Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Weekly Roundtable Discussion (Week Ending 6-21-04)
KapowBzapp
Mon Jun 14, 2004 6:15 pm
#40
TH, in your "In Live" thread I'm haranguing you again about the SBD proliferation on the Corvette. I don't mean to sound accusatory, but as a player since launch and master combat profession I speak for many like myself who feel deprived of the next step up in difficulty. For a couple weeks the Corvette was seriously challenging in a GOOD way, then suddenly cranked up to "uber-l337 24 hour power gamer" with no further comment.
Even if that further comment were just "wait for the combat rebalance", I'd actually be delighted to hear that. But as a long-time player it infuriates me that you produced and tested this fantastic new content and then, with no testing at all, perverted it into another grind. I don't want the loot! I want an immersive adventure, and there's nothing immersive about six immortal SBDs in every closet.
Even if that further comment were just "wait for the combat rebalance", I'd actually be delighted to hear that. But as a long-time player it infuriates me that you produced and tested this fantastic new content and then, with no testing at all, perverted it into another grind. I don't want the loot! I want an immersive adventure, and there's nothing immersive about six immortal SBDs in every closet.
Brutus_Krylop
Mon Jun 14, 2004 6:40 pm
#41
Spot on.
KapowBzapp wrote:
TH, in your "In Live" thread I'm haranguing you again about the SBD proliferation on the Corvette. I don't mean to sound accusatory, but as a player since launch and master combat profession I speak for many like myself who feel deprived of the next step up in difficulty. For a couple weeks the Corvette was seriously challenging in a GOOD way, then suddenly cranked up to "uber-l337 24 hour power gamer" with no further comment.
Even if that further comment were just "wait for the combat rebalance", I'd actually be delighted to hear that. But as a long-time player it infuriates me that you produced and tested this fantastic new content and then, with no testing at all, perverted it into another grind. I don't want the loot! I want an immersive adventure, and there's nothing immersive about six immortal SBDs in every closet.
Matlocksdad
Mon Jun 14, 2004 6:46 pm
#42
Blackjack_Nova wrote:
The game has been moving towards the needs of powergamers and away from the needs of casual gamers.
No casual gamer will ever be a higher level Jedi.
No casual gamer will ever be able to have all of the best weapons/armor/doc buffs/food buffs/ spice buffs
It seem that the design direction has done a full 180 turn.Please bring hope to the casual gamers once again.
Any comments would be very much appriciated.
/applaud
As far as SOE should be concerned, whether you play 12 hours a month or 120+ hours a month, you still end up paying the same amount for the same product and should get supported the same. This whole focus on revamping Jedi has been misguided. If some small percentage of people want to be Jedi, they will do whatever it takes (grinding). While they do their thing, the rest of us should be able to log in a few times a week and have fun. Many issues have been and are being overlooked in this push to organize Jedi. It's gonna be friggin GlowStick Wars and this game will turn into the laughingstock of the MMO (RPG? Hell no, that takes content) community.
I guess it's a good way of making all the non-Jedi buy JTLS so they can actually enjoy playing in a combat environment. 
WesBelden
Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:01 pm
#43
This may be a bit taboo, but I've seen many that are concerned that with the new system for Jedi, we are going to see far more of them in the game (by this I mean actual Jedi, with lightsabers and/or force powers, not just FS people). This for many would ruin the immersion factor and fun of playing Star Wars Galaxies, indeed, the term 'Jedi Galaxies' has been coined by those worried thatthe game will be overrun with Jedi. Is there any way we could discuss this, the ramifications of the systemfor the game and the ways of preventingthese people's concernsfrombecoming a reality?
wickedHangover
Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:43 pm
#44
Thunderheart,
Can I propose a discussion in regards to the way creatures spawn on the planets? I have started posts for the past 2 weeks that have gotten a lot of feedback from the rest of the community. I am referring to this:
Thunderheart wrote:
wickedHangover wrote:
This issue is in regards to walking for very long distances and not running into and random lairs. It seems that Lok was fixed, but Dantooine is a dead planet. I walked for 11,000 meters on Dantooine hoping for something to spawn and only ran into 5 random lairs. Yavin is getting pretty dead too.
It means that there are a lot of people on the planet. The more people there are, the less random spawns there are. These are adjustments the server makes automatically. If you are running shy of random spawns, you should go get a mission. The terminals will spawn additional lairs when this type of loading occurs...
The problem is that I think we all like to hunt creatures and many of us prefer not to use mission terminals to spawn them. Those of us that like to hunt solo find little to no challenge off the creatures that are listed on the terminals and not to mention that the variety severely lacks in comparrison to what is available on the planet to hunt.
I mostly have this problem with Dantooine but you can use virtually any planet. I hit the teriminal and regardless of how many refreshes I do I can pick between Voritor lizards, huurtons, quenkers or pikets. Now we all know that there are more than 4 different things to hunt on Dantooine. So either the mission terminals need to be opened up and allow solo players to take up to level 50 missions if they desire. Or the random spawns must be fixed.
I did notice that in some places where planets were deserted there are now spawns, but these spawns tend to be of too low of a level for the planet. I actually find that walking across the plains of Corellia I am faced with harder creatures than walking across Yavin 4, Dantooine and Lok. This should not be.
So can we open up a discussion next week to discuss the issues around creature spawns, a reflection on the community's opinion on the ideal max level of missions available on the terminals and a wider variety of creatures/NPC's that appear on the terminals for all planets?
Keatsnam
Mon Jun 14, 2004 7:45 pm
#45
Seomon wrote:Is there anyway to get our 'Wifebeaters' back in the game as a craftable item? I miss those
blockquote>
LOL. I was just thinking the same thing the other day. In fact, I'm sitting at home wearing one now! Why can't my Mon Cal?
Draknodred
Mon Jun 14, 2004 8:20 pm
#46
less jedi.. and more SL love, Smuggler love, and BH love... and some more info on the combat rebalance would be nice too =)
RontoMike
Mon Jun 14, 2004 8:52 pm
#47
OK, regarding the trend of devs equating "making missions challenging" with "making NPCs with insanely out-of-linr HAMs and adding droids of a type not seen in this this timeframe EVERYWHERE".... people,that's not challenging... it's ridiculous, and a bit lazy.
My ideas for a revamp for the Corvette, as an example:
First, the idea originally conceived for player faction HQ destruction was the right way to go, IMO.. a different task for several different profs, all working in concert. Granted, it's harder to code & debug than "make everything a human or droid with the power level of a Krayt Dragon"... but much more rewarding for the players, long-term.
OK.. let's say you're heading up on a rescue mission. You've boarded the ship, and you're going to have NPCs coming at you in a short time. After all, you've just locked onto their ship & cut through the hull! Someone's gotta notice that! First up... the Master Smuggler in the group ties into the nearest terminal & starts slicing the security system. Success reduces the number of enemy NPCs that spawn.. to reflect the fact that the smuggler's borked the security system & has the ship's troopers chasing phantoms across the ship.
Next, you might want to make your way to the engine room. If you can cut off the ship's drives, that gives you more time to get your target off the ship before it reaches its destination. Perhaps a Commando can set charges to blowa critical drive component. Success extwends your mission timer.
If you can secure the sickbay, you have a place where your docs can heal wounds, but not buff. (All buffs should be negated upon arrival on the ship... they wore off in transit. This will balance out removing the insane HAMs from the NPCs)
A Droid Engineer can help out by rewiring ship's droids to accomplish certain tasks for the party.. maybe even create shorts in the power supplies (on a very limited number of attempts per mission) to create low-grade bomb droids to help clear rooms of certain static NPC spawns.
Weaponsmiths can help break into weapons lockers to get the team some extra firepower. (said weapons vanishing upon mission completion.) (Granted, it's more of a Smuggler thing to do.. but hey, I already suggested a job for them! 
)
)If you have a BE along.. maybe if you can access the ship's life support systems.. he can whip up some kind of bioweapon that will slow down reaction times of enemies. Naturally, he'd immunize all party members.
You see... THIS would be challenging... especially if the tasks weren't simple "dice-rolls".. but actually mini-puzzles worked out in a GUI window by the player. Give them a feeling of actually DOING something to help the mission along.
The examples I gave were rmore in the line of "mission enhancements" rather than requirements... devs could make certain tasks require certain professions... but it would be a more enjoyable experience and a better way to encourage grouping than having to just to survive an attack by ONE superhuman NPC.
(And the Geonosians should have the monopoly on battle droids & SBDs, thank you.. but let Nym keep his droidekas. )
)OK, people.. what do you think of this? Opinions, critques, enhancements?
Naquiel
Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:07 pm
#48
Well in all the games i play i tend to come across some information that can help both the players and the devs and i think i will post it here in the hope that many will understand.
______________________________________________________________________________________
One common question is always “why?” Why did we choose this or that? Why did we decide to take one action versus another?
The general answer always has something to do with “because we thought it would be best for the big picture in the long run.” Sometimes the long run proves we were wrong, and we have to change our minds. Sometimes it works out for the best. All we can do is try stuff out, look at the feedback, ask for advice, and ultimately, give it our best shot. And never, ever quit trying.
None of us have a crystal ball. Beware of game developers claiming that they know what their virtual world will be like in three months. They don’t.
We do believe right now that the way we did <insert game here> will ultimately prove the right way. We tossed our plans up earlier in the process than any MMORPG that I know of has ever tried, and invited feedback. We made changes, and invited more feedback. There hasn’t been a single step made without consulting actual players both in and outside the company.
That’s not to say decisions are based on outcry on this message board or that, or based on my feedback forms, or even on really brilliant petition drives. Ultimately, the decisions are made by the design team, because SOMEONE has to drive.
The general answer always has something to do with “because we thought it would be best for the big picture in the long run.” Sometimes the long run proves we were wrong, and we have to change our minds. Sometimes it works out for the best. All we can do is try stuff out, look at the feedback, ask for advice, and ultimately, give it our best shot. And never, ever quit trying.
None of us have a crystal ball. Beware of game developers claiming that they know what their virtual world will be like in three months. They don’t.
We do believe right now that the way we did <insert game here> will ultimately prove the right way. We tossed our plans up earlier in the process than any MMORPG that I know of has ever tried, and invited feedback. We made changes, and invited more feedback. There hasn’t been a single step made without consulting actual players both in and outside the company.
That’s not to say decisions are based on outcry on this message board or that, or based on my feedback forms, or even on really brilliant petition drives. Ultimately, the decisions are made by the design team, because SOMEONE has to drive.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Well i know that some out there will know where i got this little bit of quote. I hope here in SWG we will be better and work together to make the game better.
But for me i would like to say something. "It might be better to fix the problems of the past in order of having a better future."
This can lead to many questions, but for me it means one thing. Please fix the current bugs, imbalances, glitches, and more befor you go desiding to introducing something new. Then maybe the current player base will be happy to play without needing a expantion to keep them around. The more happy players, the more of a chance of them buying the new expantion when it does come out.
galvatronicus
Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:09 pm
#49
More information about how the combat balance is going to proceed with frequent updates by the dev's. Maybe a combat balance forum? I think it is fair to say people are more excited about the CB than the space expansion or jedi revamp.
galvatronicus
Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:12 pm
#50
BTW, excellent idea about securing a medical room in the corvette for healing and buffs RontoMike. This would also be a good idea for the DWB and other dungeons.
3D4D
Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:21 pm
#51
Any ETA on new vehicles? Im so sick of seeing the same 3 vehicles where ever I go
Sure we have the AV-21, but those are so rare that they don't even count as content.
I would die and go to heaven if you added mabey 2-3 new common vehicles. By common I mean that a player with 50-100k could buy one.
Knapf
Mon Jun 14, 2004 9:34 pm
#52
3D4D wrote:
Any ETA on new vehicles? Im so sick of seeing the same 3 vehicles where ever I go
Sure we have the AV-21, but those are so rare that they don't even count as content.
I would die and go to heaven if you added mabey 2-3 new common vehicles. By common I mean that a player with 50-100k could buy one.
Couldn't agree with you more. (And Let the colors stay) I have three Master artisans and I make ok money on color kits. but I would reather they change the color for good. Heck make it a kit that will let you change the color of anything. armor, droids, ships. just never saw the point of it.