CUEmu - Thread Posts

raider7734

Fri Jan 23, 2004 12:03 pm

Here's what I think Swordsman should be like.The concepts are in white, the ingame implementations are yellow.

The Swordsman is a berserker and destroyer. More concerned with dealing damage than avoiding blows, we are battle hardened and used to being hit.

We should have the highest damage per second, low ranged and melee defense, medium toughness

Our defensive abilities, while on the low side, change according to the weapon we are using. Defense is very low when wielding the powerhammer, a purely offensive weapon, while the two handed curved sword has substantial defensive utility.

Weapons should directly affect our ranged and melee defense numbers

Our weapons are swung with full force using both hands, and are the optimum length to deliver the hardest possible hits with good accuracy.We are the most effective melee destroyers of armored targets such as turrets and ATST.

We should be the hardest melee hitter. We should also remain limited to dealing kinetic and blast damage

The Swordsman is a powerful fighter, able todestroy one target or many, with frightfully damaging area attacks.

Our single target attacks are fine,but our multiple target attacks shouldchange in order to differentiate us from other melee professions. We should not have area posture downs anddizzies (Pikeman should). Our Area attacks should be strictly area damage, except Area attack 3should also have a 1/3 chance to intimidate (AoE). These are our premier area damaging specialsto use as shock troops and berserkers. They have better damage vs. delay compared to the Spin attacks.Sweep 2 should be changed to a single target knockdown

We do not have the finesse to apply many status effects.The status effects wecauseare related to the power of our attacks and our ferocity in battle.

We should have a 1/3 chance to dizzywith Hit 3, and a1/3 chance to intimidate with Area attack 3. No other status effects

The Swordsman knows that the timing of his attacks is critical.He mayhold back for a moment, waiting for the opportune time to strike,thendeliver a devastating blow.

We should have an ability called Opportune Strike, somewhat likethe Marksman's Aim command. When Opportune Strike is enacted, the Swordsman does not immediately attack, but watches for the right time to strike,and focuses on making the next hit a really good one.The next special attack performed benefits from improved accuracy and a damage roll confined to the upper 40% of the weapon's range

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IGN Kye • vendor wp -1444, -3847 Naboo
"Persistence is synthetic Luck"

raider7734

Fri Jan 23, 2004 3:27 pm

#41

Henzo-Kauri wrote:

(Make the cleaver AR3, cleavers are meant for hacking through steel and armor).

/agree 100%

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IGN Kye • vendor wp -1444, -3847 Naboo
"Persistence is synthetic Luck"

sillyrack

Fri Jan 23, 2004 4:22 pm

#42

I agree with raider 7734

We should have more specials to cause max damage not just 1 on 1 but upon 1 on many! We're the ones in group combats they should even the odds against multiple targets causing enough affecting damage to surrounding targets to give other team members a chance to bring down opponentsquickly in tight situations.This shouldbring a distinct uniqness to the profession, probably going down in a blaze of glory against 5rancors will become the norm but hey we'd make a difference...

Xenozx

Sun Jan 25, 2004 6:16 am

#43

My point of view on the Heavy Swordsman / and melee proffessions in general

For reference I can mention that I am Master TKA / Master Heavy Swordsman / Master Fencer on Chilastra - also had Master Brawler....

1. I see the Heavy Swordsman as an able tank in pve as well as pvp and extreme damage dealer - the way things work now a tka do way more damage in pvp than any other melee proffession due to their high damage bonuses and the effect of damage mitigation which seems really odd as it is hard to understand how a fist or kick even with armored boots or a knuckler in your hand can do as much damage as a two-handed weapon ehh ??.

2. I think the vast amount of area specials that this proffession has fits them well except for the special states that those apply as I they are not varied enough / 2h area hit and sweep are great but spin attack is totally wasted...

3. The Heavy Swordsman should have the best bleeds and best damage of all the melee proffessions. Furthermore I think the Swordsman proffession should have access to more different damage type weapons as well as Heavy armor piercing on the cleaver to make that weapon worthwhile. I would also like to see special melee weapon powerups that could be made by weaponsmiths only maybe different types for different effects and lvl's of weaponsmithing. etc. poison powerups / fire powerups immagine phosphor injectors in a blade... maybe armorpiercing powerups...

4. As for defensive abilities I think the melee proffessions should all be rewamped so that we get stances. etc. light stance that allows for really good speed / lower damage- medium stance with great defence medium damage and medium speed - heavy stance that allows for extreme damage and AP but low defense.

5. Some nasty specials like - 2hand berserk that should soak up your hams but work quite similar to the prenerf berserk as for damage purposes and maybe add a bonus to armor piercing and last like 1 - 2 and 3 minutes based on the skill you have this would mean that you need a doc to heal you while you berserk or have some really good buffs at the ready. Special armor piercing attacks would also be an asset. An really heavy attack like last ditch for smuggler that can incapacitate in one hit.

6. Should add a morale boost that enables groupmemebers to perform more valiantly and thus get better to hit mods or speed or damage or maybe even a combinationt - maybe this could be done so that the swordsman can run an aura like effect and thus decide what boost he or she wants to add to the group.

7. The Heavy Swordsman should be a really good asset for when you want to go take on some heavy mobs or do mass pvp.

8. The Heavy Swordsman should rely on doctors and combat medics as well as firesupport from the rear ranks of a battle as well as the defensive skills of a fencer and pikesman due to their superior tanking abilities...

9. The Heavy Swordsmans role becomes clear when you take a look at the advanced technology that allows for extreme personal armors and shields that protects against firepower of all kinds along with the many raids that to take place to clear out bunkers here you often get in close where the skilled melee fighterwith powerfull weapons can be vielded for good results in battle / factional headquarters as well as when big game hunting needs to take place.

Yours Sincerely

Xenozx

Sun Jan 25, 2004 7:05 am

#44

BTW!

All melee proffessions should be given a charge abitlity to burst in close combat with their opponents . like a 10 seconds burst run ability that recycles like once every minute or 30 secs.

Xenozx

Heff

Sun Jan 25, 2004 12:11 pm

#45

Hello there,

Some stuff that i want to add, not going to do every question.

What defines the Swordsman role in combat?
Heavy Swordsman should strike fear into their opponents eye. If you look at heavy swordsman through out history, you know that they inflict massive amounts of damage, in a short period of time. A swordsman does not want to be in combat long, due to the fact that they have a giant sword and do not have that must agility. Swordsman should do heavy amounts of damage very quickly, and should have a medium threshold on taking damage. They are tough fighters, I would like to see some people hold up a 2 handed sword and swing it, its very hard.

What basic combat elements should they possess?
I feel that the swordman should be the king of bleeds. A swordsman is going to find the fastest way to incapacitate his target. I think we should be able to bleed every pool (different specials not all one special, maybe master get 1 specials that bleeds all). I know some of you will say this is nuts, but honestly, you can vivasect someone with a 5 foot sword in one hit.

What offensive abilities?
Bleeds and massive amounts of damage. Also they should be able to pierce heavy armor. A sharp sword made out of gemstone should cut thru a hide armor. I do think they should be effective vs ATSTs but not the best class to use against them.

What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?

Right now all melee's are gimps in PVP. Someone can just run away and if your lucky, your lunge can hit them. Well if they have a high defense mod, you are not going to touch them.
We need something that can at least give us a small chance in defeating a ranged enemy. Maybe a whole lunge category 2hnded Lunge 2, 3 (KD, Snare).

Elyria Un'xia

huan_the_destroyer

Sun Jan 25, 2004 12:27 pm

#46

Dear NOVASPICE

"I would see the swordsman as the primary melee offense in the GCW. We are the elite marines sent in to break the line and take out the armored targets."

I'm sorry, I just have to laugh at this. Swordsman as "elite marines?" LOL

Some things I want to point out:

1. If there is a class that resembles an "elite marine" in SWG, it's the Commando. Plain and simple.

2. The very idea of a 6ft long sword-carrying brute being considered a "marine" is just funny.

3. The very idea of a 6ft long-sword-carrying brute being able to "break the line and take out armored targets" in Star Wars is so hilarious, I'm actually crying at my keyboard right now.

4. This is not EverQuest. People who carry swords in a galaxy full of blasters, lasers, and lightsabers should always be a significant disadvantage

EVERY major science fiction book or movie from DUNE on down to Star Wars has included MELEE warriors that were indeed shock troops and highly feared.

jedi for example kept peace throughout the galaxy and were worth 100 marines- yes they had the force- but lightsabers are nothing more than supersharp blades and all their combat skills are focused on the heavy sword mentality.

you obviously aren''t a heavy swordsman and i have to wonder why you posted in this thread.

galaxy full of blasters, lasers, and lightsabers should always be a significant disadvantage

lightsabers are swords.

==================================================
WOW > SWG

Herque

Mon Jan 26, 2004 1:50 am

#47

What we need is more diversity, it seems these sweeps and spin attacks are uselss. We need to replace these moves that are for PvE only, like critical strike that has a delay but does huge damage with the chance of multplie state effects.

Herque Eo'vaal
Master Heavy Swordsman
Commander Of the Kestrel Militia

Ldwater

Mon Jan 26, 2004 9:28 am

#48

Xenozx wrote:

BTW!

All melee proffessions should be given a charge abitlity to burst in close combat with their opponents . like a 10 seconds burst run ability that recycles like once every minute or 30 secs.

Xenozx

I like that idea! Kinda like a charge! Seems a little pointless at the moment when your running to your opponent.. its almost like your going for a little jog! Should be good against kiters too, a little burst run with a higher ability to hit mod would be superbe, because anyone who tries to flee from a melee attacker would normally get cut down easily, but the current system means that you just have to stay out of range and your fine..

-ldwater

eMav

Mon Jan 26, 2004 10:37 am

#49

To answer your questions do the following:

Overall

Watch Conan the Bararian and Scorpion King.

What I thought

Getting into swordsman I figured I'd be a hard hitter and a tank. Right now I am at 2/4/2/2 and a 2/2/2/2 TKA can take down a creature faster and hit harder. In fact a fencer can too at around the same level. I don't even want to talk about PVP. Why am I so easy to knock down **edit** it!!

Whimp

When I go out hunting I am always the one to go down first despite my stratiges and when soloing I always take the longest. Being not the fastest is fine but I want less pool damage for specials, more specials stronger overall stats and I should not be taken down so quickly by a 4 foot 100 pound TKA.

Group

I think I should be able to tank multiple high level critters at once. That way I can hold them back for shooters etc.

Thoughts so far

I don't know if its a rewards thing but mid level TKA are a lot stronger and clib up their trees faster. If Masterswords is more rewarding thats cool and I dont mind taking some more time if the end result is worth it.

For comparision It took my bud 4 weeks of gringing to get MS. Took him 1 week for TKM playing the same hours as he did before.

xzeyteq

Tue Jan 27, 2004 2:47 am

#50

Well for one thing i would like to see us Swordsmen actually use SWORDS, not axe or a hammer but SWORDS afterall we are Swordsmen, not Axemen or anything else, butHeavy SWORDSMEN, so we should be the damage dealers and tanks. We dont need Knockdown cause we kill them fast.

Name: Tito Tal
Race: Bothan
Target Proffesions:
Master Smuggler, "Smugglers: We shoot you where it counts!"
Master Swordsman.

Ldwater

Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:14 am

#51

A repost from the Swordsman forum, just so TH can take a look

This is not a rant, just an observation and suggestion. Please feel free to discuss and try not the flame me too much

Melee Damage Mitgation:

Say for example, that I was fighting X npc, who had the same skills and 2 weapons, one melee and another ranged that did the same damage, as the system currently stands, if the npc used the ranged weapon they would compleatly bypass any mitigation defences I have!?

So, where is the incentive to use the melee weapon?

In the same situation, in a more realistic context, the melee's combatants first job would be to disable / destroy / deflect the opponents ranged weapon so it couldn't be used in combat. Its like trying to defend yourself from a huge guy with an axe with a rifle.. your not going to be holding your rifle for very long!

Solution: Now, I know that the devs will never add the ability to destory opponents weapons, but im thinking either force the weapon to be unequiped, or make the weapon extreamly inaccurate, regardless of modifiers, because the system at the moment means that to defeat any melee combatant is to just run in circles and keep out of range.

Kiting:

I know that this issue really annoys me at least, and im sure it annoys other melee players too, and a suggestion on the IC 1-15 Swordsman tread was a short burst of speed attack, like a mini burst run, which I like to call a charge!

In any melee conforntation you usually find that the charge is the single most potent attack that combatant will ever use, simply because of the added speed / momentum which is to be unleased onto their victim. In SWG, we seem to casually run upto our opponents, and when they run, just follow and lag behind a little, like a little puppy after its master..

Now, when they run, its not advancing in reverse and its not 'moving to a better location', it fleeing! Its running away for there lives! This action in itself if anything, improves the chances of survival simply because the opponent then exploits the melee class's inability to catch up, and the ranged player can still attack, if only slightly inpaired because of them moving.

Solution: Add a charge! Possably at Novice Brawler, the action itself is a mini burst run which the player can then 'attach' a attack on (rather than using a default attack). This would be on a short timer (say 30 secs - min) and would possably only last for 5-10 seconds, but just enough time to catch up and make that initial / final attack!Not only would this add an added element for melee classes to make them more interesting, but also remove alot of the problems with kiting!

Simply put, these suggestions are supposed to make ranged classes fear melee. If a melee and ranged class were in combat, the melee class should win everytime, where as if the ranged player had distance, then they should win.

I can already hear ranged players saying "Well, we should be able to defend ourselves" and I have no problem with that, but the case is simple: Your advantage is range. If you dont kill me before I get to you, then thats your advantage used up.. now its time to use mine

-ldwater

Elminster1

Tue Jan 27, 2004 6:37 am

#52

/agrees with charge ability!

~Elminster (Yes! That's my ingame name!)
Rebel Colonel
Master Swordsman and Master Doctor
My vendor is located just 600m outside Bestine on Tatooine at -2035 -3756.
"A door is a mystery, it is. Though most would think, 'tis a mystery to find what lies on the other side. The fundamental question is always, whether 'tis there to keep something out or to hold something in."

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Thread: IC 1-15: Combat Roles; Swordsman