Development Cycle Archive
Thread: AT-AT Test
Was it tough enough?:
I think it was tough, but not tough enough. At least formechanized machinery it got taken down prettyquick every time.Maybe make all the resists somewhere around 95%, and since it should be a little more vulnerable to blast than the other types of damage, I would say blast somewhere around 60%. TheHAM should be left as is and the damage it puts out. This should make it MUCH tougher.
Should it attack differently?
I think it should have an AE on the blasts, this way if there are 40 people under it EVERYONE will get hit. On all the single fights against the AT-AT alone I only got hit 1 time (the second Rebel battle against the AT-AT)
How did it look?
Phenominal! Couldn't look better. I was amazed at the size.
Would it be a strong opponent for a typical group ( after all, we had about 60 ppl online fighting it):
I definitely believe it would. We had Commando's with Rocket Launchers and pets along with a fire DoT so that eased the difficulty quite a bit. But for a typical group it would still definitely be a challenge.
Should the Events Team wait for fixes before using it for live events, or does it still need a lot of work?:
It's at the point where it is usable in live events.
Firstly, fantastic job to everyone who worked on designing the AT-AT in the game. It's a phenominal addition. Thiswas the most fun I have had sinceThe Warren was first added.Also, hats off to everyone who was in the fights tonight, both Rebel and Imperial.
Well .. walking by itself, it looked great!
Some graphical points ...
- Those knockdowns really didn't seem to fit in with the idea of an AT-AT
- It turns too fast .. something that big and lumbering shouldn't be able to turn that quickly
- No pretty buckling when it dies ... just falls over
Other notes
- While each shot does a decent amount of damage (I think the numbers were in the 1.2k - 1.5k range?) it didn't do much damage to any one person. Most, if not all of us were buffed and even if we got hit once, we rarely got hit twice. It changed targets *very* quickly. I'd agree with everyone else who mentioned that it should have an AOE attack.
- It seemed to go down WAY too easily once we had some commandos in the group (and add the CM .. thanks Pappi! .... too easy). In the 20 person test not even my CL16 pet got incapped. I'd suggest either increasing the HAM or the blast resistance .... those commando dot's took HUGE chunks out of it's life.
- In the last round (the 4 AT-AT + AT-STs spawn) I was running around TRYING to get agro, but never managed to get one from an AT-AT even though I had a rebel TEF and was running right up to and under the AT-ATs. They did aggro when I fired on them.
Are they ready for Live?
- I'd say not yet. Tweak the damage and targeting, make it a little harder to kill and stop the spinning and you'll have it
Was it tough enough?
No, not even close by itself, my squad (15)(handpicked) took it down with ease and no incaps let alone and deaths. By using the right people with the right squad tactics nothing in the game can defeat a well run squad. Too many targets confused the AI and it keeps trying to hit the last person who attacked it.
Should it attack differently?
Yes it should have more than one attack, 1 shot per round is not enough.
How did it look?
It looked great on level ground, hills were another matter, all in all it looked fine.
Would it be a strong opponent for a typical group ( after all, we had about 60 ppl online fighting it).
Yes but you saw my group take it down with 15 people and we could have gone to 10 people without much loss in squad effectiveness. When you spawed the "battlegroup" (4 AT-AT and 3 or 4 AT-ST)it was tough (and I realize you do not have to play fair) but the fight could have been won with my squad if you had not spawned them on top of the group. No way to use tactics when the battle starts like that. When I say tactics I do not mean exploits. In a real fight we would see the AT's well before we had to engage them and had a fighting chance in my opinion.
Should the Events Team wait for fixes before using it for live events, or does it still need a lot of work?
From the game as it stand on the live servers please use them now, the hill problem is not a major one, you can increase the HAM and reduce the TKA knockdown as you have time. The thing that kills them is the flamethrower, every other weapon serves as a distraction.
Geneoa
Squad Leader on tc
City of Skystone/Tatooine
My assessment of the test: Good, yet needs work 
Thank you Pex and Kevin for allowing us to test these specifics.
Points seen in tonights participation:
- They re-aggro'ed too quickly and spinned about irratically too much. This allowed a small group to take out one. If possible have them do more damage per shot or expand the range of their shots to 180 degrees and reduce their turn radius speed (it seemed a bit creature like).
- Speaking about creatures they seemed to reel at every hit upon them; not right. They are mechanisms and should never flounder when hit, only retaliate.
- Knockdown did work on them, also panic shot delayed them by 10 secs (of the two times I tried one was resisted). Seeing an AT-AT knocked down just isn't right. I think these mechs should be immune to such delaying attacks as well as any altering affects (dizzy etc...)
- Not enough special effects. These things should rock the ground upon stepping like the biggest pets to be had, yet they seemed as quiet as a mouse. They need to inspire more in presence; bigger blasts and nastier steps are a must. The hum of the AT-AT walkers leg movements were too weak to make me think I was facing something menacing.
All in all I had more trouble with the AT-ST's then the walkers in the test. Slow down the rate they turn about, but make being in front of them amost certain death. They did not seem challenging enough for me. It seemed surrounding and zerg-like tactics was most effective, as it should not.
Thank you for asking us to test and comment, we (I) appreciate it.
Atiw wrote:
My thoughts:
1. 250K HAM is not enough if it spawns by itself. As part of a battle group (1 AT-AT 3 AT-ST's it is fine)
2. It really should have an area attack. It seemed like it was getting confused when just our rebel group was fighting it in the 20 player test
3. It looked fine, although it should turn a little slower.
4. I guess the live events team can use it, but make sure they spawn it as part of a battle group like the last one we saw (it had 4 AT-AT's)
5. Give it an area attack, and maybe increase the HAM a tad (more like the Gorax we saw tonight)
no area attack. Its never had an area attack in any other star wars book movie or game.
Suggestion: When the AT-AT goes down... have it spawn a squad of Stormtroopers. Since it is supposed to carry them.
Also when it "dies" have its legs buckle and fall forward "headfirst", as in the movies.
To the answer of was it tough enough. The answer is no. The Hitpoints need to be adjusted like the gorax. Nightsisters and Krayts have more hitpoints to the AT-AT. Maybe giving it 350k ham or more. That will give it the power to stay longer into the fight. Also an ATAT by itself is just a walking target. When it spawns in live events and on its own. You should include ATSTs and StormTroopers with the spawn. The ATAT is extremely vulnerable from behind. So spawn about 15 to 20 storm troopers on the back legs with 4 atsts and put them on the guard command. On the front of the ATAT. Put ATSTs and storm troopers so the players will have to slowly wittle down the defences. The ATAT is for base assaults and is a behemoth against other craft. When it really fails is against the army troopers aka players. it can not target all the pets/Droids and eliminate them fast enough. That is why there is stormtroopers and speederbikes inside the ATAT because it is a movable troop transport.
On the Attack Approach. It should keep firing at the person doing the most damage and slowly go down the line till it eliminates all its resistance. Pets should be targeted first but atleast show some animation in the at at when it moves its head to dispatch a pet or character. It constantly stayed in one place and only the body turned. Also make it be immune to knockdown, blind, stun, and intimidate.
On the look of the ATAT. Well it looked great standing there and not falling down when its hit and getting right back up. But the one thing that was totally missing was the ground shaking when it walks. When a fambaa or bantha lays down or does a trick. It will cause the enviroment surrounding it to shake. You can see the same effect when watching ESB. There is 3p0 and R2 walking through the base and the walls are shaking and that really will intimidate the players and give them a warning that the empire is about to arrive. Remember Jurassic Park? What was more scarier? The TRex or the ground shaking at the Trex's walk. Its amazing how much fear a cup filled with coffee can generate.
Another thing. The ATAT can not turn and if it does turn. Do not have it turn 180 degrees in a second. Make the AI slowly walk around till it gets in a new direction. The weakness of the atst is no rear protection other than the two guns on the side of its head. Those can spin 360 degress. Check the RPG for that information.
Another thing that was lacking was the sound of it. It did not sound like an ATAT was firing it was like hearing the ATST shooting. They used two different sounds in the movie for the vehicles. Also when it walks. You can hear the mechanical parts moving. They recreated the sound in ATOC when the walkers were moving and since you have access to Lucasfilm's Library. Have them dig up the Mechanical sounds of the atat. That will increase the realism of a 200 ton walker bearing down on you.
Also on the look, When it falls. You might want to increase the size of the atat or even better when it does die. Have it spawn 12 stormtroopers. If the rebels want to kill something of this size. They are going to have to work for it. Remember the Empire and its atats are supposed to project that aura of being invincible.
So if the Rebels die trying to take out an atst and its escorts. Then the Imperial Crackdown is succeeding. And this is coming from a Rebel in game.
Live events can bring it in, but it would ruin the shock and surprise as a completed atat. I mean this was the toy that every kid wanted when ESB came out. If you want to bring it out. Let it be something that is non attackable. Just the look of it will generate second thoughts. Or if you want to make it interesting. When someone attacks these. Let the ATAT fire once and deal with the attacker. While the Empire's troops and vehicles deal with his friends. But when its finally done and ready to go. Let it walk into the towns and not just one town. Let it walk into all the towns. That would be quite a sight in game. The ground under your feet shaking and you look around and wonder who is killing fambaas. So you go and rush to the star port in moenia and see ATSTs and Imperial Storm Troopers marching into the city. Most people will shrug and then they see that ATAT. It would be very impressing to say the least.
Right now it looks good, but a lot of stuff needs to get added into to really make it shine. To the Developers of the game and the people in the art and sound department. You really did a good job, but if you add in a few more elements. You will have something that really impresses and strikes fear in all the players.
I hope that helps.
Was not apart of this test but want to give out my ideas after reading this.
1. AT-AT's should not be KDed by a Carbine, Pistol, Fist's, or of any small weapon really, thats just silly.
2. Slow down the Turning, but allow the Targeting of weapons to still hit enemies behind it, I think the guns on the side of its head could rotate that way anyway.
3. Maybe 300k HAM?To make it more of a challenge to Commando's, that or up the blast protection.
4. Sense the AT-AT is a troop transport, I think that if you kill an AT-AT Stromtroopers maybe 15-20 should spawn right after, as if they are the ones who lived and are now on the attack.
5. Combat Medics should not Poison, or Disease Steel...this is just a no brainer.
6. AT-AT's *Main* guns should be...well...strong. It should hit harder than an AT-ST.
7. I agree with many, that the AT-AT should not spawn alone, I think it should have a Support Battle Group ofmaybe 3 or 4 AT-ST's.
Just so people have an understand what an AT-AT is. This is taken right from starwars.com
http://www.starwars.com/databank/vehicle/atat/
The All Terrain Armored Transport, or AT-AT walker, is a four-legged transport and combat vehicle used exclusively by the Imperial ground forces. Standing a towering 15 meters tall, these walkers are intimidating, and are used as much for psychological effect as they are for tactical effect. An AT-AT has blast-impervious armor plating *(not reflected in the one tonight, it should have 100% blast protection)* and resembles a gigantic beast as it moves across the battlefield. An AT-AT's head carries the main armaments, a pair of light blasters located on the walker's "temples," and heavier, twin laser cannons mounted on the walker's "chin." The command crew pilots the AT-AT from the walker's head, which is connected to the main body by a flexible neck. The crew consists of a commander, a gunner, and a pilot. Additional crews and troops can be carried in the walker's main storage bay.
Didn't fight it, but from the pics it looked great.
I'm posting about suggesting a change to enemy vehicle HAM. It shouldn't be HAM. It should be ONE bar with an amount equal to what the H+A+M would be. This would be similar to the bases and/or player vehicles. Comments?
Was it tough enough?
Yes. I personally thought it was tough enough.
Should it attack differently?
Yes.
How did it look?
Looked great
Would it be a strong opponent for a typical group ( after all, we had about 60 ppl online fighting it).
Yes, would be a very strong oppenent for a typical gorup.
Should the Events Team wait for fixes before using it for live events, or does it still need a lot of work? Any other comments on how to make it better.
From the commandos point of view. First, you have to understand. We came prepared for this. The later test group was made up of 20 or some highly skilled people. Not going to name them for fear of leaving someone out. Our groups attack on it shows what tactics and organization can do for you. And I'm not putting the Imps down one bit, they fought and kept fighting even when it was obvious they did little to it. That showed what will happen to a unprepared group. I thought those 2 test cases were perfect.
As far as the AT AT itself. It looked awesome. But in my opinion the following needs looked at:
It moved to fast, its huge, it should not be able to turn like it does.
In every attack on it, several flaws showed. It would not maintain a single target for long. If i was sitting in the gunner sit, i would not be shooting at one target and switching to another before i knew the first was dead. I believe had it stuck with a target for more then one shot, it would have taken out alot of us in that second test. But instead, it switched. That gave people time to heal making them a fresh target again.
Getting beneath it should not be without risks. I stood below it in every attack also. Bad thing for anything to let happen. A Master Commando standing within 16m of you without a single threat on his life is going to rule that battle. Some are saying a AoE attack, and I have to agree. Somewhere in the area of 5-10m. That gives the Commando 5-7m to work with and the way it moves, he is gonna get hit anyway.
Heavy Weapons - As i said, we came prepared. Several of us had Rocket Launchers. I personally was hitting for about 4k-4.5k. But then i noticed something. Flame DoTs. In the time it took the RL to fire again, at least 2 DoTs pasted that were equal to if not greater then the RL damage. I quit using RL at that point. 4 stacked flames, flamesingle 1 & 2, flameCone 1 & 2 do some serious DoTing. Take that, plus the other commandos DoTs combined with no fear of standing beneath it, makes for a dead AT AT.
TKMs - We have some great TKMs on TC. They, or i should say one of them, Popo, went into this with the sole purpose of knocking one down. As you can tell from previous posts, it came down. I have to agree here as well. This thing should not be subject to KD's It was cool to see it, but i didnt find it very realistic after more consideration. Or leave the possibility of this in there, but add the small AoE i mentioned above to heighten the risk of trying it.
Battlegroups - Ok, here you guys got us. As prepared as we were for a AT AT, the battle group destroyed us. I counted 4 AT AT and at least 2 AT STs with each. There could have been more, but understand, the test party was maybe 20 people, and these things just started appearing. I dont think we could have prepared for this adequately enough in the time given, no where near the numbers in our test group to combat this. A battlegroup in my opinion should be a AT AT, 2-3 AT ST and 3-4 squads of stormtroopers. The AT AT is your heavy hitter, it should also slow the group down and be protected at all costs by the group.
Having seen it in action,having laid waste to 10-12 AT STs this week, andscores of troopers, i have to ask that the 2 be looked at again. AT STs i think are to fast and aguile to begin with, but they hold targets much better. The both need to lose some agility, they turn way to fast. I was shooting the rear of a AT ST and in the bink or a eye it was facing me, the AT AT i was standing beneath was spinning circles faster then i can on my speeder. If they stay the same as they are now, with the configuration of the battlegroup we saw, there is no rebel force large enough to take it, not with the lag associated with it. I know, some will say they can muster 50-100 troops for a battle, but is that really a battle considering the size of both parties? Or is it a lag fest that the server generated opponents will win every time?
Those are my thoughts on it.
Should you guys see anyone that was part of those test groups, you should thank them for a job well done. And i would especially like to thank the group i was with, you guys were awesome and the fit was better then a hand to a glove.
*§*
Many of the CH's present were using my special KD/Dizzy pets, the first KD I saw was right after I commanded a KD from my main pet actually. As Pex mentioned, it was supposed to be impervious to KD, I wonder if that only applies to players and it was the level 50-60 KD pets that kept knocking it over.
x_Niche_x wrote:
TKMs - We have some great TKMs on TC. They, or i should say one of them, Popo, went into this with the sole purpose of knocking one down. As you can tell from previous posts, it came down. I have to agree here as well. This thing should not be subject to KD's It was cool to see it, but i didnt find it very realistic after more consideration. Or leave the possibility of this in there, but add the small AoE i mentioned above to heighten the risk of trying it.