Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC 1-13: Combat Roles; Scout
Maybe scouts should be able to use traps or darts on other players
Like the bounty hunter boba or jango fett
Give defence against critters
Better traps
Well thats what i got
What defines theScout role in combat?
The scout's role in combat is to seek opportunities to exploit weaknesses in the enemy, whether that enemy is vs. NPCs or vs. creatures. As such, their abilities should be listed in the support category.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
As per their role in combat, Scouts should have the basic ability, whether passive or active, to find a "weakness" in the enemy, to allow greater damage for themselves, or even their party members (but only as they gain more skill in the case of party members, or even party member bonuses could be given to the ranger). This "greater damage" might not always translate into actual health damage, but could instead translate into an increased chance of getting a state effect, such as blindness, to work on theenemy. The bonus could easily scale, say 5% to 25% at master(or +5 to +20 bonus for getting state effects to work, or something like that). This should not be a really big bonus, as the scout is a support character, not a combat monster. Alternatively, theScout's "find weakness" ability could translate into loweredenemy resistance or even lowered armor.I think this second idea works better as an active ability, rather than a passive, but I think my first idea works better as a passive bonus, just to throw in another opinion. The survival tree right now seems the perfect place to put this set of abilities, since part of surviving has to deal with finding the weakness of your enemy so you can survive.
What offensive abilities?
Easy, the offensive abilities of the scout are their traps. However, currently the traps are thrown at about half the speed that one can shoot, and if they do damage instead of a state effect, it is generally small. I will grant however that the traps for a scout are designed in such a way that a ranger has a reason for using their traps, and for the sake of game balance, it is possible these traps should remain much the same. I will also say that gaining a speed bonus for higher levels of trap skill (to throw them faster) would be nice. This is the primary reason I don't use traps right now, since I can have a foe dead long before I can unload a series of traps on them.
What defensive abilities?
The scout shouldn't be thought of as a "combat" profession, per se. As such, beyond their traps and the "find weakness" ability I proposed, I don't see that they should gain any extra defensive abilities.
What unique abilities?
As someone else stated, right now the only unique abilities a scout has is the ability to traverse uphill terrain faster, and to create camps. In a way, terrain movement bonuses are shared by the squad leader and rangers, but I would say that 90% + of the players out there are dependent on personal scouting skills for this bonus, which is why I consider it unique. However, many folks are quite happy to save their skill points and just ride a mount or vehicle to get from place to place, and happily got rid of this skill, making this unique skill a moot point unless fighting on Dathomir. Those cliffs are a pain, even for a master scout! Anyway, I digress. So, since the first unique ability is mostly moot, we move on to the second. The basic camp is generally all someone needs to get by, and so many folks aren't interested in learning better camping techniques, especially since getting survival experience is a long and quite boring process. So again, this "unique ability" isn't really all that special, or even that interesting. Mainly, people learn this skill to either become a Bounty Hunter or a Ranger, but few others even bother.
Having said all that, the scout has no interesting or even overly useful unique abilities, especially where combat is concerned. However, a small bonus used to defeat the enemy seems readily appropriate, since the Scout really doesn't do all that much scouting as things currently stand. Most just use the Scout's abilities to pick up Hide, Meat or Bone resources, I would wager.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
I think that the above "find weakness" will add quite well to group combat, as would actually making traps hit multiple targets (if that doesn't happen... I've never hit more than one target at a time with them), since they look like a small explosion. Speeding up the rate at which traps can be thrown would also be nice. Lastly, the ability to stack traps on top of one another (so you don't have traps filling your inventory) would be pretty nice overall, not just in group combat.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
I'm not sure how to answer this one. The archetypical Scout would be a sort of loner, and would interact with others as little as possible, unless the others were also Scouts. However, this is Star Wars, not a fantasy game, so I can't say that holds true. Right now, it seems their interaction is primarily with other combat characters, as they go out and grab much-needed resources.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
If the player involved isn't willing to spend points on their own combat skills (for whatever reason), then the Scout should (and will!) be highly dependent on others in combat, their traps and my proposed "find weakness" not withstanding. Eventually, the scout is just plain going to need to shoot, even if he fires off all of his traps at the target(s). However, you can make a master scout and still master one of the elite combat professions, so this generally isn't a problem, as long as they aren't hoarding their skill points for a non-combat profession.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
I cannot see an actual unique role for them in the GCW, other than what I've already stated, as the abilities I proposed would affect all aspects of Scouting life, including the GCW.
What defines theScout role in combat?
Currently, the Scout's combat role is one of avoidance. Terrain Negotiationand Burst Run Efficiency are the only useful skills in combat vs. humanoids. Mask Scent and their Creature To-hit Bonus are also useful against creatures. Traps are the main weapon/tool of the current Scout, but are poorly designed and of limited usefulness.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
Low-damage long-range combat designed to harass humanoid opponents. Increased effectiveness vs. creatures.
What offensive abilities?
A weapon certification or attack that does a small amount of damage but has a high chance of wounding humanoids making them easier for others to handle in close combat.
A weapon certification for a laser "range-finder" which would allow the Scout to "paint" targets. This would either reduce the target's Dodge modifier, or provide a To-Hit Bonus to some other weapon (Commando?). This cert should be placed in the Explore Branch so that Squad Leaders would also have access.
Of particular note, Novice Scouts are not given ANY of the existing combat modifiers or skills (aside from traps). This should be changed to promote a more even progression through the profession.
What defensive abilities?
Mask Scent, Burst Run, and Terrain Negotiation are all very useful abilities (although somewhat devalued with vehicles/mounts).
A bonus to defense at long-range when kneeling or prone would work well with this template. This would prompt humanoid combatants to try toclose the distance. This would allow Scouts to pull MOBs and/or break and run.
What unique abilities?
Extended range on the radar or more information on maps would assist with threat-assessment, but may not be practical from a coding stand-point. Particularly when spawns occur at such short-range.
The ability to place traps instead of throwing them. This would allow Scouts to "herd" opponents toward ambushes, cover retreats, or protect a combat groups flank. (Rangers could expound on this ability by being able to conceal the placed traps.)
The ability to place a Lure. A salt-lick, or pile of fruit to draw in animals is often used in hunting. This ability/trap would cause a spawn of one or two appropriate animals in the area it is used/placed. Making this a trap would seem more balanced from a resource production point of view. In effect, this provides a way to take 20 units of fruit and use it to gain 20 units of animal resources.
A 10% reduction in Faction Penalty for killing NPC's of minor factions(or a 10% bonus to Faction rewards of minor factions). This allows the Scout to more easily control his or her standing with the various groups he or she might encounter in the wilderness. This in turn reduces the likelihood of being attacked while travelling cross-country. (The Smuggler could share this ability.)
Adding a +1 to max creature level in the Master Box would promote a greater variety of pets/mounts used and strengthen the ties between CH and Scout. It would also promote the "wilderness" feel of the Scout profession.
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
The ability to place traps would allow them to hinder an opponents advance or retreat (depending on the location placed) and create "kill corridors" for the combatants of the group.
A low-damage attack with high probability of generating wounds allows Scouts to soften up opponents at range before the "Tanks" close to finish them off.
The ability to "paint" potential targets would be an asset to groups if it made those targets easier to hit. It would also be an asset if "painting" a target affected its color or icon on the radar/HUD or made it easier for those in the group to target (<Ctr-P>, for example).
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Providing organic resources for crafting is the focus of the Hunting Branch. Foraging should retrieve items that can be used as replacement medical components or as optional enhancements to foods and buffs.
Traps (if placed instead of thrown) and Camps would create defensive positions and safe havens for travel. Camps could be designed to reduce the delay on the Burst Run timer to add effectiveness to them once they no longer are needed to call vehicles.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
Allowing Scouts to harrass foes at a distance with long-range weaponry, "paint" foes for his or her group, and place traps to limit movement requires that there be an attacking force to benefit from this work.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
Threat-Assessment and Forward Observation. This is difficult to simulate with the current Radar/Spawn system. The best we can hope for is to be hard to hit and impossible to catch. The use of placed traps to protect "borders" and hinder movement would probably be the Scouts greatest contribution to whichever side he or she supports.
Tam Darkfell (Infinity/Intrepid) / Vendt Darkfell (TC)
Support. Traps should debuff and camps should buff, regen rates for this new combat special action cost should be faster in a camp, i.e. fighting from a camp should be flat out better.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
Camps should be usefull during combat, that means that traps need to either not break a camp or be actual traps that are triggerd by proximity, perhapse leave it as it is then a scout could debuff and /peace then make a camp, but that won't work for PvP so for PvP combat should not break camp. Allow creation of a set duration camp that remains active for 5 minuts but does not break under any circumstance and allows the scout to make another camp, this could spam the world with camps but its a max of one stand alone camp and one owned camp and the stand alone would not be tied to the player so would need less database room.
What offensive abilities?
Traps are more support than offence.
What defensive abilities?
Maybe some extra defence against animals?
What unique abilities?
Regenerating of HAM lost through combat spam (if this is balanced so as to be relavent which it realy ought to be as its a central plank of the combat changes).
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
Camps, traps and Scouting - the weakness of animals should not be visable to all in examine, that should be a scout skill.
How could/should they interact with other professions?
Scouts mostly provide benefit to others and produce organics for crafting, potentialy a lynch pin of group play.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
No one is just a scout, realy the killing and tanking need to be done by other proffesions, the scout can say 'this one has wooly hide and is strong against heat'. It would be great if mobs were more variable in terms of resists and only scouts could know.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
I don't think that much dev time needs to go into giving novice proffesions a unique role in the GCW but perhapse some type of base that is covert and needs to be 'scouted' to become attackable.
Request For Comments:
Trapping Tree: Traps should be effective to NPCs as well.
Hunting Tree: Harvestables should have a higher yield per Hunting box, as it is now, the yield per box gained is very small in comparison.
Survival Tree: The camps should have the ability to repel creatures as the description says, right now, it doesn't do that. It varies per camp on through the ranger camps on how much it should repel.
Exploration Tree is Fine.
Brisc for President!
Also, what's up with the view range in SWG? A lot of people mentioned scouts should "scout" but I can't see anything until I'm right up on it. Often times, things will appear right next to me even though I have every possible viewing range option turned up all the way.
scout has really no role in combat except the ability to run fast and help catch people running away.
What basic combat elements should they possess?
they need to be able to use traps on humanoids. in games such as team fortress scouts have the abilites to discover scouts. maybe make scouts like mobil faction scanners?
What offensive abilities?
scout is not a class that takes up much skill points so they can get a combat class to attack stuff
What defensive abilities?
they should be able to hide and maybe have camp disguise people from others by possibley hiding everyone in camp on radar and lessen visibility on camps. also maybe on classes such as ranger the camps they make could maybe have a turrent to attack any animals that agro on people in camp?
What unique abilities?
while i was reading this post i had a couple of good ideas. maybe scouts should be allowed to have a trap on humanoids so that when u toss it on them it angers the animals around and has them attack the target (all animals including pets). also to decrease time scouts spend harvesting maybe a trap system that works like havesters and the scout has to go check his traps to see if he caught anything also taking in peoples pets that would not only increase sales by bio-engineer but keep pets to ch and be mostly. also since bh is the only class that has to master scout maybe a bonus like a poisen dart against humans that maybe causes a poisen dot and if not healed in (o i dont know) 30 seconds its a ranged db
Should add what advantage or asset in group combat?
How could/should they interact with other professions?
along with the fact that they gather hide and such. and the camps for calling pets and such for the skill pts cost i think that this is a good enough reason for scout.
What interaction / dependencies should exist with other combatants?
scouts should stay away from combat if possible because most of there skills are to hide themselves from animals.
What should be their unique role in the Galactic Civil War?
like i said above maybe make them like mobil faction scanners?
one note i would like to add is that i understand that you want bh to be something hard to obtain but come on why do we need the whole scout tree.