Development Cycle Archive

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Holocron wrote:

This is an upcoming change on TC. The change was made because this is what schematics were always supposed to be limited to--there is a bug that lets you put in a value larger than 100 right now.

I see some negative reaction to this change. How impactful is it? What is a reasonable limit in your mind?

I'll state up front that there may be DB reasons why we don't want a huge number here, so I will have to check on whether changing it is feasible at all.

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As I read this entire thread, I kept trying to figure out how a schematic that can create 100 items is any different than one that create 1000. The only thing I can think of, given my limited DB knowledge, is that a large schematic will sit in the DB for a longer period of time. If that is the only issue with the size of the run, then why not limit us to the number of schematics we can have at any given time. It will force people to delete old ones (most likely caused by running out of a particular resource) before we can make another. I don't know what number this would be, but I can't imagine needing more than 50 schematics at any given time.

It was stated in another post that each crate counts as one item in the DB. If storage is suchan issue, then why is the number of items able to fit into a crate so varied? Wouldn't it save DB space if the number of items in a crate was equal to the number of the schematic run? We should then be allowed to split and restack the crates as needed.

As for the impact question about this change, I am in agreement with the majority until I can get get an explanation of the DB issues that could possibly sway me towards accepting the 100 limit. I personally have not run into the problems the others have stated, since I haven't been playing with factories for very long. I see the potential problems for my crafting future clearly though.

Dalnin
(Bubo Ubotin, Master Weaponsmith, Lowca)

As an architect, the limits are way to low already. Lets just look at doing a factory run of medium houses. A generic medium house requires 6 walls, each wall is made from 10 structural modules. That is 60 structural modules justto build it by hand. With a limit of 100 items on a schematic I can make only 1 medium house in a factory, because of the identical serial numbers required in a schematic. I have been meaning to try making 2 runs of structure modules, and putting 5 from each into the slots to see if the schematic can recognize there are 2 serial numbers.

1000 item limit on a schematic would at least let me do a run of 9 large houses. Even now with the bug that lets you make more than 100 items, it is alot of work, because I have to hand load 90 modules and the resources to be able to run just 9 walls (input hopper only allows 100 items). and rinse and repeat.

I know that the factories using items from crates is being addressed, so that may clear up the latter issue. It will be interesting to see where the final decision falls on this. I know for now I rarely build anything, a factory for a Master Architect is basicly just a tool to make a couple of identical items, while they make the rest by hand.

a schematic of 100 structural modules would only build 10 walls. Quite often I have an order for a half a dozen heavy machines - that's 500-700 modules. Would be nice to not have to stay near the structure factory the whole time I am in the game to feed the next schematic for 100. I still have to go back and run a schematic for walls after that. 1000 is perfect. Resource shift usually makes these schematics worthless after a week anyway.

Theodis Darkstar

Master Architect, NHoC

Kaadara, Naboo 5260 6060

Corbantis

Please save Combat medic and doctors....with 100limit we cant do high end component in crater larger then 33!!!!

It'll be a big problem for the medic profession as many had pointed out. With this we can only manufacture crates of 32 StimEs. I do not want to have to check my factoryevery 2 hours. It's a chore to do my3-day harvester-runs now, please do not add more tedium to crafting.Common sense says it will create more loadfor your database, not less.

I'd suggest a 1000 limit for subcomponents, 500 limit for final product.

Utterly rediculous - High level medical products (require 3 of each subcomponent) could only then be made in batches of 32s. If this was intended, why do crates go up to 50?

Constructive Soultion: Setup a system to duplicate schematics through some complex process to allow us to create more than 32 of a given product.

In addition, the time this would require would be astounding. I would have to log on every few hours in order for this to be viable.

Constructive Soultion: Allow queueing of schematics (brainstorming a table layout for "Factory Runs" similar to friend's list. Some "Move Up"/"Move Down" controls, "Add" and "Remove" - same 'ol UI. This would be even better were the schematics able to put the product into the ingredient hopper - I could pop out some subcomponents and setup a final product schematic, then cram it all in the factory to run for a day or so)

I feel very strongly that the SLIDE BAR should be fixed to allow item counts of up to 1000.

Please DO NOT reduce the maximum number of items in a manufacturing schematic, it will merely add more tedium to activities that are already a major time sink. Anyone who is concerned about this number is someone who is already spending a great deal of time chasing resources and running a business.

Malloc Err

Tarquinas

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Idag wrote:

The object of this game is balance....so lets look at what effects the need for a factory......

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That's not the OBJECT of Star Wars Galaxies. The Object is to have a fun and entertaining time.

Balance is an element of the Design Methodology.

I say remove the limit of a shematic completeley, they are limited by the resources.

Make crates bigger (like 1000) and let us split them if we want.

This 2 things will make it better for the crafters and the DB.

20 pages... ask a question, get an answer, I guess.

Seems to me, it makes sense to have it be different for each item, maybe depending on the level of crafting skill that gives access to that item.

Like Biological Effect Controllers: given in Novice Medic, used all the way through to Master Doctor. Let us make something ridiculous like 5000. Same with Liquids.

As the items increase in stature, the count decreases, Small Stim-E's could max out at 50.

Then again, this makes schems that call for creature resources even more painful, but by all means, don't let that encourage you.

-Clove Davon

500 seems a good middle ground I suppose. Many people are saying they make schematics for 1000 but rarely use that many. Considering the need for identical factory made components in so many schematics, 100 is too low. Please make it 500, at least.

Please don't lower the schematic size to 100. Using 10 structure modules per wall is bad enough as it is, with the only saving grace being that I can produce 300 structure modules and then hand-load the factory with 90 at a time to produce 29 walls. (note: Structure factories do not pull Structure Modules from input hopper crates.. I even tried with 10 crates of identical modules in case it wanted a crate for each input item)

Having to micro-manage the factory, track which crates were used to make the wall schematic and then tend the factory for repeated runs (when I could be out hunting with friends) is definitely not fun.

Please leave the limit at 1000 (I've never managed to get the 200k ore to actually make 1000.. but it seems that leaving it as it is will be less bug-prone than altering limits).

Geno
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The Mercantile
Theed, Naboo, Tempest

I think it needs to be 300-500 at least for components. With a limit of 100, if I need 10 identical components for 1 item, then after making the schematic I can only make 9 of the final product Thats assuming that the first schematic comes out good, because if it doesn't then in the end I willmost likely only be able to me 7 or 8...this would make crafting even more difficult than it already is. Things like broken schematics, components that add nothing to the final product, and specific resource requirements that NEVER have the qualities required for the final product need to be fixed first at least, before making crafting even more frustrating by limiting the schematic size to 100.