're looking for in one place. Even with the bazaar cap raised to 6k that won't happen. And incidentally, where is everyone supposed to store the stuff to restock in between?
Read what I just posted before this. You know, the whole avenues nonesense. That's the point.
XanEldarie wrote:
You tell me, since we are in the "tell me" game, do you REALLY have to put every single color item and every single article of clothing on your vendor? How about more refined sales? And, if you don't visit your own vendor often, and you are selling enough clothing the require EVERY SINGLE COLOR AND TYPE, how are you accomplishing that business at all?
Doesn't take much wits to figure out what sells and what doesn't....
hehe I don't put every single color on there.. good grief if I did my fingers would be worn down to little nubs by now or I'd at least have a serious case of RSI! *laughs*
Look I'm not trying to argue with you, just to try to help you understand.
Take the reinforced pullover for example.. (this is in the jackets section) it has 4 seperate color sections. Now, that's 55 possibilities for each seperate part.. can you imagine the amount of combinations available?
I try to have the most variety I can for the more popular items.. (tactical skinsuit, dresses, camo articles etc) and the less popular I make sure to have in black and a few other colors.. but even with this .. with hundreds of items to sell it adds up VERY quickly.
The thing is about clothing.. it's different than other areas of the game, like armor, weapons etc because there are soooo many different combinations and lets face it.. the greater majority of people, much like in RL, want to be unique. So while there ARE the most popular selling items .. that are BLATANTLY obvious. Such as the black gunman's duster, jungle colored camo outfits etc.. a good tailor wants to offer variety for those who DON'T like the "Usual" outfits. Sometimes people can find this on the vendor, other times they can't and they will put in a custom order.
The fact is.. EVERYTHING sells.. heck I even (just out of curiosity) put one of those Reinforced Pullovers that I mentioned on there in like purple/orange/bright blue and babypoo yellow and someone STILL bought it haha
In my shop I have 1 regular clothing vendor, 1 jewelry vendor, 1 wookiee vendor and 1 custom orders vendor. I have them arranged in my shop and they play a part in the atmosphere, talking and such.. they each sort of have their own purpose and are very well stocked (well not at the moment as I'm still trying to catch up after them being drained when I wasn't around at x-mas) .. if this 150 item thing went in I'd have to change everything and I have no idea how I'd arrange it all or manage to have a decent amount of stock. I'd manage but it wouldn't be fun at all.. nor would my shop be the same.
6k on the Bazzar seems fine, 10k would be a bit better. When it comes to auctions however I can't see the logic on having a cap at all, it is an auction after all. Remove the cap on auctions and have no reserve either, install a bit of risk in placing a decent item up for auction I say, the reward could be high, but, you might only get a couple of thousand for something tasty - adds a touch of spice dont you think?
I have no view on Vendors, I'm a Ranger, not a shopkeeper...!
One last thing: - The main problem with the bazzar, on Farstar in Coronet at least, is that its SO SLOW as to be unusable during the evenings. Going anywhere near the bazzar Is the number one thing I can do to make SWG crash on me, there are many others btw, but the bazzar is number one.
I've stated in the past the the bazaar as it stands is silly. Auctions are completely useless since to all but a total newb(or an effective newb, someone who doesn't "get" the game's economic system) 3000 credits is pocket change.
The 3000 cap per sale is silly. You end up with at least twice as many listings as should be needed because we all split crates and resource stacks into smaller piles in order to sell on the bazaar. If the cap is shifted from 3000 to 10000, we will see at least double the value in listings the first day with the same number of listings, or fewer. Instead of 25 stacks of 300 Lok wheat, I'll be able to put up 25 stacks of 1000 wheat. This will reduce activity somewhat (10,000 wheat can be purchased for 10 transactions instead of 31) Reduced transactions has GOT to have a larger impact on the server load than a reduced database size, since transactions employ that database and other transaction-related ones too. Increase the listing size and you drop both the stocking and sales transaction numbers proportionately.
If the goal is reduced load, don't fix auctions. They are transaction intensive. If the goal is making the customer happy, make auctions have no maximum bid amount. If you want to cap the initial bid amount, that's fine, adds an element of risk, but it will also increase transactions again as lots of people just looking for a bargain will be bidding that would not if the starting bid required was allowed to be more realistic. "Holocron for 10,000? Sure, I may as well drop a bid on that.... Holocron for 1,000,000? Whew, I better get back to missions."
If the object is to lower load, it's far better to do it by increasing effective functionality than by decreasing it. Inject enough "hassle factor" into the game, and you will hassle many otherwise loyal customers into thinking seriously about their gaming options.