Development Cycle Archive

Thread: Force Ranking System Feedback...

raz1337
Sat Jun 12, 2004 8:58 am
#14

any chance of fixing us people that have broken force regen? we're regenerating at the speed of an initiate, when we're a knight



Annoka Starkep ~~~~~~ Danielle Sevi


Jedi are like ants in an ant farm, you watch them work and play, and if one is being bad, you squish them
Twilekpimper
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:23 am
#15

if i could get through the knight trials i would answer these questions

NBScoop
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:25 am
#16

My Feedback is provided in the following post...


http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=jedi&message.id=389341



In short, the point is....the path to Jedi is not PvP only...time for an MMO to address encouraging better social behaviors in game by making "leadership" the defining factor (or differentiating factor even) to becoming a Jedi. No one without earning the "leadership" respect of their fellow Jedi and non-jedi should have any shot at ascending to a Jedi Council. Period.



Scoop / Solus --- Sabacc Legends (Co-GM)

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JavelinCatcher
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:25 am
#17


In Answer to your questions:

So far with 1 day gone, I see the experience gain/loss reasonable. We'll explore this more throughout the week.

Last night we promoted 1 individual, Garvin (Commando Correspondant) from Rank 1 to Rank 2. The transfer of Rank was successful and updated promptly with /show. However, it seems that only 1 person gets promoted per promotion period, and anyone not participating in the voting/challenge process looses FRS experience.

Right now, only a few of us can change rank. Also, the challenge system does not seem to go into effect until the rank you are requesting promotions are full (there are still some empty seats in the lower ranks for those still completing their trials)



Ok that said, I'm sure you heard about by now from a couple QA's that were on Yavin 4 last night about the Light vs Dark Enclave battle. To set this in proper perspective, I'll guide you through the course of events.


First, we determined that the "power" bonuses granted to each rank do not seem to be showing or arn't noticable. Once we discovered most of us needed more ranking experience, our first thought was to challenge the Light Enclave (a raid if you will). We preped for battle, and had scouts near the Light Jedi Enclave to measure their numbers. We were practically double in numbers to what they had at the moment, however the majority of us are either Enhance or Power Masters, with few of us having much in the way of the Defense trees. What ended up happening is the Light Jedi brought the battle to our Enclave while we were preparing. The Lightsaber/Master Defenders ruled the battle. Why?


1) Buffs. I'm going to take a lot of flack for saying this, but the buffs to secondary stats are what's making it hard to kill someone. They can regenerate faster than you can damage them. I don't mind seeing us have to fight 3-5k HAM PC's....we fight larger in PvE. However, the regeneration is the difference. I am one of those people who consider buffs to be overpowered and I think we've demonstrated quite effectivly how much overpowering they are.


2) Force Armor/Force Shield. At most, anyone only does about 10 damage to a person with high level versions of these abilities, coupled in with the "Jedi toughness" modifier and you have someone that takes 15-20 people to take down in a reasonable amount of time as we demonstrated several times during the course of that evening.


3) Our own sentinal (used to guard the Enclave) started to attack us while we were fighting the light jedi. We had to kill our sentinals in order to focus our attacks on the light jedi and by that time, most of us were already dead. I personally got killed by our own sentinal twice.


4) Master Power specials doesn't do nearly as much damage as someone with just a lightsaber. I recommend looking at these specials and their damage ranges.


5) Healers can't keep their group healed. I was one of the Healers of the group last night. The only heals of any worth is /totalhealother. Total heal other uses approx 1000 force. I have a total of 6-7 heals (not counting the number of folks using drain force on me) before I have to run and regenerate my entire force pool. Very quickly I rearealized the cost of Totalhealother and started to use /healother2. /healother2 doesn't heal nearly enough for the level of that special (approx 200 to each pool). I would also like to add that I would like to have a "area heal" at Master Healer if possible.


6) Transfer Force is broken and does not transfer any force pool from one player to another. Several folks who realized that they were going to be ineffectual in combat attempted to channel force to those who could make a differnce (healers/defenders) since Enhance only seems only good for running away. However, we discovered quickly that they couldn't.

Message Edited by JavelinCatcher on 06-12-2004 09:26 AM



----Nolhta Fyoen----Master Rifleman/Master Smugger----StarStrider
----Nolhta Fyoen----Master Droid Engineer----TestCenter
----Accoubacca----TKA/Commando---TestCenter

----Nolhta Fyoen----Master Droid Engineer----Gorath

CUAlpha: Team Droid Engineer
Djferio
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:32 am
#18






JavelinCatcher wrote:


In Answer to your questions:

So far with 1 day gone, I see the experience gain/loss reasonable. We'll explore this more throughout the week.

Last night we promoted 1 individual, Garvin (Commando Correspondant) from Rank 1 to Rank 2. The transfer of Rank was successful and updated promptly with /show. However, it seems that only 1 person gets promoted per promotion period, and anyone not participating in the voting/challenge process looses FRS experience.

Right now, only a few of us can change rank. Also, the challenge system does not seem to go into effect until the rank you are requesting promotions are full (there are still some empty seats in the lower ranks for those still completing their trials)



Ok that said, I'm sure you heard about by now from a couple QA's that were on Yavin 4 last night about the Light vs Dark Enclave battle. To set this in proper perspective, I'll guide you through the course of events.


First, we determined that the "power" bonuses granted to each rank do not seem to be showing or arn't noticable. Once we discovered most of us needed more ranking experience, our first thought was to challenge the Light Enclave (a raid if you will). We preped for battle, and had scouts near the Light Jedi Enclave to measure their numbers. We were practically double in numbers to what they had at the moment, however the majority of us are either Enhance or Power Masters, with few of us having much in the way of the Defense trees. What ended up happening is the Light Jedi brought the battle to our Enclave while we were preparing. The Lightsaber/Master Defenders ruled the battle. Why?


1) Buffs. I'm going to take a lot of flack for saying this, but the buffs to secondary stats are what's making it hard to kill someone. They can regenerate faster than you can damage them. I don't mind seeing us have to fight 3-5k HAM PC's....we fight larger in PvE. However, the regeneration is the difference. I am one of those people who consider buffs to be overpowered and I think we've demonstrated quite effectivly how much overpowering they are.


2) Force Armor/Force Shield. At most, anyone only does about 10 damage to a person with high level versions of these abilities, coupled in with the "Jedi toughness" modifier and you have someone that takes 15-20 people to take down in a reasonable amount of time as we demonstrated several times during the course of that evening.


3) Our own sentinal (used to guard the Enclave) started to attack us while we were fighting the light jedi. We had to kill our sentinals in order to focus our attacks on the light jedi and by that time, most of us were already dead. I personally got killed by our own sentinal twice.


4) Master Power specials doesn't do nearly as much damage as someone with just a lightsaber. I recommend looking at these specials and their damage ranges.


5) Healers can't keep their group healed. I was one of the Healers of the group last night. The only heals of any worth is /totalhealother. Total heal other uses approx 1000 force. I have a total of 6-7 heals (not counting the number of folks using drain force on me) before I have to run and regenerate my entire force pool. Very quickly I rearealized the cost of Totalhealother and started to use /healother2. /healother2 doesn't heal nearly enough for the level of that special (approx 200 to each pool). I would also like to add that I would like to have a "area heal" at Master Healer if possible.


6) Transfer Force is broken and does not transfer any force pool from one player to another. Several folks who realized that they were going to be ineffectual in combat attempted to channel force to those who could make a differnce (healers/defenders) since Enhance only seems only good for running away. However, we discovered quickly that they couldn't.

Message Edited by JavelinCatcher on 06-12-2004 09:26 AM





Yep we can't really test this system on some pointsif it is not properly balanced.



iOziss Zirzosski

Where ever there is Light Darkness will shine

iiDark Jedi Knightii
nolan007
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:36 am
#19






JustG:


"...Are you getting the correct TEFs? Can you find any way to “cheat” in order to give yourself an unfair advantage or to avoid the battle...."



A couple of thoughts....



  • It seems harder to figure out when you are attackable or not by the opposite faction? Maybe I attacked someone with an area attack; however, I've had times to be caught totally off-guard from another Jedi attack on me (probably due to some TEF I didn't know I had?)


  • Many players are using the medical center elevators to escape attacks and to regain their force powers. They go up and down the elevator making it impossible to engage in battle and so that they can buy time for force regeneration. Consider making elevators not useable if you're under attack?


  • Please consider capping the "bottom" as far as Jedi XP. I'm sitting at -2.5 million Jedi XP from playing a few days. I suggest the bottom should be around no more than -200k Jedi XP or maybe just 0 Jedi XP...?? It should be fun and fair for everyone!


  • My experience was that I had to go to many Force Shrines (riding around and kneeling at random shrines). Boring and not Jedish. Please consider allowing us to "sense" what we should do next after our first Force Shrine visit? This might be the case now... I'm not sure. Just reporting my experiences.


  • Killing 19 Tusken Raiders has proved to be a very long and very boring experience. When you have 50 Jedi trying to to get credit for the death of one Tusken Raider. I suggest lowering that 19 Tusken Raiders requirementto around 9 Tusken Raiders...? Also, consider telling us how many we have left to kill. "You have advanced in the Jedi Knight trials, you need to kill 5 more Tusken Raiders."


I really wish that Jedi could sense more things such as disturbances in the force.....



  • Bounty Hunter with a mission on them is very near them (within a visible distance).

  • Stormtroopers about to scan them for contraband.

  • Rare NPC spawnof opposite faction are attacking in a particular city. Maybe Emperor's Hand have landed in a Imperial space craft with high-ranking Imperial and are attacking Anchorhead? Rare events that happen once a week?


Of course, not ALL the time, but maybe occasionally they could "sense" these things?







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Star Wars vs. Star Wars Galaxies
(Revised 07.07.05)

( Maybe one day these ideas will be considered or implemented. Bump it, please? )

ArianSix
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:37 am
#20

The problem I see is that this system will benefit those Jedi that have nothing better to do all daythan play SWG.


The question is: what about the rest of the players? We have people that work, people that have families, etc... I think that a truly fair system should be designed around the "normal" player instead of the exception.


As stated by the devs, games are supposed to be fun, so is it possible to make a system that is more fun for everyone instead of just 11 people who have the luxory of being able to play all day?


I won't even pretend to have a clue on how to impliment this system, but I do feel that it is something that the devs should take into serious consideration...


-- A6




(gggggggggggggggWnxnn[Arian Six]nnxnXggggggggggggggg)
Dark Jedi Knight - Ace Pilot - Master Shipwright
The Bloodfin Museum - Amaranth, Rori - (-5139, -5932)

Devla_Alved
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:02 am
#21

I'd like to give some Feedback about the FRS butI got the "Musical Shrines"trial on Lok and can't continue my path to Knight....along with a large group of people. Please give us a command or something to tell us our next trial, or re-implemnent the email system. We can only sit and watch you spawn trial mobs for everyone else while we can do nothing but watch.



Ufov / Tifi
3TZ4Arms Sikyon, Tatooine 3140 850
+12 Point Weaponsmith Current Stock
SarakKye
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:04 am
#22

Just remember, software works as coded, not as designed.





Qodis, Imperial Officer (-CU-)

Dark Jedi Knight / Ace Storm Squadron Pilot
...and an all around nice guy


Netninjax
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:04 am
#23






ArianSix wrote:

The problem I see is that this system will benefit those Jedi that have nothing better to do all daythan play SWG.


The question is: what about the rest of the players? We have people that work, people that have families, etc... I think that a truly fair system should be designed around the "normal" player instead of the exception.


As stated by the devs, games are supposed to be fun, so is it possible to make a system that is more fun for everyone instead of just 11 people who have the luxory of being able to play all day?


I won't even pretend to have a clue on how to impliment this system, but I do feel that it is something that the devs should take into serious consideration...


-- A6





What he said



____________________________-

.:Iaxive - Jedi Knight:.
353, 2507 Tatooine - Near Mos Entha
DeathKnell
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:06 am
#24

Seems to me the only way to keep it fair for power gamers and non-power gamers is to make most of the FRS penalty be based on hours played and only a little bit lost automatically per day. So for each hour played you lose5k FRS exp and for each day you lose 10k.Whatever the numbers turn out to be. That way, being able to play 15 hours per day, doesn't give you an automatic huge advantage.
KyleKnox
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:07 am
#25

Please reinstate the old tef system - whatever is in place now doesnt work - as a rebel i keep getting tefs on rebels.



Dyvim Storm - Eclipse
PrePatch9 4444 Guardian
Force Master
MasterNerfSlayer
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:08 am
#26


As 5th ranked light Jedi, I was losing 500 FRS xp on the timer. I still had almost 80k of this xp. At 500xp per day... you can see how long it would be before I lost my ranking due to not playing. I don't know if I'm missing something here or not.


the amount of xpI got forother players seemed like a fair amount. Arjun got 1750 or so for killing me. I got about 1100 for killing an Imperial Bounty Hunter (who ended up being killed by a Dark Jedi Master (npc)).


Seems ok, but as I say... if I got my rank, then stopped playing, I could effectively tie up a position for a long time. None of us could work out the voting system. We think we got it in the end, but it was very confusing. A manual is recommended.

Message Edited by MasterNerfSlayer on 06-13-2004 04:11 AM




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