Dancer Archive
Thread: Solution For Dancer/Musician Income (Sorta long)
Becoming a Master Dancer/Musician is more often than not worthless other than role-play value. Think about it. Dancers receive negligible benefits for attaining Master status; +7 to range and melee defense, 3 dances (that are very similar to less than master versions) and a few other bonuses that are equally useless since no matter what your dance knowledge is you still fall on your butt all the time anyway.
Income for dancers/musing is based on the goodwill of other players. Other Elite professions create goods or services for players and by default those professions are a part of the player economy. A Master Tailor, Armorsmith, Weaponsmith, Architect, Droid Engineer and/or Bio Engineer enjoy an income that the starving artists’ career could never hope to match.
None of these professions require the player to get a secondary skill just to afford inter planetary travel. Sure most get pistol skill to kill low level monsters for the hides they need but it is not required. Scouts looking to make a buck often sell hides in huge bulk.
Ok on to the point:
Easy fix for entertainers to be able to earn money: The ability to grant or deny our healing powers.
Example:
Dancing in the cantina, as it is now anyone can run in and watch me for a few minutes and have all mind wounds and battle fatigue cured for free. If they feel like tipping they do, and since most of us don’t beg for tips more often than not no tip will be received.
Now imagine if we could choose who received the benefit of the work we put in to get Master Dancer/Musician:
I am dancing in the cantina and XxBlAsTyObOoTyxX comes running in to the bar and announces: Heal me B****! Not only will this idiot get put on ignore, I can opt not to allow him to be healed by watching me dance.
Once entertainers can Choose who they want to heal by performing, we will then be able to be Master Dancers/Musicians and be a part of the player economy other than cash supplies for the other Elite Professions.
Enough of this go get a side profession to earn travel money!
Give us tools to make money from our unique abilities!
Part II How to implement:
1. Have a check box to auto allow healing.
2. Have an interface to input a blanket fee to be integrated into the /watch and /listen and radial menu command for watch/listen. (Much like the cover charge to enter a private house. Player wants to watch, a pop-up box will appear asking if they are willing to pay fee.)
3. Have a pop-up appear for the performer So-and-So wishes to watch/listen. Options to include Allow(Free), Allow(Charge) and Deny options.
Just a basic idea how to give performer control over who they heal. I’m sure there are plenty of other ways – Post your ideas!
These ideas sound fantastic!! I don't think I could add anything else towhatyou've already presented. Great ideas!! 
Now, wouldn't it be wonderful if something like this would be implemented? As Sinda pointed out in another thread here: (http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=dancer&message.id=2985)
We're all headed for a great big kick in the hiney's as far as missons go. We gotta be able to have some way to make money and at the same time, keep those obnoxious jerks from benefiting from our skills!
I like the concept of this idea, it solves several problems .
1. First it creates an option to allow not only a player to listen or watch but also a variable fee to listen or watch, that our patrons can accept or reject. I think that the healing time should be somehow decreased if the player chooses to watch a Master vs a newbie ,,so perhaps the Master would provide 100 % of the groups healing power, the newbie would provide only say 25% of the groups healing power, That way each patron based on their budget and time issues can select an appropriate speed to be healed and be charged acccordingly by each entertainer.
2. Second it prevents afk entertainers from destroying our professional image since they would not be able to accept the offer of the patron. I dont personally mind gaining by going afk, just that it damages our professional image and accepting the offer by the patron would solve that problem,
3. It also then adds incentive for increasing skill to master when presently I have no need for box 3-4 on the healing tree, except to obtain a nicer title.
4. I also think a standard small standard covercharge should be required to enter the cantina that would be shared equally by each dancer that "punches into the clock" say every 60 minutes. By doing so you would all equally share in covercharges and maybe (not sure about music issues) you would also be automatically grouped so that the constant invites and disbands would be eliminated,,,,you join by punching in,,you disband by punching out. Perhaps there would be two clocks, one for each ,,and the covercharges would be split based on how many total players were in both groups, Obviously there would be programming issues to the clock idea ,,but I wanted to present the idea,,
Who says you're entitled to make a living dancing?
Money is so easy to get in this game that it's ridiculous. If you choose to limit your opportunities, you can't realistically expect the rest of the world to realign all of its thinking in order to provide you a living using the opportunities you've selected as your source of income.
People say they're sick of non-tippers. I'm sick of all the entertainment forums turning into the tipping forums. For Nyax's sake, there are gig missions that let you earn money dancing if the tips aren't rolling in. You don't even have to leave town unless you want to. Now they're even going to put them on mission terminals outside the cantina. How much easier can it be made?
Honestly - How do you rationalize the ability to choose who you'll heal? Are you using a magic traz that only sends its music in a straight line to the person you're healing? Are you using an personal image blur device that allows only your target to see you clearly as you dance? What's the justification in the setting that allows you to choose who to heal and when?
For that matter "entertainment healing" is a pretty esoteric concept to begin with. As players, we are aware of it as a game mechanic. In the setting, it's not that defined. It's not like getting a shot of a stimpack or hanging in a bacta tank. It's simply R&R. When you walk into a bar, the R&R just happens. It's not something you special order to your table or that you only get when the singer is singing to you personally.
Additionally, you're proposing a system that would allow entertainers to hold people hostage. To implement it they would have to also implement a "heal over time" system like they have in the med center so that some healing would always be available.
Sorry, I oppose any system that generates tips by extorting them out of the patrons. I'd support a "focus" ability that would allow an entertainer to give increased healing or maybe a buff of some kind to an individual. I'd never support a system that makes us choose who we heal and allows us to force people to pay us or not get it.
I have to applaude this suggestion as innovative and original BUT, to be honest, I don't forsee anydev changes to our profession unless weall, as entertainers, take a stand.So, until they give us an 'option to heal', I've taken to making that decision myself!
Like many of you I love the dances, like many of you I spent those countless hours for small profit, (had I spent thosehours training to be a Bounty Hunter I could have made enough money to buy a planet of my own by now!)Instead I spent them in the Cantina getting puked on, dragged to the floor, even punched, leered at and every othersocial macro thrown at me UNTILI decided NOT TO DANCE FOR FREE!.. Ok so it will take a little longer to get the remaining XP to become a master.. in order to maintain my own dignity I'm willing to invest the time!
While in the Cantina I noticed all those empty alcoves and just decided I would pick mycustomer, 'tell' that person I would cure them AND THEM ONLYfor a fixed amount. I would then take one of thosespare cantina rooms and dance for them until they are cured.. if they want to go back out and leer at or puke on a free entertainer that's up to them. Sure a lot of characters are upset with my decision, but I have found them, on the whole, tobe the cheapskates in this game whowant something for nothing and, unfortunately for us, the developers have gone out of their way to have us give it to them.
On the other hand there are a lot of players who would rather be back earning money and XP in their fields, those players see the wisdom of my suggestion and I've never failed to make 'eating money' and none of them has 'puked' on my 9000credit outfit!
There is an old expression, 'God helps those who help themselves' and another one about not giving away the farm.. it's your choice.. I've made mine and now enjoy dancing once again cause I am healing someone who needs, wants and is willing to pay for the service I render!
SlickRiptide -
I don't want to come across as a money grubber, and I know there are tons of posts saying: "I need tips". Extoring money out of customers is not the intent of my propsed system, rather it is to put an idea out there for people who do not like picking up a blaster and going out and shooting things for hours. Most people who made Entertianers did so because thats what they wanted to do in the game.
What makes me think that I am intitled to make a living as a dancer? Simple: The game is based around a player economy. I don't know about your server but an average outlay for an entertianer to get one outfit is about 10,000 credits. (this is a low est.) Why is it that I have to become a crafter or weapon master to not be dirt poor? We have no marketable skills as entertianers, even more so now after the patch since low end missions are basicaly not worth the time to do anymore.
Where dose that leave people who do not wish to craft or fight for a living? Poor, in thier underware and begging for tips.
Seems to me the entire player comunity is extorting the entertianers and the moment any mention of this is made we are labled for it.
I know nothing will come of this... It's just somthing I feel would make entertianment a career, not a hobby.
I totally agree with Slick. We chose this profession! We all knew going into this that we were only going to make money based on tips. So what if some people don't want to give them to us? I'm doing just fine with making money just on tips. Make friends with people, they give you stuff, at least good deals on things. And heaven forbid you have to go on some destroy missions to support yourself. Think of how entertainers are in real life. Most of them have day jobs. Face it, we're starving artists. I happen to LOVE my profession and wouldn't change it for the world. I would hate it if the dev's changed who targets who to get healed. I think that completely goes against what we as entertainers believe in.
As far as the jerks that come in saying obsene things, that's what /ignore is for. Or use that time to stop dancing and do some destroy missions for a while.
But...all that is just my opinion!
Ever notice how these threads all end the same? Those that like or don't mind combat telling those of us that prefer not to engage in combat to engage in combat.
What if....the combat guys were forced to dance for...hmmmm....for the same amount of time they spent combatting. So if they spend an hour fighting, they spend an hour dancing.
Yeah right! Bet they would complain about that! lol
Caelera wrote:
Ever notice how these threads all end the same? Those that like or don't mind combat telling those of us that prefer not to engage in combat to engage in combat.
Here's the deal - You don't have to engage in combat. There are lots of ways to earn money in this game. The problem is not that some folks don't want to engage in combat. The problem is that some folks want to do absolutely nothing but entertain.
If you play the "I do one thing and one thing only" game then you are playing under self-imposed limitations. You can't very well complain that you're fenced in when you built the fence. There are delivery missions. There are gig missions which exercise your primary skillset. There are survey missions. There are recon missions. You can take up crafting. You can take up mining. As long as you're not living in Dearic (where the no-build zone is twice the size of everywhere else) there's very little danger in setting up a wind generator near town, servicing it every couple of days, and selling the power on the bazaar. A couple of hours a week you're playing miner, the rest of the time you're doing your entertainer thing.
If you insist on being an entertainer only then you'd better start getting better at what you do. I regularly walk out of a cantina with 2k or more in tips and I'ma malemusician who NEVER asks for tips. Not tooting my horn, just saying that it's possible to make a living off of tips. To do so, you have to be personable, build up a base of regular customers, and pick and choose your home-base. If you're trying to make a living in Bela Vistal then you're probably doomed to failure. Ditto for Coronet. One is too small and the other is too big. Find a happy medium at a place where they like you and where they appreciate your presence. Will you get rich? No. Will you be able to afford that 10k ball gown? Sure, after a while.
Just remember that the limits are placed on you by yourself, not by the game system. The devs shouldn't be responsible for providing you with an income just because you refuse to use the tools they've already given you.
Getting back to the original topic, targeting a player to heal her IS extortion. "Pay me or no healing." Not only that, but it'd be a royal pain. Ten people are in the band, one person walks in, and everyone's competing to the be one who heals that person. Conversely, three people are dancing, ten people are waiting for healing and seven of them are not being tended to. I don't want to be dealing with a mess like this and I definitely do NOT want to be competing with my fellows for healing. I want to concentrate on the music and the dance and let the rest of it sort itself out. MY opinion is that this profession is about the art, not the tips. I'm not terribly surprised to see in-game that the most successful entertainers I know approach their profession from a similar standpoint.
SlickRiptide wrote:
Honestly - How do you rationalize the ability to choose who you'll heal? Are you using a magic traz that only sends its music in a straight line to the person you're healing? Are you using an personal image blur device that allows only your target to see you clearly as you dance? What's the justification in the setting that allows you to choose who to heal and when?
Well, as a patron, I actually have to /watch /listen someone to gain healing from them. If they are not "grouped" with the person right next to them, I don't gain a benefit from watching both. How do justify that?
How do you justfiy the inability to force a PC to duel with you? "I pull my gun out, aim and I shoot him!"
It's all silly "game mechanics" every way you go. So please don't use this argument, it has more holes than swiss cheese.