Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IT 6-1: Player City Items
Sutarion
Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:24 am
#27
hasibert wrote:
only a little stupid question:
Why ist it "IT 6-1" and not "IT 1-1" ??
This is publish 6, and the first post of this type that TH has posted for this publish.
Xyber_Hex
Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:29 am
#28
The cloning issue was caused by people cloning in opposing faction cities accidently and getting scanned and killed as soon as they show.
As far as starports and such in player cities , I have to give that a NO, because that is the only thing making it possible to find masses of people.
Spread out starports more and you will never find groups of people in one place.
Garages would be nice honestly.
Yvgar
Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:58 am
#29
Unless I am cloned at the city I am closest to, it never shows up as the closest.
Never. Not once.
And I have often respawned outside of the cloning center in the bushes.
Sentir
Tue Jan 27, 2004 6:06 am
#30
About removing yourself as a citizen. It still doesn't work. I joined as a citizen of Maris Paradis (MP) on Corellia on the Ahazi server. Some time later my career path took me to Tatooine, so I took down my house, moved to Tat, and set up there (with a new house).
I'm still showing as a Citizen on the MP City Management Terminal, which wont give me an option to remove myself, and I'm still being deducted City Tax.
MP have been great about it, refunded the credits, etc, but it's a pain for them and a pain for me.
AND!! Why won't you publish, say in the Help Holocron, a full list of / codes?! How is anyone supposed to find out things like, being able to remove yourslef from a guild (/removeguild, i believe) if you haven't a list? The only way is to ask other players, which pesters them, and removes the 'ambiance' of the game.
I'm still showing as a Citizen on the MP City Management Terminal, which wont give me an option to remove myself, and I'm still being deducted City Tax.
MP have been great about it, refunded the credits, etc, but it's a pain for them and a pain for me.
AND!! Why won't you publish, say in the Help Holocron, a full list of / codes?! How is anyone supposed to find out things like, being able to remove yourslef from a guild (/removeguild, i believe) if you haven't a list? The only way is to ask other players, which pesters them, and removes the 'ambiance' of the game.
finum
Tue Jan 27, 2004 8:02 am
#31
LeBob wrote:
from the Test Center Patch Notes
______________________________________________________________________
Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks.
Players will now get a popup when they are city warned, incase they miss the message behind other windows.
The game has been ruined and resurrected for myself several times with changes. This change will ruin us. We have city residents that are on active duty in the military and are able to play intermittently. Removing them from the city for a three week abscence is a "straw that broke the camels back" issue.
Reconsider this move.
Sketh
Tue Jan 27, 2004 8:27 am
#32
* Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks.
This is bad in so many ways.
If the devs think that this will stop cross server trades, they are wrong. It just means that the cross server people will have to log in to each other's servers every few weeks.
This also penalizes people who have to travel for business, family, and especially the military. I have some friends who are in the military - if they get a 3 or 6 month deployment, but still pay their 15 bucks a month, they should not be penalized for serving their country by having a potentially messed community to come back to.
Also, of course, some people save up their vacation time to take a nice holiday trip for up to and over 3 weeks - pretty steep price to pay in game.
There is another issue here. I beleive that the devs think that this will cause people to put pressure on their friends to come back to the game. This won't work - many people who left the game left because of the grind aspects. This is another grind type aspect.
With that said, ironically, many people that I know are re-activating, mostly due to new content. Part of this content for them is the city that we have built. Yes, some of the houses in our city are owned by people who are on hiatus. Destroy the cities that are in this situation, and there will be a further loss of reasons for people to come back.
There is one other problem to add to this long list of reasons why this is a bad idea. If the city looses some people due to this and starts to shrink, it may not be possible to re-arrange houses so that people can keep the city from shrinking into oblivion. Why? Becasue the core houses may be the ones that are gone... and since there is no way to move someone else's house, the city could slide down into oblivion even if there are still 60++ active residents.
Jon_Ari_Grecat
Tue Jan 27, 2004 10:05 am
#33
* Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks.
I must chime in and voice my support that this is too extreme a measure. There are too many people in my city who put their real lives first and this game second. Not only would this ruin things for them but our city as well!
If this is going to be enforced, then player cities like mine who have people who are intermittent players, will be in constant danger of losing their City Rank status because of the population/citizenship requirements.
And if the city drops below their current level minimum population limit, it causes widespread destruction in the city for the city limits shrink back down to the previous level limits and anything, save for maybe houses, is automatically destroyed without warning and without chance of recovery!
This is really an insane move by the devs. One that should be recalled IMMEDIATELY. You cannot, I repeat CANNOT make PAYING subscribers to the game, suffer because of their inactivity. It is just going way to far.
And as mayor of my city I have to protest this FIRMLY, for the sake of my citizens. This must be removed ASAP.
Player cities already have enough worries and troubles with keeping citizenship up to have to worry about yet another danger like this.
You (the devs) are putting way too much of a strain on both player cities and the mayors who are trying to keep them together.
I have many other concerns about this as well. For example: Maintenance costs/City Taxes: My city has reached a level where the city tax rates will no longer support the weekly maintenance needs of the city. Even MAXing out the taxes would not allow it to meet the needs of the maintenance. The citizens agreed a while back to up the weekly income tax to 6k a week, I can't raise it past 2k, that is SEVERLY messed up. Tax limits should be raised in order to allow the citizens to ensure their city maintenance is being kept up to par!
Mayors should also have the ability to organize their city, by means of re-arranging structures and homes to make things more accessible. You grant a person zoning rights then show them where to put their house, they can't or don't want to and put their house where they want, ruining the "city floor-plan" the mayor and possibly the citizens had in mind.
There REALLY needs to be a re-examination of player cities, things like this 3 weeks no activity and the citizen is removed, should not even be considered. Mayors should be given access to the abilities they need to make their city functional, well organized, and they need to have fewer worries about things such as this 3 week citizen loss deal.
I must chime in and voice my support that this is too extreme a measure. There are too many people in my city who put their real lives first and this game second. Not only would this ruin things for them but our city as well!
If this is going to be enforced, then player cities like mine who have people who are intermittent players, will be in constant danger of losing their City Rank status because of the population/citizenship requirements.
And if the city drops below their current level minimum population limit, it causes widespread destruction in the city for the city limits shrink back down to the previous level limits and anything, save for maybe houses, is automatically destroyed without warning and without chance of recovery!
This is really an insane move by the devs. One that should be recalled IMMEDIATELY. You cannot, I repeat CANNOT make PAYING subscribers to the game, suffer because of their inactivity. It is just going way to far.
And as mayor of my city I have to protest this FIRMLY, for the sake of my citizens. This must be removed ASAP.
Player cities already have enough worries and troubles with keeping citizenship up to have to worry about yet another danger like this.
You (the devs) are putting way too much of a strain on both player cities and the mayors who are trying to keep them together.
I have many other concerns about this as well. For example: Maintenance costs/City Taxes: My city has reached a level where the city tax rates will no longer support the weekly maintenance needs of the city. Even MAXing out the taxes would not allow it to meet the needs of the maintenance. The citizens agreed a while back to up the weekly income tax to 6k a week, I can't raise it past 2k, that is SEVERLY messed up. Tax limits should be raised in order to allow the citizens to ensure their city maintenance is being kept up to par!
Mayors should also have the ability to organize their city, by means of re-arranging structures and homes to make things more accessible. You grant a person zoning rights then show them where to put their house, they can't or don't want to and put their house where they want, ruining the "city floor-plan" the mayor and possibly the citizens had in mind.
There REALLY needs to be a re-examination of player cities, things like this 3 weeks no activity and the citizen is removed, should not even be considered. Mayors should be given access to the abilities they need to make their city functional, well organized, and they need to have fewer worries about things such as this 3 week citizen loss deal.
LeBob
Tue Jan 27, 2004 2:23 pm
#34
COPIED FROM MY ORIGINAL THREAD HERE:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=csystems&message.id=3054&page=1
Player City Garages will be introduced into the game some time soon (we have been told)
my concern is that the DEVs may have overlooked a very important aspect of these very usefull tools...
as you all know a couple of months back /citywarn was removed from the game... this has left militias crippled... (please don't make this a thread about bringing back /citywarn) with the addition of PC garages the strength of militias and indeed player cities as a whole can be boosted by making /cityban apply to PC garages
it's my understanding that PC garages will be payed for by the city in which they are located therefore I see no reason why they should not be subject to the rules by which the shuttleport, cloning center and bank are subject
DEVs I implor you... please make PC garages suspect to /cityban
if anyone can't visualize what I have in mind it's this:
player city 'A' has a PC garage... troublemaker 'b' well, is a troublemaker.... 'b'is /citybanned from 'A' and therefore cannot use the shuttleport to leave... well that's ok because 'b' has a speeder... 'b' generates his speeder to find that it is due for a 'repair' 'b' makes his/her way to 'A's PC garage to repair said speeder... when 'b' tries to do so he/she receives a system message saying "We're sorry but you are banned from 'A'... you do not have permission to repair your vehicle here... have a good day."
this will be great initiative for 'b' not to return to 'A'
WizardTB
Tue Jan 27, 2004 10:58 pm
#35
Sentir...
You stated "I joined as a citizen of Maris Paradis (MP) on Corellia on the Ahazi server...." I believe the ability to remove your citizenship was modified for TestCenter and that is what we are being asked to test.
Oh, you can get a full list of the commands (well most of them anyway) by entering two backslashes ( \\ )in the chat window.
Mordo Nimblefingers
Almost Master Chef - Test Center
Cougro
Tue Jan 27, 2004 11:38 pm
#36
First off setting prices is fine however when purchasing round-trip tickets the city only receives revenue from the first of the two tickets. This is either a bug or a mistake in either case it needs to be addressed.
Second if I'm near a player city and i die doing a mission or whatever i want to clone at the actual closest facility when it asks otherwise offer use the option to clone where we choose to since this makes having player city cloning facilities less useful. And also give the city some of the revenue from the cloning facility since these are cash sinks for the cities that could produce a reasonable amount of income.
On revoking citizenship this is fine and warranted if you are going to allow mayors to grief the opposite faction out of town. This will open up a whole new can of worms and I believe the Devs have not thought it through properly.
Zentragon
Tue Jan 27, 2004 11:41 pm
#37
Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks.
Well, I have nothing to add, you guys did a great job with your posts and you all make 100% sense. This change is just WRONG and doesn't make sense!
And why do I have the feeling that the DEVs will simply ignore our comments & ideas and add this "3 weeks" nonsense?!
LeBob
Wed Jan 28, 2004 1:41 am
#38
finum wrote:
LeBob wrote:
from the Test Center Patch Notes
______________________________________________________________________
Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks.
Players will now get a popup when they are city warned, incase they miss the message behind other windows.
The game has been ruined and resurrected for myself several times with changes. This change will ruin us. We have city residents that are on active duty in the military and are able to play intermittently. Removing them from the city for a three week abscence is a "straw that broke the camels back" issue.
Reconsider this move.
and, might I add... this will be barely be a splinter in the lot zombie's/lot mule's finger... anyone that puts enough time into the game to bother with cross-server lot trades (because it is not a simple matter to maintain)
WOULD see this change as an extremely minor inconvenience... "what? I gotta log in all my characters once every threeish weeks? no problem! that only takes 15 minutes"
however as my benefactor posted above MANY players that do not ( or cannot ) play the game religiously but still want to count as a citizen so they can pay their taxes and help support their city will be SOL
again we are seeing the devs cater to the hard core gamers and leaving casual gamers out in the sandstorm...
Azmodean
Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:44 pm
#39
"Now for the major issuse...
"Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks."
"Citizens will now be removed from a city if they haven't been online for about 3 weeks."
The results of this could be catastrophic... without the ability to remove houses, a city will be helpless if many of its residents are 'removed'... if a large number of citizens are 'removed' (I'll assume this means only that their citizenship has been revoked) then the city will have no place to move in new citizens as the old citizens still have their houses up and taking up much space... "
I agree. I'm currently a member of a guild that co-maintains a Metropolis on Tatooine on the Ahazi server. Several people have recently left the game, but left their structures up because they intend to come back... they're just taking a break, or are unable to play due to RL issues. Our city is filled pretty much to capacity in terms of physical space. Thus, if this change goes live, not only will we lose our metropolis status, but we'll be unable to recruit new residents, as there is simply nowhere left for them to place their houses.
If you implement this, do so only after mayors are granted imminent domain. The granting of imminent domain is a far more important issue, in my mind, because we're already starting to see rebels with way too much money buying up houses in our city from neutrals and trying to gain a majority that way so they can vote in their own mayor. Imminent domain would allow us to prevent such hostile takeovers, as well as allowing mayors to maintain their cities and allow room for growth.
You should also consider increasing the city radius. As I said, we're filled to capacity, and our two guilds are only around 50-70 members each.