Development Cycle Archive

Thread: IC 1-17 Star Wars Galaxies Combat Profession Mix and Match

Arriranha
Wed Feb 04, 2004 6:42 pm
#183

Look...Why dont you balance the current system instead of reinventing the wheel. I personally think it is cool to be able to stack bonuses from different professions, instead of nerfing this aspect why dont you BALANCE it!


Mastery of ELITE professions needs better bonuses and better unique bonuses to make it worth mastering.


The clever players who min/max are going to do it regardless of what the system is, so again I say BALANCE the current system! The bonuses should stack but they need to be balanced!


The melee system needs some help in the form of moving NOT interrupting the attack, this is beyond annoying and needs fixing. ASAP.


This game is finally shaping up and since December has actually become fun again (which it hasnt been since Beta). All this talk of Combat system revamp makes me very nervous,,,very nervous. I am not an uber-template, Im more of a jack of all trades, Im not trying to save my uberness. I dont think we need an overhaul what we need is balance, fine tuning, balance, fine tuning.




I am doing a mini-Publish of my own.
Publish 9.3: The Games on my Hard Drive Revamp.


Pending SWG Account Cancellations: July 22nd and July 30th.
Polychrome
Thu Feb 05, 2004 1:15 am
#184

Well, seriously, I LOVE the whole mix and match deal. I can literally be whatever I want.


The problem with uber templates is that people pick up 1 skill tree from several professions, creating something more powerful than a master. This is obviously a problem. So, how to get rid of it?


Well, you could either spread the skill mods out among all the trees, making it impossible for somebody to get overpowered the wrong way, OR you could distinctly lessen the skill mods in each tree, and give a huge bonus upon mastery. Therefore, somebody would have to master the entire profession to get all the benefits, but the benefits have a huge turnaround when they do.


I think generally, skill mods could be spread out among all trees, with each box granting new skills and schamatics rather than just skill mods.



lPolicroma Soll

[[[[[[==H==/ggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg)

Elder Tailor, Newbie Jedi, Minor Annoyance

Chapter9
Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:57 am
#185


What are some neat combinations that would be good for the game?


Each combat master profession should have a group passive ability for pvp. Ideally this would give each class their unique flavour and desirable for pvp groups.


Could these abilities maybe be purchased with faction points from recruiters for either side, with differences between each class being dependant on class/faction.


Sadly im to thick to offer any proper suggestions for which abilities they should get




------------------------------------------
Nikolas - Master Doctor/TKA- Chimaera
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Located on Dantooine (buying avian 100 @ cpu 850+ OQ/PE)
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scutler
Thu Feb 05, 2004 5:24 am
#186

maybe im being stupid here but there is no system that sets how good u are, all other mmorpgs mainly have a level system so the more combat exp u get you go up a lvl higher as in mir. i havew noticed people in this game are able to make a killer character for pvp in 2 weeks, and the people that have been playing for 6 months are getting battered because they dont have "certain templates". getting ready for flames...... ;P
Masen
Thu Feb 05, 2004 5:44 am
#187

I agree..More classes need a CH style revamp. Split abilities up among many boxes and trees, so someone can't, for example, learn just the called shots from Pistoleer, or JUST one tree for Sniper shot in Rifleman (Sniper shot should be increased in effectiveness, and moved to master rifleman for example). Other classes need to LOSE requirements. BH for example, requiring master scout. They get no traps, no new camps, without pushing in on what few abilities Rangers get. BH would be better off if it required Hunting 4 and Master Marksman. First, you learn to hunt animals..When that's no longer a challenge, you move on to more dangerous prey... Commando should be simply master marksman. MAYBE explore 4(commandos have to get to the battle fast, and evade detection to strike with the most effect). Squad Leader should be Explore4, not Survival4. They don't fish, they don't make camps, they DO navigate rough terrain, so efficiently that they can even lead others through. DEs should take LESS xp (or more XP per crafted item) but in exchange, require master artisan (most droids takemaster artisan components anyhow). Pikemen need to just be give a place in the game. Right now, they're the class that got stuffed in because the Devs needed one more.


Basically, do a CH type revamp on ALL classes, spread out abilities more, and dabblers will be MUCH weaker, masters much stronger, and all bal;ance is again restored. No more uber templates to speak of, because people will be far more limited in what they can and cannot do as a dabbler. Then, the masters become just that. masters. and be sure to keep in mind..a BH should be stronger than a Pistoleer, and a pistoleer should beat the heck out of a master marksman. Keep things balanced, not on a 'I wanna make houses too, so my pistoleer class should be as strong as a bounty hunter!' but more along the lines of 'well, I gave up EVERYTHING, and dedicated my life to combat, and hunting people. My JOB is to track people down, and do them in.' kind of way. If you want to be the best, it takes dedication, hard work, and alot of luck.


Not learning 1 tree from marksman


btw...I have an old hint book....and it says TKA takes master brawler. I think if TKA was as powerful, or perhaps a bit moreso, but took master brawler, then that would fix their balance issues. Or perhaps ranged combat support 4. Learning how to predict how ranged opponents will strike next would explain their insane ranged defense mods, and most dabblers are commandos, so that wouldn't have an effect on them anyways.



No I don't have a freakin sig. Just make something up and pretend it's here man. woman. umm...Whatever.
WookieJedi00
Thu Feb 05, 2004 5:51 am
#188

With the revamp of all combat classes you should also introduce something new: duel wielding. Yeah thats right, 2 pistols at once, or 2 swords at once. Thats the one thing I really dislike about the whole combat system is that you can only wield one weapon.



I hate perma-bans.
DarkAzael
Thu Feb 05, 2004 5:56 am
#189

I believe that skill tree that we have is good however i think there should be more professions and having to master more low level prof. before learning another high level prof. maybe:


a Docter needs to mastermedic/scout to become a novice docter


i believe all next level artisans prof. should need master artisans


New professions should be Engineer/machanic- they would build and repair vehicles and buff them change them like an image designer ie tattoos you could have really have somegood designs on your speeders.


I think there should be three levels in the skill tree not two. ie


brawler-Teras Kasi-Sith maybe but when you get to sithnovice you need meditating/unarmed/lightsabre/combat exp to get skills up


scout+markman-squadleader-Warmaster/Commander


markman-rifleman-bountyhunter but when at bountyhunter novice you will need rifle/bountyhunter/combat exp to get your skills up


Fetei
Thu Feb 05, 2004 6:29 am
#190

Shouldn't you upgrade the servers so they don't crash when60+ people in a small area are trying to have a massive multiplayer combat scenario?


seriously why worry about this if the servers can't even handle it, i and alot of other would rather have you spend your time on things that actually matter



Dark Jedi Guardian 4444@ chimaera
Tealinus
Thu Feb 05, 2004 7:26 am
#191

Do not removing stacking or reduce global defences to profession specific ones (like dodge) simply cap it at 150


I can say this from someone who is NOT a PvP player and as someone who doesn't actually HAVE stacked bonuses.. why?


Well simple, Im a Master Pistoleer and a crafter.. while in Bestine I went into a PvP situation against someone with a Rifleman / Swordsman or TKA (cant remember) combo and he was a nightmare to fight and carved me up... was I angry or upset? No. I simply asked him about his skills, oh ok your a dedicated PvP player and I'm not. In that case you should have won. Hmm I think.. I quite fancy being better in PvP. Shall I cry nerf? No.. he isnt using an exploit, he has just decided to invest in combat abilities. In that case rather than moan about it, I thanked him for his time, looked at skills that could compliment my pistol and went off and got them. I still enjoy crafting so what did I do.. simple I went Master Pistoleer / Master Smuggler / Fencer 0440.. (note: just about to get them lol, just need to finish tailor ie holo 4)


By nerfing the way things stack I agree with other posts I have seen on the subject. People will simply stick to a single Master combat prof and become doctors.. all PvP will be reduced to permantly buffed players firing off chains of thier profs best special... dabbling players will be further alienated from PvP for sure.. and I'm a dabbling player.. not dedicated PvP.


The point is if you learn more than one combat prof they should compliment each other, as the would in real life. As a pistoleer, the things i learn from fencer.. such as balance and timing (dodge) should come into play while i use a pistol.. just as if in real life i learned Karate and Bushido.. one would benefit my performance in the other..


Best solution.. just capp the stacking at 150... hell 100 if you must. just dont remove it all together.



Ariela Tear - Eclipse
Master Pistoleer / Smuggler / Fencer
Curator - Britannic Rares Museam - Lok

Gaunt T'Kat - Intrepid - Commando / Rifleman
malphisto
Thu Feb 05, 2004 7:58 am
#192


I didn’t read all the posts so sorry if I might be repeating someone else’s opinion.


The only thing good about it is the ability of each player to be able to have different attacks and defenses for different situations. Unfortunately some of the class’s are way to powerful against others and with mixing and matching you can create the perfect fighting charter in a very short time. For example a Master Teras Kasi can knock anyone down every time if they get the first hit or rush them and be able to keep them down until their dead. Where as a Master Commando has to move in close to do decent damages, with no posture changing attacks, unless they unarm themselves and go hand to hand, or use a less effective weapon. Having to only master the unarmed brawler to get to the teras kasi tree it would leave you the ability to also master a second elite class that is non-combat. The master commando has to master the same unarmed brawler class, but also has to master the marksman class to get to the commando tree. In PvP a master teras kasi can easily rush and defeat a master commando do to the ability to knock them down and keep them there. Then there’s the bounty hunter that you have to master two classes to get to the BH tree and is getting nurfed all the time. In PvP a 4/4/4/4 teras kasi can beat a 4/4/4/4 commando or a 4/4/4/4 bounty hunter every time and yet has mastered no classes. There’s something wrong with that. I was out with a master teras kasi the other day and watched him do 1000 damage every ½ second, where as I’m a commando only doing 1000 every 2 seconds against the same creature that had no armor rating. In a two week period a new charter can master teras kasi for fighting and a crafting class for money, and be basically unbeatable against other combat professions that take longer to master, and don’t have the skill points to get a crafting class.


I might be wrong, but mixing classes should be for using the different attacks against the different weakness of each opponent. A bounty hunter specializes in 1on1 combat, and should be at least as powerful if not more against a teras kasi. Ranged classes should be able to hit and run, or stay at a distance, and brawler class should be for when an opponent rush’s them, not the other way around. This is a good scenario for a brawler; in PvP the opponent deploys a pet and has him attack. The brawler would use his skill to defeat the creature, then switch to a ranged weapon to take out the opponent. This would give the opponent the advantage for taking the time to master more that one class like creature handler and what ever ranged weapon or brawler class they have chosen. A brawler class should have to disarm attack, so they would have to disarm the ranged weapon before using his skill to defeat them.


To be fair to the brawler classes, weapons like a flame-thrower should cause damage to the user in close quarter battles. So that it would require them to have close range weapons, like pistols or unarmed as well. It should be an advantage to have to master more than one class, not a disadvantage.


I also read people talking about the HAM attacks. I agree that the health bar should be the only one to cause death. The action should slow down the attacker, and the mind should make them lose accuracy, and both should lower their defense as well.


Sorry about ripping on the TKA, but come on, you see it too outside the starport.

just-wondering
Thu Feb 05, 2004 9:17 am
#193

Here is how I see it...We have 250 skill points. Let us get what we want with it. If we get stackable professions then so be it. Lets look at this way; if I am a tie-kon-do master and I decide to take up the swords then I know both arts. I wont suddenly get amnesia and not know how to kick if I have a sword in my hand.



Onix Coldstone/Eclipse
The-Crow /Ahazi
Bitto
Thu Feb 05, 2004 9:35 am
#194



just-wondering wrote:
Here is how I see it...We have 250 skill points. Let us get what we want with it. If we get stackable professions then so be it. Lets look at this way; if I am a tie-kon-do master and I decide to take up the swords then I know both arts. I wont suddenly get amnesia and not know how to kick if I have a sword in my hand.





No, you won't forget how to kick. But your defense is going to be considerably different when holding a sword than if you were performing martial arts without a weapon. First thing you'll ask is "Why, how would it be different?" It's simple. Face to face combat is about balance. Holding a large weapon (even a sword as light as a fencer's practice foil) changes your balance considerably, a move you could do unarmed to defend yourself will NOT work exactly the same way and quite possibly not nearly as effective, if you're holding something in your hands. If you lose your balance in hand to hand combat against a professional or extremely skilled opponent, the fight is over for you unless they REALLY mess up or have a heart attack or something, ask any martial arts teacher (somehow I have a feeling you're going to claim you ARE one so don't bother pls heh). For this reason is exactly why they shouldn't be stacked and actually be 100% effective as they are now. The idea most have follows this process of thought but still holds true that if you master a hand to hand style of combat and a ranged style of combat, you'd still be extremely effective in PVP, you'd just have to switch weapons or equip/unequip weapons to fit the current situation. Personally, I think it would add more tactical spice to PVP which SWG desperately needs...the KD/Dizzy tactic has gotten old.
Uutinee
Thu Feb 05, 2004 9:43 am
#195

I would like to see more skill points to allow someone to be able to hold thier own in combat and master a crafting profession.



Al'Akabet De'Morte
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