CUEmu - Thread Posts

Renairdor

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:12 pm

Betatoxin wrote:
A couple things.

First some posters are suggesting SOE hire more people. Unfortunately getting benefits adding developers to a software team is not immediate. Software development is actually one of those few things were throwing money and staff around actually can slow a project down. I have seen it happen first hand. Fairly amusing watching business folk run up against a problem money cannot fix...but I digress...One of the fundamental principles about software projects is that adding more people actually extends the time it takes to finish a project (Reference: The Mythical Man-Month: Essays on Software Engineering, 20th Anniversary Edition by Frederick P. Brooks).

Exactly what he said. It's a hard concept for many to grasp, but changes occur very slowly. As well, faults in a system located after ship are the MOST expensive to fix. We can demonstrate this right now with the fact we need a combat balance so badly.

The correct strategy to fix this issue now, is apply a structured and focus group on the problem. It will take time. JTLS is the main development focus right now, you add major risk in trying to do to much at once, with too little.

'Big' issues can be pushed to live earlier- the Combat Medic tweak and BH tweak are good examples. These are obvious large scale fixes that a large majority agreed with. Determining things such as armor certification, max stats, how to stack defences, etc... is just a huge project with a lot of testing and number crunching involved.

What I am distressed at, is a large number of issues are commonly mentioned on the forums during testing of updates, that make it into live. This is a drain on future resources for later updates, or result in 'really annoying' bugs that alone do not break the game, but stack ten of these 'really annoying' bugs together and suddenly you have a broken system.

Some 'broad strokes' might help the game considerably, however...- cap armor out at 65% alone makes PvE a lot more challenging. However, since PvP is a part of the game where armor has impact, such a change means weapons are suddenly doing a lot more damage. So what do you do with them? Reduce them in damage too? What's a reasonable cap? What's a ineffective cap? One seemingly small fix, and the whole game changes. One reason folks use Stun weapons and mind hits in PvP is these are the most effective, and hardest to heal, pools. Last month of PvP engagement has all been about 'mind damage'. So, remove all damage to mind, and what happens? BIG changes. Can you effectively kill someone if heals heal 1100+ to everyone in your group and there is no mind damage? Ok then, do you then reduce heals? And so on....

A butterfly flaps it's wings in Osaka, and a Tornado occurs in Kansas. That sort of thing The ripple effect needs to be carefully managed and monitored.

Folks are quick to say 'PvE is not challenging' but they are toting 90% armor, with 1000+ dmg weapons, and they have easy access to very powerful buffs. All of these need significant changes- but folks won't want *themselves* to be balanced. And that's major friction for the development team.

I'll be curious how it all works out. Good luck to you TH , hope the next few months don't burn you out too fast

Ren

Aracon

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:13 pm

#223

If Yoda can have patience turning Luke into a Jedi (pretty much ended his life it did)...I think we can have patience with the Devs making this game be everything it can and will be...

Luke didn't pay Yoda 15 bucks a month.

HOLLA ATCHA BOI,
Zos-

Gawd of Ham
Lord of the Hawtpants

Darkatem

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:13 pm

#224

Thunderheart wrote:

actnjcksn wrote:
So....
Where does the Smuggler revamp occur in this new grand scheme?
We've been delayed more than the GCW and Combat Balance revamps and yet, once again there is no mention of Smugglers.
It is in the sametime frame and once we ship JTL and re-assemble theteam, we'll put together a more concrete answer, though it will be during this time.

This just doesn't quite cut it, now does it TH? If you were on our side, wouldn't you too be OUTRAGED by what is apparently lousy managment? Lousy decision making? You're focusing entirely on bringing in new customers through Jedi & JTL, while putting your current loyal(well we'll see about that) subjects on the back burner. Nice to know we are your first priority.

Message Edited by Darkatem on 07-15-2004 02:15 PM

Rorenikibi

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:14 pm

#225

Let me say a few things here to sort out my opinion here:

1) I respect the fact that this is quite possibly the most complex game ever attempted. The crafting system, the resource system, the economic system, the level of player interaction, even when you consider all the flaws, approaches the sublime in complexity and scope. I've stated my belief that the mechanics of this game approach the level of artwork at the macro scale. That being said, as with all art, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. There are fundamental flaws in the core systems of this game on the combat end of the spectrum that are absolutely, gamebreakingly, broken and the result is incredibly ugly.

2) I know for a fact that I have been one of the most vocal critics of the priorities demonstrated by the Development team, and this decision, regardless of how personally gut wrenching it must be to make, is quite simply illogical. I can forgive the scheduling of the Jedi Revamp ahead of the Combat Revamp, because as we've seen, no other profession in the game is going to swing the balance of power between the factions like the Jedi Knights. But to reschedule Combat until after the launch of JtL is suicide for this game.

I'm going to step out of my usual combative mode of posting on matters like this and put things in the most eloquent form I can. Foolish is the man who builds his castle on a foundation of sand. JtL's success is absolutely dependent on the stability of the Core system, not from a mechanics standpoint, but from a content/interest standpoint. How can we players have any faith in the functionality of JtL and your intentions to make it a quality product when you've continually put off doing the same for the Core game?

How can we believe the combat system in space will work any better than the combat system you've given us on the ground?

3) When taken in the balance about what best serves the vast majority of subscribers, consider that until this post, your priorities were in the right place.

A) A functioning, ready balanced, Jedi profession that makes the ground endgame for solo players worth attaining.

B) A functioning and balanced combat system that will integrate player combat capability in a coherent and thoroughly thought out system that will go as far as possible to prevent the overpower existant in current templates.

C) Expand the game to encompass both ground combat and space combat with the foundation core system intact and functioning and the new system ready for Live with the acknowledgement ahead of time that balancing in process would need to be done.

Thunderheart, if you people don't have the resources to launch both combat systems simultaneously, let me assure you, this also means you don't have the resources to tweak both combat systems simultaneously if they are launched within a publish of each other.

You absolutely have to have the core done and complete before you expand or the bugs you think you have now with just the ground system are going to multiply exponentially with the launch of JtL and the godawful number of bugs you WILL have there.

And there's no way in hell JtL will carry this game if you make launching and refining it a priority over coming back and revamping the ground combat system. No customer base will have the patience for that. No one.

Captain Janu Hull CFA-7
In the event of an emergency, this pilot's ego may be used as a floatation device.

Raikan

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:14 pm

#226

more anger more hatred show them how we feal

Raikan-Jedi -Valcyn

I dont like you in a way that i do like you but i can dis-concern whether your likable in that manner of thinking. Therefore if my manor of thinking is in a good way then i like you half as much as the next time i think like you.

Squidwalker

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:14 pm

#227

Zooey wrote:

TH, are you going to address any of these posts with GOOD points about how badly you guys have screwed up? You were honest, but in some kind of propaghandist way. Be honest with us, tell us you screwed up with jedi, with the CB, with the GCW, and everything else, and tell us you know this, and you want to fix it! Tell us you're SORRY. You know you just slapped every vet in the face with these Jedi publishes and now this. We are not all RANTING TROLLS. The people that are most angry and not sucking up are the oldest, wisest, veteran players who LOVE star wars and want to love this game just as much.Only after you realize that, can the actual bridge between us players and you devs begin construction. Don't make us out to be crazy people and just give a reply to the back patters. That's even more infuriating.

-zooey

/agree

Teranus Blan'Fyl
OldSchool Ranger
Short-Timer

WookieBounty

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:15 pm

#228

Dear SWG Community,

Please be aware to those of you bashing Thunderheart that he HAS to do this. I for one believe he trully cares about the community. I think he has basically been told to "shut up and post what we tell you to post" - TH's boss(es). We are all pretty pissed off at this point and understandably so. I think what we all really want, from a majority perspective, is a delay in JTLS and a focus on getting the ground game enhanced. As a smuggler I would still be willing to wait for a revamp post JTLS but I also believe the game needs GCW and CB....NOW. So TH we would like to know what YOUR bosses think of this outcry? If they want we will gladly contact them and let them know.

You, TH, are our only hope here and I honestly believe YOU have to get this updated schedule changed..You are our only hope(Obiwon)Thunderheart. (LOL)

Thanks,

Soar

§
Soar...Master Smuggler
Soar....lvl 60 Human Mage
h TarquinasLegion.comh

Fred_Skinner

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:15 pm

#229

Bah, you all should be ashamed of yourselfs. I feel dirty for reading through all that hate. Must purge...

I for one applaud you for resisting the temptation and decide NOT to rush things. Let them whine. Let them go to other games. The will be back, gaurentee it, if you do a good enough job that outshines all the newcommers. Integrating a RPG and twitch has been a dream of mine sense the Mechwarroir games came out and the (somewhat vapid) attempts to do such with them. We dreamed then that someday afusion of Battletech MUSH andMW FPS would somedayhappen. All attempts to do so fell far short, and to be honest, the technology did not exist for it. I can now see that happening in Star Wars, instead, and this goal alone is a worthy one.

So let the powergamers go on to WoW, EQ2, ect. Us Rangers have waited long, saw our stuff given to others, but we will still be here. The meek shall inherit the servers.

Frederick Skinner
Antarian Ranger, Ranger(0030), Master Rifleman, CH(4214)
Ranger is not a profession. It's a lifestyle.

HagakureL

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:16 pm

#230

My friend was right SOE gave up on this game a long time ago and are putting all bets on JTL. Hell he even suggested that maybe this game was a test for EQ2.Those working on SWG-ground are basically working on a sinking ship.

Lupin

-[ATOYK]-

durks

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:17 pm

#231

TH - Please fix this game first before releasing another. JTL should not be a priority until after the GCW has been fixed. All your resources should be focused on SWG now instead of spreading yourselves thin trying to launch JTL.

Durk Strider

Master Pistoleer/Rogue/Desperado

Rebel Colonel

Rubicon49BC

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:17 pm

#232

Fred_Skinner wrote:

The meek shall inherit the servers.

That is, if there are any servers left to inherit. The number of 'meek' in this game seems to be a wee bit too low to sustain a game like this.

Colonel Malachon Draco, Imperial Army
Commander of The Imperial Order
Starsider

lore7

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:17 pm

#233

Rubicon49BC wrote:

garvin wrote:

Just and FYI...this may not mean a lot, but it does to me...

Ever since we Correspondents heard about the Delay, TH has gone out of his way to get as much details from us about what SOE can do from now until the CB launches to help our communities...He has been seriously energized and focused on collecting our issues and I'm confident that, even though the CB is delayed, we will see many good things coming soon, especially around Publish 11...

TH knew before posting this that it wouldn't be very popular...but I believe him when he says that, in the long run, it will be a good thing they made this move...

If Yoda can have patience turning Luke into a Jedi (pretty much ended his life it did)...I think we can have patience with the Devs making this game be everything it can and will be...

Well, since no-one is gonna get jedi for the next 6 months unless they need another goddamn publicity 'moment' why the hell should we have patience. Iused to havea lot of patience, but it just ran out.

your reading it wrong they are still doing publish 10 in augest. **edit**ing jedi... **edit**ing the game up...

Rakesh,-Rakesh,Bluesbakka and Khosk
,Rip when ever all my accounts run out
,Now Lore 56 Priest on Skullcrusher in WoW.

Sesik

Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:17 pm

#234

In my opinion you just put the final nail in the coffin. By the time this HIGHLY needed rebalance comes out..WoW and EQ2 will belive and I think a large number of your playerbase will be out of here. Just my personal opinion of course.

I know you can't fix everything at once...but in my opinion your priorities are very screwed up. Jedi should have been the last thing to get worked on...they are supposed to be few and far between..on my server they and the CM tend to decide every battle now.

Sesik
Handing out diseases since 2003!

Development Cycle Archive

Thread: Great Expectations, Major Schedule Changes and making SWG the finest MMORPG ever