Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IT 7-4: Experimentation Resource Quality
SWG-Runesabre wrote:
Greetings!
2) Variety in the crafting market. There aren't enough meaningful attributes that people buying crafted goods care about thus making it so every crafter will be experimenting on the same attributes for weapons, armor, etc. producing clone products.
This I think is one of the key items. Combined with (as someone else mentioned) the items with a single line of experimentation doing better. I would be curious to see the results of a chef testing. Most of their goods have four lines to be tested.
I think the problem may be that the best an item could be (based on material qualities) is divided by the number of experiemtation points for a single experiamentation line. If this is the case then single line items will be better, but multi line items will suffer because there are not enough experimentation points.
I would propose that the multiple lines be taken into consideration by giving a +15 percent bonus per additional line. This is not enough to allow allow you to max each line, but is enough to allow you to max one line and improve others.
Another implementation would be to allow greater increases at lower levels of experimentation. This should allow making items that are mediocre (sp?) in all catagories possible while making it less likely to craft really good items with multiple lines.
TouYuan wrote:
I ACTUALLY TESTED THIS AS A MASTER WEAPONSMITH
(thought that needed to be bold since so many in this thread have obviously not tested a thing and are tossing out uninformed opinions)
And I like it. So far every single weapon I have producted has come out with better stats than my pre-patch weapons. This is due in part to the fact that I have 12 experimentation points, which now makes a real difference in the quality of weapons I can produce and the fact that our city is a research center which is helping pump the results up considerably. Basically, I see the ability to make much better weapons now if you are using the proper tools for the job.
Fact: Even using capped materials like Rhodium Steel, I still get a better quality product than pre-patch experimentation.
Anyways, I am loving it and my weapons kick butt now... as a matyter of fact, most all have better stats than I have been able to find on a live server in either the damage or speed category. As a simple example because everyone can make these at high quality... my pre-patch scout blasters were 77-152 1.9, using the same materials post patch the stats are improved to 80-159 1.7.
You list the one stat that people will still max.
Prepatch - Where you able to put points into HAM or accuracy?
If so how many were you able to put in post patch?
I would guess you had to spend more points in dmg/speed to max it out.
SWG-Runesabre wrote:
Greetings!
I have reviewed this thread thus far. From what I have evaluated, here are the top concerns with the changes to experimentation in Publish 7:
1) Quality and frequency of certain rare resources. Certain resources spawn very infrequently and when they do they are usually low quality.
2) Variety in the crafting market. There aren't enough meaningful attributes that people buying crafted goods care about thus making it so every crafter will be experimenting on the same attributes for weapons, armor, etc. producing clone products.
The crafting designers will be evaluating the experimentation changes next week. I would greatly appreciate feedback based on actual testing on Test Center; that will provide the most meaningful feedback we can use for our evaluations.
Thank you!
You hit the nail on the head with 2.
From a WS perspective, I am a clone of everybody else ... all new smiths that acquire the same materials I have (which due to BER13's are plentiful) ... their weapons are just as good as my weapons.
Hate to say it, but when you put in BER13's you basically doomed all crafters to produce clones as there is no real scarcity or turnover of resources. Everybody has the *best* until a *new* best spawns.
When a new *best* spawns, you simply go harvest 500k-1m of that resource ...
BER13's are what doomed the crafters to cloneville ... don't know if you can *fix* that by changing how things are experimented.
The *only* thing I can think of, as it pertains to weaponsmithing, is if Damage and Speed are *different* experimentations so you could choose which one you wanted.
Or if experimentation on HAM actually *meant* something instead of now where it's a joke to waste any base exp points on HAM's.
Durability? Right ... as if that matters at all ... folks just wear out a weapon and buy 3 more with all the credits they bought wearing out that first one.
scruftydog wrote:
Akkori wrote:
Runesabre, turn on Character Copy and more people will be able to test on Test Center.
Agreed. I would be there in a flash.
Right behind you Ana. I cannot imagine recreating Fivo again. I may know more now and could grind it quicker, but the business cannot be duplicated. TC remains a place for full timers, unfortunately sometimes, IMO.
Fivo Asia
TouYuan wrote:
AudioOrgana wrote:
Supposedly there are five Master DE's on TC, but we haven't heard from one (save the correspondent).
Audio
Just curious, what makes you rate "hearing" from any of the DE's on TC?
They test, they report their findings through the correct channels, end of story. I am sorry, but informing you or anyone else on this troll boardis not a required part of the process and most TC players avoid this place like the plague (you personally have attributed to that). Theyuse the /bug tool in game to report what they find or they bring it up on our private boards and it finds its way to the correct people to be fixed, either way is generally WAY more effective and less hassle than posting here and getting flamed for your troubles.
Runesabre,
This attitude reflects what live people see wrong with TC. In a sense he's saying screw off to live players.
Tiny minority of players get the majority of control over the game. Period.
I think character copy is a bad idea in the sense that we cannot duplicate our businesses. Galaxy copy is a better idea, even if it required a new server for testing.
Fivo Asia
Certain resourcesfrequently spawn but they have never been good conductivity. This is what many weaponsmiths are concerned about.
Just some example from resource history in Scylla (CD: conductivity, OQ: Overall Quality)
Abeiaspoium Plumbum Iron CD 24 OQ 951
Apolmate Plumbum Iron CD 65 OQ 21
Gauboceeate Plumbum Iron CD 32 OQ 661
Gigeha Plumbum Iron CD 14 OQ 812
Oukanof Plumbum Iron CD 63 OQ 251
Roahia Plumbum Iron CD 46 OQ 22
Sawu Plumbum Iron CD 10 OQ 422
Irose Plumbum Iron CD 10 OQ 972
Carbetioneris Rhodium Steel CD 18 OQ 8
Enear Rhodium Steel CD 82 OQ 251
Fekinate Rhodium Steel CD 44 OQ 676
Grotebaite Rhodium Steel CD 80 OQ 172
Twavai Rhodium Steel CD 42 OQ 683
Varilo Rhodium Steel CD 56 OQ 590
For those weaponsthat take Plumbum Iron. the experimentation on damage is gated around 50-60% and the extra experimentation points go to HAM reduction and/or range modon live. We would lose this extra points.
I hope some master weaponsmith on Test Center could verify this.
R2DADROID wrote:
I don't know much about crafting yet, so I'm having trouble making out what this all is.
My question is:
Will this negate the need of high quality meat for the best meds?
Meat is a great source of income from Scouts.
The market rate is overly inflated right now do to holos, and I expect it to drop back to reasonable. Even as a Scout myself, I think that will be a good thing.
But I would like to know if it will be worth my while to try to get the best harvested stuff to sell to docs and other crafters who currently crave the highest quality.
TouYuan wrote:
JaatoWaals wrote:
With regard to those professions engaged in multi-attribute crafting, it will become even more difficult for novices to compete. Anyone who is not a master with three or more months of resource collecting behind them will not be able to participate in the market because their products will be vastly inferior to those of the old masters. Then again, seeing that I'm an old master, why am I complaining? This new barrier to market entry will ensure that I make hundreds of millions of credits. And that's a good thing, right?
This is not new by any means, novices have never been able to compete with a master who has months of resources, nothing has changed.
He means new masters won't be able to compete with old masters who have tons of "pre nerf" items for sale.
Sojourner wrote:
It appears as ifthe resource quality will only set the maximium that can be achieved by experimentation,and notaffect the success rate of experimentation.The the qualityof resources still impacts thefinal stats of thecrafted item, in a "you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear" sort of way. Resource qualitywill still be important, and ifanything I thinkthismight increase the value of high quality organics.
Thanks.
It just looked like Greek to me
til you explained it.
nice forum name, by the way.
Cafa wrote:
TouYuan wrote:
AudioOrgana wrote:
Supposedly there are five Master DE's on TC, but we haven't heard from one (save the correspondent).
Audio
Just curious, what makes you rate "hearing" from any of the DE's on TC?
They test, they report their findings through the correct channels, end of story. I am sorry, but informing you or anyone else on this troll boardis not a required part of the process and most TC players avoid this place like the plague (you personally have attributed to that). Theyuse the /bug tool in game to report what they find or they bring it up on our private boards and it finds its way to the correct people to be fixed, either way is generally WAY more effective and less hassle than posting here and getting flamed for your troubles.
Runesabre,
This attitude reflects what live people see wrong with TC. In a sense he's saying screw off to live players.