Dancer Archive
Thread: Sorry to burst your bubble.
Removing macros will NOT kill the buff bots. Even Thunderheart knows it, he mentioned it in his post. You may win this battle but ultimately you will lose the war.
If you think about it, this is just like real world politics. The vocal minority ruins a perfectly good system for the quite majority. The bottom line is... your opinion about buff bots is in the Minority.
Wake up and smell the Vasarian Brandy, most of us view Dancer and Musician as a support profession and a necessary evil for healing BF. Sorry, but it's just not very fun watching a bunch of toons dance around and play strange music no matter how cute your toon is. If you don't beleive me, then just count how many people do more than just come in, heal, buff and leave. Very few.
You all know that the only way to really "rescue your profession" is to remove mind buffs. But if mind buffs go away, the complaints from combat professions will eclipse the volume of complaints I've seen on these boards. I know it, you know it, and SOE knows it.
I totally expect you to flame me over this post, but you guys know I'm right.
It will kill those buff bots who play by the EULA...The only real work around will be a timer delay (not hard to defeat, all the devs have to do isadd a max delay of lets say ten minutes) or through 3rd party programs. Which, if used in public (where this problem festers), will cause the person to be banned...
Wake up and smell the Vasarian Brandy, most of us view Dancer and Musician as a support profession and a necessary evil for healing BF. Sorry, but it's just not very fun watching a bunch of toons dance around and play strange music no matter how cute your toon is. If you don't beleive me, then just count how many people do more than just come in, heal, buff and leave. Very few.
Me and many of the players who started with me loved cantinas....Most of us now however go in, heal and leavevery quickly, because we can not stomach the AFK macroers...They are the symbol of the "cancer" that infects this game...
They tarnish most professions, by detracting from the achievment of reaching mastery....Its a horrible thing that has gone on too long in game...
So, please do not speak for us all, I would love a *real* cantina...With real dancers...And the guys who I hunt krayts/Nightsisters with would love them too...
Also, I am not a dancer...I have a BH and a Jedi...I am also *not* a "social" player (Came from EQ 65 mage/60 warrior). However, it is the social aspect of RPG's that keep people playing. Without that social aspect, the game would be inferior to almost every single player game out there. One of the most powerful points of this game was the strong "social" drive...That has been destroyed by the AFK bots...
totally expect you to flame me over this post, but you guys know I'm right
- Again, it ruins any social interaction...MMO's are inferior in game play, graphics, story and "world interaction" in comparison to most console games...The social interaction is the *one* trump card they have.
- It destroys any sense of achievment or gratification...By not being able to "help" or "show off" to other players the social aspect is again weakened...Which leads to an un-healthy game.
- AFKing promotes "non-play" end games....Where the players skip through everything and know nothing of how to play their class by the time they reach "master" or "max level". Which is extreamly unhealthy for all "end game" or "social combat" (In EQ, no one wanted an ebayed enchanter in the group)...
You seem to be very lacking in any kind of knowledge about MMO's and the psychology behind them....You should read more...
Message Edited by Taewyn on 08-02-2004 11:16 AM
Do you know why? Because 9/10 of the people in the cantina are AFK, and your the only one whos not.
BF and mind wounds are to be healed by a Dancer and/or Musician for a reason. It REQUIRES that people engage in activity in a cantina. Ultima online, EQ, there were inns, Taverns.. etc, but no real reason to visit them (save for the safe log aspect in UO). Now you are FORCED to go to a cantina, and forced to interact with the people who are working there (however because of AFK macroing, this isnt neccesary, so . Now you will be forced to interact, and it will make cantinas a more interesting and pleasurable experience.
Half the stuff you said is plain selfish garbage. You like the convienence of buff bots, therefore Dancers will lose? Because thats what EVERYONE wants?
Buff bots are convenient, but they have ruined the professions, and im glad its changing. No more AFK bull**edit**.
I'm not trying to make a case for or against buff bots here. We've had that discussion a million times. If you've argued with me about it, you know that I'm definately for buff bots.
All I'm saying is that you guys should realize that this is not really a victory. Buff bots will not go away. We will simply change our methods. If I had to guess, I would say that you will get maybe 4 or 5 days of peace before buff bots turn up again.
P.S....You should be able to get enough money to make it "worth your while" when your in game....The fact that your *not* gaining that money is because of the competition of buff bots.
If entertainers did not have to compete with bots then you could charge more for buffs...Supply and demand...If it gets "bad enough" you could charge 10k if you wanted too 
....Dont you see, the economy is reactive...This change can only help ATK dancers...
Message Edited by Taewyn on 08-02-2004 11:38 AM
Message Edited by PhoenixStar on 08-02-2004 09:43 AM
Naish wrote:
For those of you that really enjoy this profession as more than just a support profession please accept my apology ahead of time.
Simply because we are a support profession, does not mean that we are not deserving of the attentions given to other professions. I submit that since we are in fact an experimental profession, we are more deserving of attention than the "usual" MMORPG professions (combat). Regardless, I do understand that this is not the situation, so all I expect is the decency to if not fix our problems, to at least make our professions as playable as the others.
Removing macros will NOT kill the buff bots. Even Thunderheart knows it, he mentioned it in his post. You may win this battle but ultimately you will lose the war.
Very few entertainers have called for the complete removal of macros. In fact, most of us only wish for the recursive macro to be removed. There are four ways I know to do recursive macros, and removing those four commands would not destroy the macro system as a whole.
If you think about it, this is just like real world politics. The vocal minority ruins a perfectly good system for the quite majority. The bottom line is... your opinion about buff bots is in the Minority.
Indeed. The minority hasremoved slavery, given women equal rights, helped bring an end to communism, nazism, and fascism.... All of these goals were brought about by a minority of people who believed they could be done...is this really runining a good system for the quiet majority?
Wake up and smell the Vasarian Brandy, most of us view Dancer and Musician as a support profession and a necessary evil for healing BF. Sorry, but it's just not very fun watching a bunch of toons dance around and play strange music no matter how cute your toon is. If you don't beleive me, then just count how many people do more than just come in, heal, buff and leave. Very few.
Oh, don't get me wrong, plenty of the AFK macrobots are cute, but like you say, they're not very entertaining. A good entertainer needs to engage his audience. He needs to make sure the people watching him think they've spent fifteen minutes in the cantina, but when they look down at their watches, they realize they've spent over an hour. Entertaining has a lot more to do with the person behind the keyboard than the actions or music from the game.
You all know that the only way to really "rescue your profession" is to remove mind buffs. But if mind buffs go away, the complaints from combat professions will eclipse the volume of complaints I've seen on these boards. I know it, you know it, and SOE knows it.
It's amazing what everyone knows but I don't. No, sir, the only way to rescue our profession is to completely do away with the AFK macroers. This can easily be done by removing all methods of recursive macroing. Then, all SOE has to do is police their own EULA.
I totally expect you to flame me over this post, but you guys know I'm right.
Hmm...interesting. This statement is that of a troll looking to be flamed, but the rest of the post seemed to be reasonably well-written. Ahh, for the good old days of JasonK trolling our boards....
Have you tried to make a looping alias? I have, you know what happens? When it gets to the end a system message comes up that says alias recursion guard hit and it stops.
PhoenixStar wrote:
First you have aliases, then you have macros writtin in game, use your imagination. The only way to stop afk macroing is to remove the macroing system altogether which will do more harm than good. This vocal minority does not represent the large number of players who will quit when this goes into effect. The only reason I continue to play is because when I'm not playing I know I can still get my money's worth by having my character in game when I do not have time to play.
Dreamland wrote:
Have you tried to make a looping alias? I have, you know what happens? When it gets to the end a system message comes up that says alias recursion guard hit and it stops.
PhoenixStar wrote:
First you have aliases, then you have macros writtin in game, use your imagination. The only way to stop afk macroing is to remove the macroing system altogether which will do more harm than good. This vocal minority does not represent the large number of players who will quit when this goes into effect. The only reason I continue to play is because when I'm not playing I know I can still get my money's worth by having my character in game when I do not have time to play.
Message Edited by Taewyn on 08-02-2004 11:51 AM
Taewyn wrote:
I don't have the programming mind set so I wouldn't know
This is not an insult...But this does say volumes about you.
As somone who does have a "programming" mind set, I can tell you, that with a few simple restrictions, AFK "legal" macroing can be eliminated in a very tidy fashion...
Having the argument that "someone" will figure a way around it is null...Becuase it can be stopped, many games have done it before....