Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC 1-15: Combat Roles; Swordsman
I have to agree, I feel that the damage rate does seem kind of low.
I mean if I were to swing a Cleaver, at full force, I would take off your head in one pass.
Now, I know we have to balance everything, so we can't really do one swing kills.
On the other hand, we should do a lot more damage, and bleed every time.
I am not Master yet, but I rarely have a chance against ranged Masters, even fully buffed. (1/2/2/1)
Thank you for all the great work that has gone into, and continues to go into this game!!!!
I think that swordsman, first and foremost, should be heavy hitters. They should be the melee shock troops. They have decent enough defenses to get them to the front-line and once there they should deal quick and efficient damage as well as having a small number of unique abilities they bring tot he table.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
They should be able to deal heavy, high-AP damage and do a decent (but not superior) job of defending themselves and providing a "tank" for the group.
What offensive abilities?
The damage dealing of a Swordsman should be among the most feared in the game (short of a Jedi of course =-) ). This is tempered by the fact that it is very short range. They should have high armor piercing, and a number of special abilities that make them somewhat unique and represent heavy "shock" type damage. See below for more details.
What defensive abilities?
I believe that swordsman should have a decent melee toughness but low ranged/melee defense and a poorer passive defense than most other professions. They should also have their own variant of Center of Being as it is no fun to have the same tank ability as every other melee profession and Center of Being is more of an increase in agility and finesse where Swordsman are more about in-your-face toughness. See more below on this.
What unique abilities?
Offensively:
- Swordsman should have the highest armor-piercing among melee professions, the highest damage output, and should have access to a few unique combat abilities that represent their heavy damage. A list of possible unique offensive abilities follows:
- A debuff that increases damage taken for a short period of time (~30s).
- A debuff that snares the target by 30%
- A special that has a chance to stun and/or immobilize for a rather short period of time (1-5 seconds)
- A special that has a chance to cause an enemy to flee.
- A debuff that increases damage taken for a short period of time (~30s).
Defensively:
- As a "shock" unit and a tank, Swordsman need some form of defensive ability that helps them hold their ground long enough to get their sword at the enemy's throat. I suggest instead of having a finesse move such as Center of Being that Swordsman are given a short timered resistance or ability to absorb damage. An example would be the ability to take half damage from the next N attacks, usable once every 30-60 seconds. As the Swordsman progresses in levels, N will increase from 1 to 5 and the timer will lower from a minute or two, to 30 seconds.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Swordsmen should be "ok" tanks, but they should be primarily damage dealers. Other combat professions should provide better tanking and better "control" abilities but few or none should outdo the raw damage output of a Swordsman.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
A Swordsman should be an "ok" tank especially, that would typically accede to a more proficient tank. They will tend to be primary damage dealers for a group, providing a few other utilities as expressed above.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
While Swordsman should be "ok" at tanking, especially over shorter periods, they should really shine when given a bit of room to swing their sword. Ideally a swordsman feels free to use their HAM heavily dealing damage while a more proficient tank keeps enemies busy. A Swordsman will also want good healing at their back so that they can concentrate on bringing a target down, good buffs to keep them up and keep HAM costs down, and good crowd control that will allow them to concentrate on one opponent and quickly dispatch them before moving on to the next.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
As the heavy damage dealing, heavy armor-piercing melee profession, they should excel at taking out big targets -- AT-ST's, turrets, etc. In smaller scale combat their role should be as a "shock" troop, sent out to remove the most deadly members of the opposition. A Swordsman will try to survive to grapple with the enemies healers and most devastating ranged opponents.
What defines theSwordsmanrole in combat? Heavy hitters.
What basic combat elements should they possess? What they have now is about right.
What offensive abilities? What they have now is about right. However, they need an attack that blinds a group, they need another attack thatdizzys a group (no posture change/no KD-- only damage and dizzy).
What defensive abilities? Their defense are about perfect now... however, I think that their Ranged Defense and Defense vs. Dizzy should be increased a lot. They should be utilized for turret destruction and they shouldn't be "out of the fight" from a dizzy knockdown every single time. As a result, increase their ranged defense for turret destruction and increase their Defense vs. Dizzy.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants? They should be heavily used and needed for turret destruction.... perhaps given more ranged defense to prevent the turret from hitting every single time it fires on them.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War? The power hammer needs to be MUCH MUCH more accurate since its speed is sosloooooow.
For how hard the swordman does and should hit, where is the stun and knockdown at?
Also Swordsman should induce more shock wounds and BF.
If I hit you with 25# hammer how you you feel? lol
Its good to see similar ideas from my Sword brothers.
Maybe with this much focus, we can make a change in the game!
With the following general template in mind: tka = state effects, fast hits, heavy tank; fencer w/ shield (a la gungan shields in ep 1)= ultra heavy tank, low damage; fencer as is = anti-melee unit; piker = AoE king with med to heavy damage, med tank,high speed attack, bounus vs. large creatures, and two-handers = medium tank, high damage output...
What defines theSwordsmanrole in combat?
Heavy armor piercing one on one damage;
fast to slow attack speeds based on weapons
decent AoE attacks;
What basic combat elements should they possess?
As noted above, heavy damage dealing. Medium tanking ability (better than any ranged class though);
Various weapons having various speeds and damages and inaccuracies and ham costs;
Various damage types from their various weapon types
What offensive abilities?
Keep the mind bleedand head hit attacks;
Keep area of effect attacks, but be sure to make pikers have better AoE attacks
Only state attack given should be stun or knockdown or dizzy- but no more than one total.
What defensive abilities?
very good toughness;
good melee defense;
weak ranged defense;
What unique abilities?
Special blow that cannot be blocked (how does one block a large axe descending downwards?);
Critical strike or Power attack on timer (?)
Part of thier uniqueness should come from a wide range of weaponry available for use- they're main focus is damage dealing, and using various weapons to deal various kinds of damage
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Ability to provide heavy damage close up to any creature using a weapon that has a damage type that matches a weakness on the creature;
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Good as a single target destroyer and decent against groups, they are upstaged by tka's for state effects, pikers for AoE damage, and fencers as main tanks.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
As noted above. Should be vulnerable to fencers.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Heavy Shock troops that run in to break the lines by swinging their huge weapons around.
Accel at close quarters indoor combat one on one;
Accel at hard (armored) targets
What defines theSwordsmanrole in combat?
I see the Swordsman as the "berserker class" These are the guys up near the front of the line with the 6ft long swords in their hands screaming at you (think Braveheart).
What basic combat elements should they possess?
I agree that the Swordsman would be the high damage dealer, medium damage taker. We're slow, but powerful.
What offensive abilities?
Yup yup, keep our bleeds and head hits, but we need a knockdown or stun or something. If you get hit square in the chest by a guy swing a huge hammer around, you're going down.
What defensive abilities?
As a heavy swordsman, we would be the once who can't dodge very well, leave that to the fencers. However we should be able to take more direct hits than the fencers and the ranged classes.
What unique abilities?
As I mentioned with the offensive abilities, our bleeds and head hits; we also should have really heavy damage dealing specials.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Should be able to take more damage than most, but not be the ultimate tank. We should be the slow heavy damage guys in melee just as rifleman arein ranged.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Obviously weneed the crafting professions for weapons/armor and medic professions for healing/buffs.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
We should be able to take a good amount of melee damage, but be vulnerable to ranged.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
I would see the swordsman as the primary melee offense in the GCW. We are the elite marines sent in to break the line and take out the armored targets.
"How about allowing armoursmiths to craft Shields for swordsman only. They could have different attributes like mind defense or a really highly polished shield could reflect mind attacks."
Didn't the gungans use small energy shields in esp II during the battle of Naboo? Why not add those into the game?
The shields were in Ep 1 
Anyway, I think the idea of having shields wont work, simply because were 2handed swordsmen, so we need both hands to use our weapons. I wouldn't mind seeing them on fencers, but the fact of the matter is that we need both hands to weild our heavy weapons, which is a unique advantage to us 
I wouldn't mind seeing a buckler (like a mini shield that is attached to your arm / armour) but I dont think the devs are going to do anything like that just yet..
What defines theSwordsmanrole in combat?
I think swordsman could go one of two ways:-
Beserker - All damage little sense of self preservation
Knight - Armour at the cost of speed
What basic combat elements should they possess?
Beserker - Some sort of regeneration maybe, big hits for massive damage, seriously penalties for wearing armour.
Knight - Additional boosts to resists of any armour worn, reduced encumberance from armour worn, slow to hit but good damage.
What offensive abilities?
Berserker - Frenzy (AoE attack, possibility of hitting grouped people if they are too close), Enrage (Damage done is in proportion to the creatures HAM, takes extra damage if hit), Bleeds
Knight - Similar things to current.
What defensive abilities?
Beserker - Regen maybe
Knight - Armour bonuses, reduced encumberance.
What unique abilities?
Beserker - Regen maybe
Knight - Armour bonuses, reduced encumberance.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Berserker - Massive damage dealer
Knight- The ultimate tank
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Berserker - Will need healers
Knight - May need assistance with damage, big armoursmith customer
I really dont mind my 2hand sword skills. I HATE the power hammer, put some big spikeson it and maybe ill start swingin it.
I like how you it attacks the mind, a definate advantage.
I do agree with maybe at least one status change.
I'm on the fence with knockdowns...i would rather see them taken from the other professions. Or at least modified so its a knockdown with a higher damage special hit, then the other guy gets a chance to get back up and you can't re-use the move for 15-20 seconds. Would definatly add variety and take some of the frustration out of pvp.
I also agree with the higher damage less defence point of view expressed by the rest of the board here.
In the end I guess we are pretty united on what we want our swordsmen to be...its just up to the dev's to balance out the professions. I took rifles in sept. and I still have it but I am very annoyed with the fact that 40% of the game uses em now. I don't want them to overpower us, because I don't want the same thing to happen.
Anyway I'm starting to ramble, I agree with the posts on what our profession should be.
"I would see the swordsman as the primary melee offense in the GCW. We are the elite marines sent in to break the line and take out the armored targets."
I'm sorry, I just have to laugh at this. Swordsman as "elite marines?" LOL
Some things I want to point out:
1. If there is a class that resembles an "elite marine" in SWG, it's the Commando. Plain and simple.
2. The very idea of a 6ft long sword-carrying brute being considered a "marine" is just funny.
3. The very idea of a 6ft long-sword-carrying brute being able to "break the line and take out armored targets" in Star Wars is so hilarious, I'm actually crying at my keyboard right now.
4. This is not EverQuest. People who carry swords in a galaxy full of blasters, lasers, and lightsabers should always be a significant disadvantage.
Sorry...lol, that post was just funny.