Dancer Archive
Thread: TH's further comments regarding removing recursive macro & healing BF
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Erawia_D
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:27 pm
#1
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Developers&message.id=45139#M45139
Bryan1138 wrote:
When this goes in I doubt anyone will ever be able to get their battle wounds healed again, especially anyone who plays off-peak times.
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TH responded:
I believe this is a key point as well Bryan. There needs to be some accomodations made for players who play at off-peak hours. There needs to be a way to heal up when no one is around.
Bryan1138 wrote:
When this goes in I doubt anyone will ever be able to get their battle wounds healed again, especially anyone who plays off-peak times.
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TH responded:
I believe this is a key point as well Bryan. There needs to be some accomodations made for players who play at off-peak hours. There needs to be a way to heal up when no one is around.
Panthu
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:33 pm
#2
Yep, and there are already multiple proposals for those "accommodations" to still include Entertainers. 
Amida_Enterprises
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:34 pm
#3
erm.. what hours are considered 'off hours' ?
I'm european, several of my friends are American and Asian..
this is a global game, every timezone should have ppl playing around the clock.. at least in my experience
)
Utess
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:34 pm
#4
Thing is, it already exists, cantinas auto-heal bf.
Panthu, if you can put some input into this, if they really want to make a way for players to get healed easier when no entertainers are around, then how about suggesting the public cantinas BF auto-heal rate speed up when there is no entertainer inside them. Its a simple solution and works fine if they decide they are determined to add in some way for players to heal without entertainers.
Edit: hehe you beat me to it Panthu. Still, thats one option if a better one can't be found.
Message Edited by Utess on 08-01-2004 11:36 PM
PoetDancer
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:40 pm
#5
I say players need to have faith in the market of this game. If there is an audience, there will be someone there to entertain it. Someone will fill the void that is empty. Have faith in "the invisible hand," and don't rely on "iron fists" like buffbots to influence the player driven economy.
Utess
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:44 pm
#6
Oh I agree completely. The should just remove afk and see how it goes before doing anything. But I doubt they will do that as this is significant enough a shock to the non-entertainer liking player base as is, that they will probably try to do something to appease them. Which is why we need to make sure whatever they do, it benefits us and them 
And I'm glad to hear proposals are already on the table Panthu. That brings me a lot of relief and makes me feel more confident they will stick to what they have said and still remove recursive macros.
And I'm glad to hear proposals are already on the table Panthu. That brings me a lot of relief and makes me feel more confident they will stick to what they have said and still remove recursive macros.
Xyrdre
Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:47 pm
#7
Yep, my instant reaction was a slight increase in cantina default heal rates as well. It should still be well below Novice Entertainer rates however... Novices still need EH XP.
Zilod
Mon Aug 02, 2004 2:08 am
#8
mah i can understand the fear for buffs (even if i don't agree)
but the fear for BF.....
is not that BF build up in 5 mins you need hours to get it
also it can be healed by every entertainer in the game not by just masters
if you play in 'downtime hours' you have just to know 4/5 entertainers that play in your time frame
and before logging out get some mins to go to their cantina and get ridden of bf....
if we continue with this mentality of i want all, immediatly and whitout any effort we can just ask devs to put in /invul /restore /kill even for players.... o_O
(aaa just to say my main was a BH, i have a full developed jedi too,a swordsman and grinded 31 professions to open my jedi so is not that i don't know combat issues)
aaaa just to add i live in euro... never had troubles with bf even before afkers
Message Edited by Zilod on 08-02-2004 02:09 AM
Panthu
Mon Aug 02, 2004 6:36 am
#9
FuschiaD wrote:
I trust Panthu. If she says they're making plans to combat this that won't make us obsolete, I shall believe her.
Hey hey, it's not a done deal. The proposals exist, that doesn't mean they won't choose another Prof to take over some of our duties. CM's, Medics, Docs, and SLs all have smacked their chops over our Blue Wound healing/buffing and BF Healing.
The most common Ent Propsals are some variation on: Holo Recording Healing/Buffing Items, Increased Hospital/Cantina HoTs, BF Ranger Tents, Ent Healing Droid Modules,Increased Cost "Insta-Buffs" orIncreased Cost Long Term Buffs.
BovineX
Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:55 am
#10
im not a dancer but.....
some things you all might not have considered.
i play on sunrunner, and getiing ent buffs is not easy, almost all the buffers are macros, 2nd toons to other players. most are in private houses only playing for the owner.
on dant, only 1 buffbot is reliably there. why has a muscian or dancer go there and make fat cash buffing? it's a constant stream of ppl wanting buffs there.
heres why. M dancers/musicians don't stay in cantinas. you go hang with your guild/friends. yes, you are still aviliable to your buddies, but the a vast, not teribly social numer of toon's your gone. leaving a vacume that only gets filled by buffbots. you got bored, and rightly so, sitting in the cantina with skill points unused.
so now looped macros are 'going'. but 1 3rd party program fixes and 'fix' to looping macros. the player is willing to leave a 1000$ mechine running all day, do you really think he's gonna balk on useing a 'ilegal' program, that TH almost legitimized in the reasoning. (if only the few have=advantage, than admitting some will use them) Buffbots are here to stay, no matter how they try to remove them, perhaps driven a little more underground? maybe.
but is this really going to 'improve' anything? are Masters going to come back to the cantinas? No, the same reason your not there now, still exist. now there will be less, but not none of the afk entertainers.
this seems likely to do nothing except encourage players to cheat.
BovineX
Erawia_D
Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:57 am
#11
I think so much of the grief of the last two days could have been managed by a few simple lines in his initial announcement about working with the entertainer community to address these concerns.
Almost all the players who have set up alt accounts for buffbots don't know and/or don't care about the professions of entertainers; buffbots don't care that they've bypassed a service sector and part of the in-game economy. Buffbots don't care about the trickle-down to the artisan professions when buffbots don't buy clothing. Buffbots don't care about the new players learning that all entertainers are AFK buffbots, and being surprised when the entertainers are ATK. Buffbots don't care that AFK entertainers in cantinas are no longer a source of information and knowledge, particularly for new players or players still learning their profession. Buffbots don't care that the game has been transformed from being about the journey to instead being about how fast you can get to master.
So much has been lost by the ability to have this entire profession be done AFK.
Almost all the players who have set up alt accounts for buffbots don't know and/or don't care about the professions of entertainers; buffbots don't care that they've bypassed a service sector and part of the in-game economy. Buffbots don't care about the trickle-down to the artisan professions when buffbots don't buy clothing. Buffbots don't care about the new players learning that all entertainers are AFK buffbots, and being surprised when the entertainers are ATK. Buffbots don't care that AFK entertainers in cantinas are no longer a source of information and knowledge, particularly for new players or players still learning their profession. Buffbots don't care that the game has been transformed from being about the journey to instead being about how fast you can get to master.
So much has been lost by the ability to have this entire profession be done AFK.
Xyrdre
Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:23 am
#12
BovineX wrote:
so now looped macros are 'going'. but 1 3rd party program fixes and 'fix' to looping macros. the player is willing to leave a 1000$ mechine running all day, do you really think he's gonna balk on useing a 'ilegal' program, that TH almost legitimized in the reasoning. (if only the few have=advantage, than admitting some will use them) Buffbots are here to stay, no matter how they try to remove them, perhaps driven a little more underground? maybe.
Well, I'll do my part as a good community member. I promise to report every buffbot I see as a EULA violation. I'm willing to help SOE in policing their policies on this.
Erawia_D
Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:25 am
#13
Some solutions (off the top of my head)
Find a guild/player association that has ATK entertainers in it?
Get your guild to seek out entertainers to join? (Thats how I got into my guild).
Get to know your entertainers? Talk to them, find out where they hang out?
Yes, the more successful guilds and player associations will be the ones that have found and support their entertainers. Should it be any other way?
Of course, removing buffbots means two changes-
1. Players have to change their habits to find and/or support what they need.
2. Players have to work together more.
I think no matter what you do, people are going to kick and scream. "Why be forced to
work with an ATK entertainer when you've had free buffs for months?" Changing that style of play is going to be difficult and noisy.
I agree that removing recursive macros even interferes with the way some ATK entertainers play, with all the dances and other work they have set up to be Professionals. However, I think the positive far outweighs the negative in this case.
Find a guild/player association that has ATK entertainers in it?
Get your guild to seek out entertainers to join? (Thats how I got into my guild).
Get to know your entertainers? Talk to them, find out where they hang out?
Yes, the more successful guilds and player associations will be the ones that have found and support their entertainers. Should it be any other way?
Of course, removing buffbots means two changes-
1. Players have to change their habits to find and/or support what they need.
2. Players have to work together more.
I think no matter what you do, people are going to kick and scream. "Why be forced to
work with an ATK entertainer when you've had free buffs for months?" Changing that style of play is going to be difficult and noisy.
I agree that removing recursive macros even interferes with the way some ATK entertainers play, with all the dances and other work they have set up to be Professionals. However, I think the positive far outweighs the negative in this case.
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