Development Cycle Archive

ERRR-corrects self- ON BEDS AND COUCHES!

Oh sheesh, to add insult to injury, scouts and rangers are considered combat classes and not smugglers?

That's simply a disgrace... Smuggler requires a combat line from both Marksman and Brawleras prequisites in addition to a chunk of pistol xp.

Scouts and Rangers build traps and camps as far as I can tell. We shoot people in the crotch. Which one is more combat oriented?

I second all the people in this thread who have decried the lack of a smuggler combat thread. I'm at a loss as to how a profession that needs all that pistol xp is left out in the cold while a profession like scout get a thread! Honestly, how you can consider a scout a combat class is beyond me, but what is even wilder is that you don't consider the smuggler profession one. I would venture to say that we're as much a combat class, if not more, than many of the professions that have a thread in this forum of yours. Compare someone with only scout skills and someone with only smuggler skills. Which one is betterat COMBAT?.....

Dinian,

I totally agree. There isn't any combat experience even garnered by being a Scout or Ranger. You don't get any weapons experience for anything you do and yet they are within the realm of Combat. I agree they should be. By trade they must fight and slaughter creatures to obtain their skills (if they solo). Although you could actually do the entire tree while in groups and never use a weapon other than traps - oh - wait traps must not be a weapon cause they don't work on me although I think they should work on me and you and NPC's. But I've said that since - well - a long long time ago.

Smuggler's on the other hand must use a pistol to make it though two branches of their tree. I'm really not sure what the reasoning is that we we're left off of the combat discussions unless we have a bigger, grander scheme in our stars and we are going to be so super elite that we won't need combat - maybe we'll be the only pilots allowed in the galaxy .

Although I expect there is a better explanation than that.

I will say that as a group we need to be more constructive in our posts here. Let's not just be critical as being more constructive and giving wondering glances will probably elicit a respnse much quicker - although it is obvious now by the number of posts and the number of those that are about smuggler's ommission from combat that we would like some sort of response. I will continue to pray.

.

May I ask why Jedi is not listed here ?

This is what bothers me about Smugglers being omitted:

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Thunderheart wrote:

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electricnomad wrote:

Here are some ideas myself and others had for the Smuggler overhaul:

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First, we have a word-association game we played. We were asked to write five words that we associated with a Smuggler. After getting maybetwo dozen responses, these were the most frequently repeated themes:

evasive / sneaky / sly / shadowy / shady / incognito / secretive - 13

resourceful / inventive / McGuyver / quick-thinking- 10

fast-talker / confident / negotiator / suave / silver-tongued / witty- 8

aware / sharp / smart / cunning / perceptive / shrewd- 6

dangerous- 5

pilot - 5

networker / contacts / connections / connected- 5

outlaw / criminal / thief / underworld- 5

tinkerer - 4

gambler - 4

independent / self-reliant - 4

cocky / brash / unafraid- 4

roguish / underhanded - 3

survivor / alive / durable - 3

versatile - 2

lucky - 2

stylish / pimp - 2

quick / agile - 2

risky / danger - 2

greedy / avaricious - 2

This is hardly scientific, but as a straw poll, I think it's useful to see how a roomful of us envision a Smuggler.

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=smuggler&message.id=45843&page=1

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Second, here are some compiled ideas for a Smuggler overhaul - nothing comprehensive, but just a few brainstorming ideas from the past few months:

Okay, I never made a "Yay for me, the new Master Smuggler" post, so I'm cashing in some ego points and making this.

Actually, I've been making this post since, oh, July or so, when I started posting ideas on how to improve the profession. Here are the ideas I like the best, color-coded a bit to divide the concepts:

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GIVE EXPERIENCED SMUGGLERS ACCESS TO MORE SMUGGLER CONTENT:

After seeing what the Devs did with Creature Handlers and "Creature Level," it occurred to me that the eventual "content" of Smuggler should be handled the same way.

In other words, use Underworld for something other than simply our "content" line. Turn it into defensive/combat modifiers, or unarmed specials, or state defenses, or something else (I'd like to see Brawler tied into it somehow and make us tougher to kill). The key is to do something with it now, not just leave it as a blank pointsink we need in order to become Master Smugglers.

When the Devs do introduce content in the future, handle it as the Devsare instituting"Creature Level" in CH - as you climb each tree, you get bonuses to your "Content Level." Let's call it "Smuggler Sense." Depending on your "Smuggler Sense," you would get better, more challenging (and higher-paying) missions, and would have access to higher-end content. Advancing in one branch of Smuggler would gain you better content, but unless you climbed several branches, you'd be far behind other Smugglers in terms of content.

Here's a sample tree, counting only the proposed "Smuggler Sense" modification:

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Master Smuggler = +15

+8 / +8 / +8 / +8

+6 / +6 / +6/ +6

+4 / +4 / +4 / +4

+2 / +2 / +2 / +2

Novice Smuggler = +5

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Based on that, a Master Smuggler would have a "Smuggler Sense" of +100, and get access to all Smuggler content in the game, including the best payouts. However, someone who went up, say, the Dirty Fighting line would have +25 "Smuggler Sense" - not much, but enough to do some basic smuggling work. Novices would have access to the lowest of the low in terms of content - but that's howit should be, really.

I think a system like this could solve two problems in one:

1) It would spread content over the entire tree rather than pack it all into a single branch, rewarding people who invest more skillpoints in Smuggler with better,more challengingcontent.

2) It would enable a faster solution to the black hole of the Underworld line - we could get some modifications there now, rather than wait (months? years?) until the Devs figure out how to implement Smuggler content, which would be tied to the entire skilltree rather than just one branch.

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TARIFFS AS A WAY TO ENCOURAGE EVERYDAY, NON-MISSION SMUGGLING:

This is a rough idea, but I'd like to see Galactic Import Tariffs and a customs evasionminigame for Smugglers.

Institute a tariff oncertain flaggedgoods thatenter Starports from another Starport (track it during the loading screen). Let's say each weapon costs 100 credits to import, each stack of 500 or more units of resources costs 1000 credits at the border, each droid costs 1000 credits to import, each vehicle costs 5000 credits, etc. All items get a tariff applied to them, kind of like insurance. You can pay in advance or try your hand at smuggling, and everyone in the game should have a small chance of smuggling a certain amount of goods - say a 10% chance for anyone to smuggle three or four items.

The only people who can dodge the tariff with great skillare Smugglers. Depending on their skill level, they have a better chance of going through customs undetected. Bypassing customs successfully would let the Smuggler warp out to the Starport like normal. Getting busted, however, would require any number of fixes - fast talking to dodge the guards even after a failure; bribes to pay off a detection and lose a cut of the profit, if not all of it; and all-out fighting off the guards, which should drop the secondary Faction of whatever type of customs officials you attacked (CorSec, RSF, etc). The customs minigame could play out in a side room at the Starport where detained players and Smugglers would warp into, rather than the usual landing pad.

Bonuses to help with the Customs minigame include disguise skills and factional disguises (see below).

In the event that someone did not have the cash to cover a fine or a bribe, the items would simply be confiscated. There would be a warning anytime you bought a ticket to somewhere and you had contraband on you, so people would have the option to either ditch the gear or find a Smuggler to handle it or even to take a chance on importing it themself.

To add some flavor to the game, I'd like to see certain items illegal on some planets but perfectly legal on others. Say, all vehicles are officially banned from Endor and Dathomir, and the only way to avoid outright confiscation is to smuggle them through.

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SMUGGLER CONTENT & GENERAL 'UNDERWORLD' SKILLS:

Smugglers don't do anything that justifies their title, namely smuggling. We have a few ideas for how to remedy this situation, and these fit squarely in the still-incomplete Underworld skill branch. These are major changes that require major space:

A) Smuggler Missions - sprinkle NPCs in various locations to act as mission terminals (it's more "smuggler-ish" to get a mission from an NPC rather than a computer terminal). Based on our "Smuggler Sense," give us missions that require us to pick up and deliver various illegal items (or perhaps make them and deliver them). These missions would have to be different than simple delivery missions; there would have to be danger involved. We have a few ideas on how to deal with that, too:

1. First, authorities in cities (CorSec, Stormtroopers, etc) would have a limited-range detection ability of illegal items. Smugglers would be able to counter this with a kind of a /maskscent abilityto cover up the illegal items, but it would never be close to 100% successful (maybe 80% - it has to be dangerous). Maybe just be direct and call the skill /smuggle.
   
2. Second, taking a Smuggler mission would alert Bounty Hunters somehow. Whether it would open a mission or whether all BHs would get a TEF against the Smuggler, we don't know. To counter this danger, Smugglers would get a new ability (also similar to /maskscent) called /disguise. The new /disguise command would obscure the Smuggler's TEF and make him appear as a blue dot on the radar. As above, even a Master Smuggler shouldn't be able to do this perfectly, and maybe a max 80% success rate would be fair.

In the event that Smugglers are detected by either Bounty Hunters or authorities (depending on which one you use, if not both), Smugglers would either have to run or fight if they wanted to complete their mission. A Smuggler's "Smuggler Sense" would affect how many Smuggler missions a person could accept at any time, and would affect the level of payouts. Perhaps advancement along the Underworld skill branch would make more NPC "sources" accessible to Smugglers as their network of underworld inflormants expands. In addition,separate general "Smuggler XP" would have to be earned by completing the new Smuggler missions, so Pistol XP would be stripped from this tree.

B) Interfactional Trading Permission - allow Smugglers to be intermediaries for Factions. As it stands, Faction members can't trade with each other. Make Smugglers the conduit for trade they're supposed to be. This should be a low-level skill in the revamped Underworld.

C) New Factions - Hutts, Valerians, Black Sun, etc. Give Smugglers a non-GCW-aligned group that offers Faction missions (see above for NPCs doling out Smuggler missions). Also give them Faction perks like special gear and NPC pets. Allow Smugglers to work for one of the GCW sides in addition to a criminal syndicate - they know how to play multiple sides, after all, and criminals are busy with their own 'wars.'

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Part Two coming right up . . .

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Please save this for the In Concept thread. I want to make sure its included in the right spot...thanks

Kurt "Thunderheart" Stangl
Assistant Community Relations Manager

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http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=in_live&message.id=608#M608

So, Thunderheart, you basically shut me down and told me to wait for the In Concept thread.

So where is it, if not in the batch of combat profession concerns?

Players need unarmed xp and pistol xp to become a novice smuggler... then we need millions of pistol xp to reach master... so.... where is our combat thread?

Smugglers are absolutely sick of being lied to. We have been told time and time again that we're next, we're getting an overhaul, we'll be fixed in the next publish, we'll be fixed in the publish after next, etc...

THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR THIS. Do not tell us that things have come up and now that Player Cities, Mounts, and Vehicles are in, we'll be next... DO NOT TELL US that we will be fixed in the next patch when, in fact, no thought has been given to the smuggler's development.

A dev appeared in the smuggler forums asking for more "up to date" suggestions even though each item in the forum is still accurate since no changes were made in half a year.

There is no excuse for this. If I were really a resident of tatooine in real life, I would have long ago convinced Jabba the Hutt to put a bounty out on the people responsible for lying to us.

PLEASE TELL US THE TRUTH - Tell us that we are not being fixed for 6-9 months so I can drop this **edit** profession and try something else. I am being led to believe that the second I drop it, fixes will go to the test center. Please stop playing with me, so I can continue playing SWG. Thanks.

A theme it seems is appearing in the class specific posts. Many people are citing very "war-like" abilities for their classes. Discussing them in terms of their roles in battle - and large scale battles at that. People write about lines of pikeman, and cavalry charges that wouldn't find much use in the current game, since large scale battles aren't exactly routine. Hopefully revised battlefields will allow for a broader use of tactics, so that rifleman pinning down enemeis, and cavalry charges do start to happen. And mysteriously blown up buildings are immediately blamed on commando's that noone knew were there.

how does it make you all feel when completely backstabbing the correspondents, ignoring their hails and just go ahead and create a numbers of thread stating that this is where each professions should write their issues, and etc... this is pretty weak all in all, and should have been discussed with the correspondents before launch... at least give the poor fellahs a chance to prepare themselves

Please read full post before you reply...

There are professions in this game that entirely worthless, being as that you dont even need to "play" them. I propose a complete revamp of the game professions that could work within theexisting system. Before I share with you my solution. Lets examine why the game is very flawed.

1. I can macro my way into any profession.This is an evil we all live with due to holomania.

2. I can set up repeating macros and leave my computer on 24/7 and not even be playing the game !!!

Stupid. Plain and simple, this game is stupid if I dont even have to play to play, but yet I have to pay to play.

Here is the fix. Hybrid professions of a totally new kind. The professions having anything to do with Entertainer are WORTHLESS at this point and could be NPC's. Medic? Patheticly boring. Artisan, boring. Basically all non cabat professions in this game can be mastered and made eilte without playing them in most cases. I suggestgiving the combat professions a whole new reliance on these currently worthless professions.

Lets make this easy by giving examples:

A master smuggler gets doctor skills as an enhancing choice...now I can make even better drugs than other master smugglers.

Another master smuggler decides to go for Image Design/smuggler hybrid. I now can elude the attack of the opposing faction even if Im overt. (just thouhts here folks)

Yet another master smuggler hybrids with weaponsmith and can make and slice the galaxies best and most illegal weapons.

or perhaps another profession to dabble in like this:

Master Bounty Hunter gains doc skills and now can use biological weapons to kill their target.

The Master BH decides to go for Image Designer and NON of there marks go red and they can track their marks better...

or perhpas the MBH gets weaponsmith and can make the galaxies most feared weapon of all time....the Mutliphasic Cannon...which does damage to ALL forms of resists. (heavy ham costs of course lol)

Take this concept and it apply it to ALL the combat professions and these worthless macro'd professions all of a sudden bring on a whole new value and interest. Not only that...but it can be done using the existing system.

For instance, if I have investigation 2 and at least 2/2/2/2 Image designer I can now droid track +5 and my marks are NEVER red anymore.

This could, should and will be done if this game is to last much longer. Honetly, the one good thing getting into the holocron grind has done for me is make me realize most of these professions suck and need to be given value.

Add flavor...

THE

Cho-sen Won

(hopeful) Maybe we're getting our own thread? Since nobody knows where to putus smugglers anyhow?

Can it be our turn next? Pleeeeeeeeeeaaaase? /beg ; /pout

TH, is the radar going to be adjusted so that PC enemies won't show as red dots so sometactics will be possible?

i agree with cho-sen's post tho thats more hi-bred abilities which i think would be great... I also think interlinking content with proffessions would be great here is one example since im a musician/ politician:

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once smuglers can smuggle, they go to the cantina and talk with an entertainer. Said entertainer has gone on an entertainer mission which told them that if smuglers fly our of X starport they can avoid the "police" and have a much better chance of smuggling. Or a BH walks in and asks a ent to "ask his contacts about said mark" the ent goes on a short mission and tells that bh hey they can be found at this location in off times and are easier to kill... but they cant look like they do or they will be spoted cause the mark know's your after them... visit a ID and they will fixyou up. or another mission finding that X resouces is spawning at this general area now and artisans should hunt it down. Or take this further.... A BH needs x weapon to take out this mark (say it has 50 shots or something) to get this weapon they need specific parts which are on say talus but the crafting stations capible of making them are on tatooine... The parts are illegal so they need a smugler to take them off planet, smugler doesnt want to mess it up so goes to the cantina to find the best place to smuggle them, entertainer say'sthat (fill in the blank ..don't know talus well) starport is the best to smuggle out of today because the guards are off watching an event... smuggler smuggles it to the WS the WS makes the gun, the BH finds the mark via droids or the enterainer/ ID person fix and bam mission complete. say this mission pays three times as much to cover the extra expenses so the bh can take the simple (solo) or the quest missions (team) everyone is happier, ton's of content player driven was just added and a need for many more proffessions was just created. I think that docs could fill a similar role in this type of senario as well with a doc twist... I realize the second idea would be a little harder to code but common i think we would all agree it would encourage atk play and make it more fun for everyone!

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well thats just and idea/ example for you TH how we can include all the proffessions in the game and make the whole thing have more content rather easily. I mean common wouldn't your day be nicer if people weren't always screaming for content and to fix there proffession? I think if you added this type of content to professions, a lot of that would quite (at least for a while).