Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Should Force Sensitivity be a known path or a mysterious one? (II)
mmaughme
Sun Jul 11, 2004 2:56 am
#326
I voted by cancelling both of my accounts. Good luck, to those of you who remain behind. After a year, I just can't take it any more. As I said on Page 1, I can't believe this question is being asked now, a year after release.
PurpleWarrior
Sun Jul 11, 2004 2:56 am
#327
JustG wrote:
Should the method of becoming Force Sensitive (not the path from Force Sensitivity to Jedi) be a mysterious, unknown mechanic orone that is visible and known to everyone?
Thanks for the continued feedback!!
It should not be frustrating is the simple answer. The method of 'unlocking' pre-pub9 was just frustrating and boring and the time it took for anyone to figure out what they had to do was ridiculous.
If we're supposed to be able to become Force Sensitive, then we must know how to do it and it mustn't be boring or ridiculously difficult.
Force Sensitivity is supposed to provide benefits to crafters as well as combatants, and many of us won't want to go on to become Jedi. (me for one)
If the concern is to somehow limit the quantity and visibility of Jedi, then that should be addressed somewhere in the Jedi system (Trials, BH Missions, Visibility, TEFs, etc.) and NOT in the Force Sensitivity section.
Pirassi
Sun Jul 11, 2004 2:58 am
#328
I dont know about other servers, but on Wanderhome there are ony a handfull of FRS jedi running around because they are the older ones that have been guardians for months now. Just make it known , the path alone should be hard enough. Most people dont want to make their main character a jedi but prefer the have a jedi alt so in this case you would expect them to rerun the force sensitivity quests or whatever they will be.
Alot of people have no desire to be a jedi and want to be force sensitive just for the bonuses. You have already made the path long and difficult , so why make getting there even harder? Getting the force sensitive skills should not be a 3 or 4 month deal since grinding a jedi up is already a 3 to 6 month or longer grind. Say if you listen to the whining haters and you make geting force sensitive a 4 month deal, and since jedi is about 6 months to the non powergamer, your looking at near a year for a character to be complete, thats idiotic. You should be able to fly through the the force sensitive quests or whatever because you have only just begun at that point anyhow.
Alot of people have no desire to be a jedi and want to be force sensitive just for the bonuses. You have already made the path long and difficult , so why make getting there even harder? Getting the force sensitive skills should not be a 3 or 4 month deal since grinding a jedi up is already a 3 to 6 month or longer grind. Say if you listen to the whining haters and you make geting force sensitive a 4 month deal, and since jedi is about 6 months to the non powergamer, your looking at near a year for a character to be complete, thats idiotic. You should be able to fly through the the force sensitive quests or whatever because you have only just begun at that point anyhow.
Message Edited by Pirassi on 07-11-2004 05:58 AM
OrionsByte
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:01 am
#329
I'm going to chip in on the 50/50 argument...
If you make it 100% mysterious, once a few people have unlocked, the secret's going to be out and we'll be right back to where we are now. Furthermore, it's going to frustrate the people whose only goal is to become a Jedi (even though that was never the point of this game - but I digress).
If you make it 100% known, even if it's difficult, then there's not enough of a "gate" to the process. People will drop what they're doing to pursue the process. It's also less roleplayable, at least in my opinion.
I think a combination of known and mysterious is definately possible. The trick to this, I think, would be keeping things unspecific. For example, everyone knows that you have to talk to an NPC but no one knows which one, and it's different for everyone (bad example, as it would be far to frustrating to find that one NPC, but hopefully you get my drift).
This discussion makes me think of way back when, when you asked the DEs if we wanted to be a crafting-only class or a hybrid class. It turned out that you already had two systems in mind, and you were going to implement one or the other depending on what the community voted for.
I kind of get the same impression here. I don't think the DEVs are looking for specific suggestions for how a mysterious system would work or how a known system would work; they probably have all that figured out already, and they're just asking which general concept is more appealing to the community. Looking at the poll, this is going to be very divisive. No matter what happens, 50% of us should plan on being pretty ticked off. 
Personally I'm voting for mysterious, but as I'm not actively pursuing Jedi I don't really care all that much which one they do, so long as it's innovative and creative....
teamdoa
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:05 am
#330
mmaughme wrote:
I voted by cancelling both of my accounts. Good luck, to those of you who remain behind. After a year, I just can't take it any more. As I said on Page 1, I can't believe this question is being asked now, a year after release.
Yeah, this is pretty bad. Considering its one of the BIGGEST reasons why people play the game, and you have the nerve to ask us after a year what to do.....dear me.
This issue should have been top priority from the very begginings of the game, the first thing you ever thought of, and lets be blunt here....you messed up big time with the original way.
Message Edited by teamdoa on 07-11-2004 11:07 AM
Stooby
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:14 am
#332
IgescaStorm wrote:
Stooby wrote:
I think that the path should be a mysterious one. If everyone knows what they have to do to become Force sensitive, then you will have thousands of people playing the game simply to achieve it. I understand the idea that the Devs want the game to be fun, and for many people, fun is following the path toward Jedi, no matter what that path might be. However, I think that becoming Force sensitive should be part of the game, not the game. With that in mind, the mechanic for achieving it should be worked into actually playing the game. I think the professions list was an attempt to do this, but it was too easy just to grind your way through professions in the fastest way possible.
The key is to create a path to Force sensitivity that involves playing different aspects of the game, experiencing different things, and being hard to achieve, but without being something that can be "grinded" in the conventional sense.
Some people suggested different badges, which is a fantastic idea, but I think the path should go further. Create a mechanic that creates a random selection of events and experiences that player should have to complete in order to unlock their Force sensitivity. Events could include; completing certain themeparks, having killed a certain animal, having crafted something, having been to a certain amount of locations, having taken a certain amount of kills in PvP, having taken a certain amount of kills in PvE, having finished some of the higher-end dungeons, having helped a certain amount of newbie players, etc.
The point is that the path should make players actually play the game, and really experience what there is to do in the game. That way, they won't be able to simply grind their way through the path because their is simply way too much to do to grind. All the players will have to do is simply play the game as much as possible, trying to see and achieve everything they can. That way, the Force sensitive path and the end-game of the jedi profession is reserved for people who haven't simply grinded their way to the position, but people that have truly experienced the game.
It is all nice, but why I should have to craft something, if i want ONLY BE a BH?
The path should not include random things with random professions, just things in professions I actually play! Starting profession and the professions I play at least 1 month or so.
The path should not be totally hidden! I want to use my brain and not only hope, I just stumble over the right things!
Luke did not only walked around in the galaxy and BANG, suddenly he was a Jedi!
I thought about this when I was typing my post.
The thing that occurs to me, is that not everyone can be Luke Skywalker, and not everyone can be a Jedi. The Jedi in Galaxiesare supposed to be (or should be, depending on how you look at it) the end-game. I.E. Jedi is the profession you get from working hard at the game, from playing it until you are good at the game.
If all you have to do is continue along your chosen profession, then sooner or later, everyone will have unlocked their Force Sensibility. I'm sure some people wouldn't mind that and would find it "fun" but I for one, and I would hope, others too, would like to see Jedi as something that only a few get access too.
I agree that perhaps the path should force people to use their brains and think about what they have to do to achieve what they want - perhaps holocrons can be used in this regard - to point you along the right path for doing the type of things you need to be doing in order to unlock your Force ability. My point is that only people who have really played the game and seen a great deal of what it can offer should be allowed to play as Jedi. It's their just reward for playing so well.
Message Edited by Stooby on 07-11-2004 06:15 AM
OrionsByte
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:14 am
#333
OrionsByte wrote:
I'm going to chip in on the 50/50 argument...
...
Personally I'm voting for mysterious, but as I'm not actively pursuing Jedi I don't really care all that much which one they do, so long as it's innovative and creative....
After re-reading my post I decided I wanted to quickly clarify my position (hey, it's late ).
).Basically I don't think any character should be able to say, "I'm going to go become force sensitive today." Players can say it all they want, but the character should not be able to. Instead, they should be saying, "I found out I'm a little force sensitive today." To me that's the difference between known and mysterious.
However, just to appease the masses, I do think that the "mysterious" route should have a "known" element, so that the frustration level is low.
Ok, I feel better now. 
Ebonfire
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:18 am
#334
Mysterious... huh haven't we already walked down this path?
I thought the point to this revamp was makes this process less painful (as previously stated by TH), so mysterious sounds like another time sink of figuring out the process yet again. Then what? Are you going to make it mysterious again every couple months?
There are people who didn't like that last system, and have been playing for a year (or close to it) and would like to become a jedi under a different system. This mysterious new path will take week/months before people figure it out, thus keeping them around longer... would this be the point of it?
For the people that don't want to see more jedi... go away. A lot of thosewho opt for mysterious are those who dislike jedi, and want a frustrating system to keep others away from attaining one. I think youowe it tooyour long time customers to not create another hololike disorder, and just keep it simple. There are other placesthat deservenew content *cough GCW, not this one.
LevaOripa
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:20 am
#335
I really dont care one way ot the other
As long as you open up non jedi servers
Moepple
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:25 am
#336
Hi,
my 2 Cents:
It should be common knowledge what the way is. The challenge is to not enable people to create a guide to jedi, or to have a single path you simply have to walk through.
People should know, if you want to become a Jedi, you have to fullfill these 4 or 5 tasks, then your on the way, but after this, it should be different for each player, like it was told us before the game even started.
Even if there are a set of 200 or more missions, and everybody gets n random missions to complete, as long as you never know whats next, its good.
Of course, I would like the Idea to almost always you need to make a decision which gives you a bonus for the dark or the light side. If you have n Points for dark or light, youre done. If youre not sure what path to choose, youll need longer. That way it will take a long time to "decode the pattern", and you can always implement new missions and remove old ones to keep people busy.
Most important for me, those missions should be more than just seek and destroy.
That way, everybody knows what to do, but noone knows exactly what and when. And if there is always freedom to choose within the missions youre on the safe side I think.
Read ya.
Azhnykk
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:32 am
#337
Mysterious, all the way. It is dumb if someone can wake up one day and be like "I think I'm going to be a Jedi. Everyone else is doing it." It's like a card game where you know what is in your opponent's hand. What fun is that? Even more, what sense does that make? It should be1/4 random and 1/4 prerequisites set by the devs.Then the rest would be based on your race, profession, playing time, exploration, quests, etc. You shouldn't find the force, it should find you. You should know some of what needs to be done by way of completing quests and talking to informants and npcs who are never spoken to by players. The rest would leave the mystery for you to discover or obtain throughout your journeys.
Kuu
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:34 am
#338
It should be known. Jedi are out of the bag, so to speak. If you turn around and make it hard as heck again, you are just penalising the people who either chose not to hologrind, or who started after it was too late to do so. Jedi are now a dime a dozen, and if they are balanced, I don't care. Sure, Jedi are /supposed/ to be rare in this timeline, but if we are playing some deviant timeline, so be it. But at this point, it should either be known, or easy to figure out, though difficult to execute.
Kuu
Kuu