Dancer Archive
Thread: Can't Buff Ourselves Dev Response
Caerwynn wrote:
JeCy wrote:
I dont see what the big deal is.. we are entertainers... just the basis of the porfession implys there are more than one of you at any given time. I know very very few solo entertainers.. Just have your freind buff ya. its really not a big deal
Have you read all the posts on this? Often hybrids are the ONLY ent in a group. See our earlier posts, I have rarely been in a group with another Ent hybrid in the wilds of Yavin or Endor.
For Hybrids this is a very big deal and the failure of other Ents to see this just highlights the problem we face. If you don't see it, how the bleeping heck are we going to get the devs to see it?
Agreed! There are only four pages. It'll take a few minutes to get through them all, but you'll see posts from several different hybrids on the subject.
Maybe we should make our own thread to gather all the reasons why we're bummed in one place. Hybrids unite! 
Ok..one more counterargument I'd like to see you guys address:
When a player whose character's template is a hybrid of combat and either crafting or entertaining is engaging in combat, the player is playing the game as a combat character (not as an entertainer or crafter). There are players of combat professions whose preference is to be able to avoid having to find, hire or otherwise engage an entertainer (why there were buff bots to begin with). If a player can avoid going out of their way to engage an entertainer to enhance combat xp simply by taking novice entertainer (keep in mind that the Inspiration that bonuses combat is not desired by full template combatters, hence those who want it most have unspent skill points), what can be done to protect the entertainer professions' viability in the interdependency?
Keep in mind; I'm asking this for the sake of forming our argument. I am not in disagreement with you guys on this issue. Also remember that we are members of an elite profession asking for a change to a related starter profession, like merchants asking for a change to artisan.
(sorry that I'm running late on my timeline for this issue, I have a bad cold..just be glad you aren't expecting me to pay a bill)
Feel better soon Esh. Plenty of rest, plenty of fluids..
My take on a combat character using 15 skillpoints to pick up Novice Entertainer is that's exactly what they did in the "old days". When I first started playing SWG one of the reasons I created my character as a healer wasbecause, watching over the shoulders of my husband and friends who played, I saw that there weren't entertainers and doctors around. I can't tell you how many times during those first days and weeks that a player came into the Dearic cantina or medical center and literally WHOOPED! for joy that I was there. It meant they could finally surrender that novice skill they'd been hanging onto just so they could heal their BF and wounds. Will some combat characters keep the novice skill simply to avoid interacting with other people, possibly. But I don't think the number will be any greater than those who will use their second character slot or purchase another account so that they can do essentially the same thing. The beauty of the hybrid entertainer-combat master used to be that we were an asset and really spoke to the idea of a massively multiplayer game. Now with the changes to health stat bonuses, CL "gimping", and a limit to group size of 8. We've become the leapers of the galaxy. Go to any known "hunt group forming" location and listen to the restrictions that you hear. "CL 80 only group forming..." "CL 65 or higher, send tell to...." I've mastered rifles and have a T-21 that does over 1000 damage without a pup and I can't get an invite to kill bols??? What kind of logic is that? People keep novice medic so they can hit themselves and their group mates with bacta during combat. Keeping novice entertainer to be able to give yourself and your group mates an inspiration buff is no different in my mind.
By the way, did they change the new player starter quest where they had you go to the cantina in Mos Eisley and dance for 2 minutes to give yourself an inspiration buff??
Esharra wrote:If a player can avoid going out of their way to engage an entertainer to enhance combat xp simply by taking novice entertainer (keep in mind that the Inspiration that bonuses combat is not desired by full template combatters, hence those who want it most have unspent skill points), what can be done to protect the entertainer professions' viability in the interdependency?
Well here is what I would say to that: Let 'em.
If they are so averse to interacting that they want to waste 15 skill points on this, let them do it. Meanwhile, people who don't want to waste 15 skill points will keep coming to us.
OR... how about the devs come up with a buff system that doesn't make it so that novice entertainers are just as good as masters?
C
Esharra wrote:
If a player can avoid going out of their way to engage an entertainer to enhance combat xp simply by taking novice entertainer (keep in mind that the Inspiration that bonuses combat is not desired by full template combatters, hence those who want it most have unspent skill points), what can be done to protect the entertainer professions' viability in the interdependency?
currently that novice level buff isn't worth the time it takes to go to the cantina and get it. I tested this theory by advertising free inspirations in a camp just outside of the main gathering point for grinders on Starsider. No one even acknowledged my existance. We're talking about a demographic that is specifically looking to increase xp gains. They didn't stop to get a buff cause they could gain more xp by just going and killilng a few more things in the time it would take to apply a buff.
Alowing low level combatants the option of self buffing in a cantina would serve to bring them into the cantina and alow us to interact with them. Since this is our only content, i see it as a good thing. Back at the beginning of the game, many combatants had novice entertainer for the purpose of healing bf when they could find no entertainers.I found that to be a lot of fun and I really liked jumping into a lower dance and partying with them.It made the experience of healing BF that much more fun.Furthermore, I canname 3 or 4quad mastery entertainers that started out that way. Why should we gate this area of game play?Noobs can dabble in anything else and benefit from it. Why not entertainer?
The low level buffs are simply not worth that much for dedicated entertainers to really worry about that market. Not to mention it's passive so it's not "protected" anyway. Even if it were worth something, it could easily be bot'ed. .......I got lost...what was I talking about?
Oh yeah, the whole "protecting the market from the evil noobs" argument is crap too. There simply is NO reason not to let us buff ourselves other than the blatant animosity between entertainers and the development staff. I welcome entertainers of all levels to come party and benefit from thier own abilities.
Esharra wrote:
Ok..one more counterargument I'd like to see you guys address:
When a player whose character's template is a hybrid of combat and either crafting or entertaining is engaging in combat, the player is playing the game as a combat character (not as an entertainer or crafter). There are players of combat professions whose preference is to be able to avoid having to find, hire or otherwise engage an entertainer (why there were buff bots to begin with). If a player can avoid going out of their way to engage an entertainer to enhance combat xp simply by taking novice entertainer (keep in mind that the Inspiration that bonuses combat is not desired by full template combatters, hence those who want it most have unspent skill points), what can be done to protect the entertainer professions' viability in the interdependency?
Keep in mind; I'm asking this for the sake of forming our argument. I am not in disagreement with you guys on this issue. Also remember that we are members of an elite profession asking for a change to a related starter profession, like merchants asking for a change to artisan.
(sorry that I'm running late on my timeline for this issue, I have a bad cold..just be glad you aren't expecting me to pay a bill)
For me personally, i have the split template because it fits my character. I have an extensive back story that has been on going for a very long time ( since the Tie fighter games actually) and the entertainer / combat fits that back story. I try reallyhard to stick closely to character and play within those confines. Not always strict role play but I play to persona, if that makes sense. My reasons for wanted to be a master dancer and a master TKA have NOTHING to do with not wanting to go out and find other entertainers and so on. I do think that the the splt template choices get a rough deal and the skill points allotted are not enough or better to say the lvls we canhope to reachare not enough but I suppose that's a whole other ball of wax. Not all of us out here did the split template to self buff just because we can, I know it happens and it is sad. That the people who don't exploit are the ones who suffer in the end.
I hang on to the MD because I am the only master Dancer in our guild and it is much used and needed. This gives me a place that is fairly unique within the guild, as a TKM at lvl 60 I can add to a group fight but my tanking abilities are not as good as they could be and I don't deal the damage I could so the others help me out. I'd like to think that we have a good example of how groups and guilds and mixed professions all work together in a way that is fair and does not exploit or discriminate or leave people out. We actually depend a lot on one another...I really have a hard time dealing with the fact that small groups like us, and the people who play fair get nerfed because others just want to grind up and get through it. That's not playing that's work.
So while I understand this issue I find it very unfair to those of us who actually don't abuse the system and do co operate amongst our various professions and so on. They took awaybattle fatigueand now there is no self buff. What is next?
That's a great point about newbies. Why shouldn't they be able to dabble and get a feel for professions? I know that finding newbies in cantinas and living up to my helper tag is a very rewarding experience.
And "the player is playing the game as a combat character (not as an entertainer or crafter)" statement:
Because even though I'm fighting, my character still has an extensive backgroud. Ka'va doesn't change from being combat-Ka'va back to entertainer-Ka'va. She's always Ka'va. Do they have a problem with roleplaying now?
In real-life, I'm not suddenly karate-Madison and then become dancer-Madison. I'm always Madison. I realize that real life isn't governed by game mechanics, but I'm not sure if I understand the argument, especially from a roleplaying standpoint.
Again, it just feels like they want us to choose and be one or the other.
Message Edited by Metricula on 09-07-2005 04:42 AM
It's the whole 'you are either combat or ent/crafter, not a mix of both' thing that is ruining my game play. As Ka'va says, we always both, never one or the other.
I'm beginning to find it really disturbing that the devs are displaying such a lack of imagnination over this.