Dancer Archive
Thread: Opinion: Why Buff Bots are NOT bad
Second, We should be able to discuss this topic without somebody flaming, reporting and getting the thread removed. We should be able to discuss sensitive topics.
Buff Bots can be bad if the player that owns the bot is a jerk. That's actually true for every profession, not just dancers and musicians.
I think that if buff bots conform to a code of ethics things would be better for everyone.
I follow these ethics with my buff bot which I place in the Coronet Cantina
- I make brief messages and keep them to a minimum so that it doesn't spam the spacial.
- I stay AFK so that you can filter my tells out
- Most of the instructions are given in the group chat window to keep from spamming
- I don't demand payment, I request tips
- I work the champagne room (the room in the back of the cantina)
- I only provide buffs to people that are nuetral or have my faction (rebel)
The money that is made goes back into the economy. My second character buys, food, rifles, armor, loot, etc.
Naish wrote:
First, you're not going to change my mind about this by flaming.
Whatever
Second, We should be able to discuss this topic without somebody flaming, reporting and getting the thread removed. We should be able to discuss sensitive topics.
I've discussed this topic for months. I'm done discussing this topic. I've been the epitome of rational, but I'm done with that. Your mind is not going to be changed and neither is mine. I've repeated myself over and over about how buffbots are ruining the 2 elite social professions. But, people like you don't care. I'm not going to repeat myself again. There are over 100 threads by this point where you can go and do your research if you were so inclined. Some of us, myself being one, are, quite frankly, tired of trying to educate the ignorant. All I can say is...put yourself in a position where your profession of choice were made obsolete due to the actions of others. Would that be enjoyable to you? Would you try to fight that? If your answers are no and yes, respectively, then you are being a hypocrite, and there's no getting around that. Face it. You are a hypocrite. Live it. Love it. Learn it.
Buff Bots can be bad if the player that owns the bot is a jerk. That's actually true for every profession, not just dancers and musicians.
Buffbots are always bad. Anything that ruins two entire elite professions is bad.
I think that if buff bots conform to a code of ethics things would be better for everyone.
I think that if buff bots were destroyed it would be better for everyone.
I follow these ethics with my buff bot which I place in the Coronet Cantina
- I make brief messages and keep them to a minimum so that it doesn't spam the spacial.
- I stay AFK so that you can filter my tells out
- Most of the instructions are given in the group chat window to keep from spamming
- I don't demand payment, I request tips
- I work the champagne room (the room in the back of the cantina)
- I only provide buffs to people that are nuetral or have my faction (rebel)
How kind of you. But, you've forgotten one thing. You're taking away all of my business.
The money that is made goes back into the economy. My second character buys, food, rifles, armor, loot, etc.
How about you give back that money to the entertainers whose jobs you are taking away? If there is a live dancer or musician there who you are robbing of business, that is who you should be giving that money to. Then and only then will I consider what you're doing as "ethical."
Naish wrote:
First, you're not going to change my mind about this by flaming.
Second, We should be able to discuss this topic without somebody flaming, reporting and getting the thread removed. We should be able to discuss sensitive topics.
Buff Bots can be bad if the player that owns the bot is a jerk. That's actually true for every profession, not just dancers and musicians.
If the bot is a jerk? There's no one there. You must mean they have rude spam or very frequent spam?
I think that if buff bots conform to a code of ethics things would be better for everyone.
I follow these ethics with my buff bot which I place in the Coronet Cantina
- I make brief messages and keep them to a minimum so that it doesn't spam the spacial.
Thank you.
- I stay AFK so that you can filter my tells out
Thank you.
- Most of the instructions are given in the group chat window to keep from spamming
Thank you.
- I don't demand payment, I request tips
I disagree. You aren't even there. Sure you are performing a service of sorts but there's no one actually manning the booth. Asking for payment while you are sleeping, at work, whatever is just plain silly. Filling the room with your request for tips and heals is worse.
- I work the champagne room (the room in the back of the cantina)
Just don't clutter the entrance. Nothing pains me more than to see 50 entertainers in that little entrance area.
- I only provide buffs to people that are nuetral or have my faction (rebel)
You aren't there! You have no clue who you are buffing. Saying this is just completely pointless.
The money that is made goes back into the economy. My second character buys, food, rifles, armor, loot, etc.
The problem isn't that you shouldn't make money, the problem is that you are taking money that could be given to live entertainers struggling for work.
I highly encourage folks to look at our master dancer list on this forum before rushing to buy their own buff bot. I'm on that list for a reason, I will travel to buff you. I am looking for a chance to buff and heal you and your party. I will follow you on the field (I'm also a master doctor) and buff you when you die or the buff wears off. You have to admit that sounds better than a buff bot!
I'm under utilized and that is what has got my hot pants in a twist. I'm being passed up for someone sub-par just because I can't play 24/7 and be there exactly when you need it. Heaven forbid you start hunting without a mind buff every once in a while! I know I'm not the only master dancer that thinks this way either. But making a list of those willing to help is just so... social. You might have to talk to someone. Eek!
The bot that usually lives in the city cantina was not on for part of this weekend. The one that lives in the cloner wasn't around either. The one that lives in the base complex was on but "broken." I'm not really sure how she gets broken, but people are always complaining about her being broken and honestly I just don't want to think about it more than I have to.
OH NO!!! Everyone had to go without buffs, right!?! THE HORROR!!
Wrong.
I was there. I spent 6 or 7 hours a day administering buffs and heals. All live. All in a timely fashion because being both alive and able to use functions like /dump and restarting macros and spending time dancing without even using a macro, I was able to give people what they wanted when they wanted it and with as little hassle as possible.
The vast majority of it I enjoyed completely, because I love dancing. Yes, I also enjoy goig out and hunting, being a creature handler and a pistoleer. I also enjoy PVPing as a CH and I've been enjoying borrowing a friend's rifle/CM character to play as well. But out of it all, I still will almost always choose dancing first. 99.9% of the people who came in were wonderfully nice to me, and grateful for the heals and buffs.
So why is it so impossible to go out to an NPC cantina and find a real dancer to join your PA? I bet there is a new person just sitting in Mos Eisley on Radiant right now wishing they had a place they could use their entertaining skills to help people more other than just the newbies in Eisley. I would probably even go as far as to say there might be an Entertainer PA that will have staff for you to hire to have entertainers around all the time, or at least during populated hours. But you're choosing the degrading option, the abusive option, the avoidant option over simply seeking out those of us who have the same goal but will help achieve it playing a support role.
We do exist. I'm here not only talking but living it and so are plenty of others.
Now, I say the vast majority of my weekend dancing I enjoyed. But there was one incident that hurt me beyond belief, that literally made me so hurt and angry that I started crying over this stupid game. Someone walked in and pointed at me and demanded an invite to "it's" group. Now, "it" is just a word, right? I was completely overreacting, right? No. It went beyond a word. It's an entire mind set that dancers are no longer people. We're its. NPCs. Soulless, lifeless animations that dispense mechanics with no need for regard, no need for respect, no need for anything.
And that's what you're about to create, isn't it? Another NPC. Because that's how you view us, as NPC vending machines to give you what you want. You're not going to make a character to play, you're going to make your own personal NPC. Every time someone makes the decision to behave like an NPC it furthers the view that we ARE NPCs. You can't be half and half, you are either a real person or you're not. And for every person who decides to not be real, 10, 20, more other people decide none of the rest of us are real either.
It hurts. It hurts a lot, to be standing there doing my damnedest to help people, but it doesn't matter, I'm just a vending machine in some peoples' eyes. And those "some people" are growing by leaps and bounds, every day.
(Edited because borring isn't a word, and because I dislike typos)
Message Edited by Doriana on 07-28-2004 04:23 PM
Naish wrote:
First, you're not going to change my mind about this by flaming.
Second, We should be able to discuss this topic without somebody flaming, reporting and getting the thread removed. We should be able to discuss sensitive topics. Yup. But it's a sensitive subject that has affected our gameplay every day for quite awhile now. We're quite frustrated with the whole situation at this point, and many folks are just deciding to quit their Entertainer profession over it, or just stop buffing at all. Which only exacerbates the problem further.
Buff Bots can be bad if the player that owns the bot is a jerk. That's actually true for every profession, not just dancers and musicians. What other professions AFK buff? A Doctor could/might. But they'd potentially lose millions if people didn't pay. The fact is, it's not that these people are necessarily jerks (though some are), it's that these people feel that their $15/month entitles them to AFK "play" a profession at the detriment of other live players of those professions.
I think that if buff bots conform to a code of ethics things would be better for everyone. Unfortunately, as noble as that sounds, such a thing will never happen. Many who own these bots started them with selfish intent, and have no interest in abiding by any ethics anyone else proposes to them.
I follow these ethics with my buff bot which I place in the Coronet Cantina Unfortunately, as nice as the below considerations are (and it's more than we usually get as live entertainers), the fact that you have your buffbot in a public cantina is incredibly rude to live entertainers who are just trying to make a living in-game. I humbly request you move this buffbot to a private structure outside of Coronet. In it, so long as it's open to the public, you can heal battle fatigue and buff just like in the cantina. But it lets live entertainers make a living.
- I make brief messages and keep them to a minimum so that it doesn't spam the spacial.
- I stay AFK so that you can filter my tells out
- Most of the instructions are given in the group chat window to keep from spamming
- I don't demand payment, I request tips
- I work the champagne room (the room in the back of the cantina)
- I only provide buffs to people that are nuetral or have my faction (rebel)
The money that is made goes back into the economy. My second character buys, food, rifles, armor, loot, etc.
I appreciate your attempts to be considerate of us, but truly being considerate to us would be to either:
A) get rid of the buffbot (which you've stated isn't an option).
B) move it somewhere outside of a major NPC city's cantina
Please, please consider option B.
Thanks for trying to facilitate a productive discussion about this, but as many have said in this post, we're all seriously drained on all of this.
- I make brief messages and keep them to a minimum so that it doesn't spam the spacial.
- I stay AFK so that you can filter my tells out
- Most of the instructions are given in the group chat window to keep from spamming
- I don't demand payment, I request tips
- I work the champagne room (the room in the back of the cantina)
- I only provide buffs to people that are nuetral or have my faction (rebel)
The money that is made goes back into the economy. My second character buys, food, rifles, armor, loot, etc."
"As far as the money question is concerned, galaxies is a capitolistic environment. Business practices change. I've done lots of stuff to make cash that has long since dried up. Like selling mounts for example. No money in that any more."
)
Ok this is a lot of text to read so I'll sum it up here--I didnt see anywhere in your post why buffbots are not bad. I only saw reasons as why some buffbots are not as bad as others. That doesn't make them good.
Naish wrote: "Buff Bots can be bad if the player that owns the bot is a jerk. That's actually true for every profession, not just dancers and musicians."
- I make brief messages and keep them to a minimum so that it doesn't spam the spacial.
- I stay AFK so that you can filter my tells out
- Most of the instructions are given in the group chat window to keep from spamming
- I don't demand payment, I request tips
- I work the champagne room (the room in the back of the cantina)
- I only provide buffs to people that are nuetral or have my faction (rebel)
Naish wrote: The money that is made goes back into the economy. My second character buys, food, rifles, armor, loot, etc.
You also allow other players to use your bot for free--distorting the benefit/cost intended for mind buffs. Why should anyone even think twice about getting a mind buff from your bot when they don't have to tip and there's no risk you might not have the time? They can spend every moment of the game buffed--which means the game is less challenging than it otherwise would be. No need to buy spice or brandy, when they can get free buffs from you. Yes I know, many tip probably because many players feel odd about freeloading, or they value the bot being there so they want to encourage you to leave it there. And for PVP, they may need to use spice and brandy too. But on average, you are probably "dumping" cheap mind buffs on the market which devalues the worth of entertainer's who are playing live as well as the worth of other mind enhance things. But even worse than the economic impact is the social impact your bot has on entertainers. It just helps to further player's expectations that entertainers are NPCs, that they shouldnt' talk to enteratiners, that there is no need for anyone to play this profession.
Anyway, by posting this you've shown yourself at least concerned about what other players are thinking. Maybe you won't change your mind about running a bot but I hope you'll at least think about that possibility.