Dancer Archive
Thread: Developers, it is not my fault.
Schardour
Thu Feb 24, 2005 8:57 pm
#41
Shaizann wrote:
Durgani smells of cabbage!
Hahahahahaha, I was just catching up on this thread after a night out, and I have to say.....that was rather unexpected.
SpinningCloud
Thu Feb 24, 2005 10:29 pm
#42
I agree with the original poster. Things have changed dramatically in player interaction since 2003...and IMO not for the better.
The lastest set of patches seems to be all about cutting down the time it takes for ancillary activites. Unfortunately I think this was out of expedience not out of a vision of making the game more entertaining.
What it does do is satisfy the immediate-gratification crowd but at the expense of a long-term entertainment experience.
What will be next SOE? Blue Frogs across all the live servers? I mean why make players grind for their exp if they can get it instantly from a Blue Frog?
Panthu
Thu Feb 24, 2005 11:49 pm
#43
LyteFoot wrote:
I just look at the other changes occuring and the removal of anything that prevents the instant action crowd is being completely removed. I don't think we're going to be able to beat the number of people who want instant action. I just don't think there is anyway to fight that "log in to play" is the current buzz phrase in all MMOs right now... it's the solo game or FPS feel I guess, but whatever, it's what most gamers seem to want. I don't think we have a large enough player share to fight that, even though I do think we make up a decent portion of the gamebase.
Add to that the fact that aligned players can now become targets anywhere and you are going to drive away the people who wanted a non-combat part in the GCW. "It's a war" is a BS excuse for giving the instant action crowd even more action in the cities but again leaves those who prefer the puzzles and mental challenges in the dust. What if we asked to be allowed to keep our Social game by providing more easily accessible puzzles and mental challenges? Real puzzles and logic games that were easy to jump in to but hard to master. I know it's not what you are talking about here, but the underlying enjoyment is the same basically. We'd still get to stay in the world, we'd still get to keep the Cantinas and performance aspects, we'd just have something different to offer "outsiders" and we'd have something more solid to do for ourselves when we weren't performing. I'm talking cantina mini-games here... as a part of our make up.
We'd still need to have other things that simulated PvE and PvP but fit our fiction, we'd still probably need other "services" like BF/Mind type "duties" to provide to other non-Ent players, andmaybe a role like the Spy angle some people would like for us to have in the GCW... but honestly, if we worked on trying to get all of that, I think we could have those massive numbers of our own and a lot of cross over interest from the "log in to play" types.
I've seen other "Social" games try to do this and come pretty close... the main problem seems to always be that they don't have enough other stuff going on (there is no GCW, shopping, hunting, crafting, so on), SWG has that in spades. Maybe we just need to be shifting our thoughts to how to be more attractive to a wider audience to survive in this new game. It doesn't necessarily have to kill all the stuff the old set liked about SWG, we might just have tore-angle it, no?
FlawedDiamond
Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:56 am
#44
Let me tell you something guys.. ONE thing they did in this last publish has had an Astonishing effect on the Dancing Profession.
The Jukebox
Club Silais in Tirius, Talus on Eclipse is an Adult Entertainment Club and last night we placed our Jukebox for the evening..
Let me tell you that was the most Astonishing evening I've spent as a Dancer since the first day SWG went live!!!
Public cantinas? Pft. I abandoned them to the AFks and Buffbots long ago. And now... why would I WANT to go to one of them?
I work in a Real Dance Club with REAL music and Real Dancers and Real customers.
I doubt they Intended them for this use but for a Plater cantina to be able to have a Real sound system?
Its Absolutely Mind Blowing.
Too bad about the Musician Profession though.
But for Once... I get to see some OTHER Profession get killed and MINE receive somethign beneficial!!!!
The Jukebox
Club Silais in Tirius, Talus on Eclipse is an Adult Entertainment Club and last night we placed our Jukebox for the evening..
Let me tell you that was the most Astonishing evening I've spent as a Dancer since the first day SWG went live!!!
Public cantinas? Pft. I abandoned them to the AFks and Buffbots long ago. And now... why would I WANT to go to one of them?
I work in a Real Dance Club with REAL music and Real Dancers and Real customers.
I doubt they Intended them for this use but for a Plater cantina to be able to have a Real sound system?
Its Absolutely Mind Blowing.
Too bad about the Musician Profession though.
But for Once... I get to see some OTHER Profession get killed and MINE receive somethign beneficial!!!!
Maisland
Fri Feb 25, 2005 6:13 am
#45
PoetDancer wrote:
**Snip** Where are my opportunities to showcase my talents? **Snip**
I'm wondering where there is an audience that is bored and wants to be amused.**Snip**
Ever performed for a Doctor Buff line? Those can be longer and more boring than the wait at the Ticket Collecter ever was.
LyteFoot
Fri Feb 25, 2005 7:55 am
#46
FlawedDiamond wrote:
Too bad about the Musician Profession though.
But for Once... I get to see some OTHER Profession get killed and MINE receive somethign beneficial!!!!
Well that says it all. Thanks for being happy I've been replaced by a SOE developed and support game device. It wasn't like I enjoyed performing or anything. So I see the make my game special regardless of anyone else extends right into our own profession. I guess I shouldn't be surprised seeing that this is the general attitude anymore. Just remember our professions are an extension of each other, if they don't mind replacing musicians then its only a matter of time before dancers are as easily replaced.
Panthu I don't mind that SOE caters to the instant action crowd but they can do it just fine while leaving a few spaces where people can slow down and enjoy other things. The problem is that they are removing everything that isn't instant action. Mini games in the cantina, just how would they do this since cantinas are now a war zone? As for the instant action crowd their problem isn't that content wasn't already instanly available, it is that they don't want to play unless they can be UBAR, they don't want to play unless they can solo everything, they don't want to play without the best buffs, armor, weapons, and template available instantly. So if we really want to make them happy lets remove crafting, lets remove entertaining, and lets let them get everything they want from the blue frogs so they can run right out within 3 minutes of logging in. Why the heck does the rest of the content even exist? Lets just make this an FPS because the reality is that the other professions are being constantly degraded for this very purpose.
I enjoy the content all the time without buffs. About the only time I use buffs is when I'm going after very high end content. The instant action crowd is so spoiled they don't think they can walk across the street unless they are buffed. How are you going to cater to that attitude and leave a space for us?
Panthu
Fri Feb 25, 2005 9:00 am
#47
LyteFoot wrote:
Mini games in the cantina, just how would they do this since cantinas are now a war zone?
Well, that has changed my original way of looking at it. 
I had pictured a full out safe from combat City Game, but it doesn't really have to kill the idea. You can remain a Civilian and never be pulled into the war at all (so far) and other changes might happen anyway that would change people's motives for going to the Cantinas.
I had pictured a full out safe from combat City Game, but it doesn't really have to kill the idea. You can remain a Civilian and never be pulled into the war at all (so far) and other changes might happen anyway that would change people's motives for going to the Cantinas.I don't think Cantinas were ever meant to be safe in Star Wars stories though... the one in Ep 4 certainly didn't look "safe" and the night club in Ep 2 wasn't safe from having two Jedi and a BH run through in the middle of a fight. 
The fact is, this is a Star Wars game and nothing in the world is ever going to allow us to ask for less Star Warsy anythingfor the sake of the Ent Game (believe me, even hinting at an attempt to ask for this brings on lectures! 
).
The fact is, this is a Star Wars game and nothing in the world is ever going to allow us to ask for less Star Warsy anythingfor the sake of the Ent Game (believe me, even hinting at an attempt to ask for this brings on lectures! ).So, what have we got? We are left with a few spaces (Cantinas, Hotels,and Theaters), we are left with our "fancy emote" Dances and Songs, we are left with a game population that craves immersion in the SW universe (and is getting it!) which increases incentive to RP and gives everyone a common story line,... and oh my goodness, doesn't that alone set the perfect stage for a true Social game?
What is it that games like TSO, There, and SL are missing? Oh, only everything just listed above. Our goal as an Ent Community should be figuring out how to accomplish the same objectives in Entertainment that those games attempt to... we just have to try to figure out how to do this inside of the Star Wars experience. In the end, I think that's the only way that style of Social gaming ever will be truly pulled off, as a part of a larger more intricate game that caters to many different player types and play styles.
Esharra
Fri Feb 25, 2005 9:22 am
#48
/cries
FlawedDiamond wrote:
But for Once... I get to see some OTHER Profession get killed and MINE receive somethign beneficial!!!!
Panthu
Fri Feb 25, 2005 9:52 am
#49
For the record, I think most Dancers understand that the Jukebox in its current form compromises Musicians. We have had a Jukebox on our wishlist before... so have Musicians honestly... but even when we talked about it, we tried to figure out ways for it not to compromise the Musician role as the primary source of Music in the game.
Not only that, but it's a short hop from PEP Jukeboxes to PEP Dancers... which is downright scary imo.
LyteFoot
Fri Feb 25, 2005 10:03 am
#50
Panthu I know the comment about the jukebox was not the common opinion here 
.
I also want to see us tied more closely to the rest of the game. I also don't mind the GCW impacting us some, it should. However having NPC invade the space every few minutes is overkill to the point of annoyance. I'm sure the devs will get enough complaints that it will tone down some. After all people are going to get tired of being load killed by NPC.
.I also want to see us tied more closely to the rest of the game. I also don't mind the GCW impacting us some, it should. However having NPC invade the space every few minutes is overkill to the point of annoyance. I'm sure the devs will get enough complaints that it will tone down some. After all people are going to get tired of being load killed by NPC.
kirah_ashlin
Fri Feb 25, 2005 10:11 am
#51
FlawedDiamond wrote:
Too bad about the Musician Profession though.
But for Once... I get to see some OTHER Profession get killed and MINE receive somethign beneficial!!!!
Great attitude in that statement. I don't consider the jukebox as a benefit to dancers at all. If it takes away from the abilities and usabilities of the Musician profession it's not something to crow about. Give me a live musician to dance along side of any day.
Phaedra47
Fri Feb 25, 2005 10:40 am
#52
We're all in this together - since when is there a dancer/musician rivalry? When the quest dance was bugged, did dancers demand that musicians not be given their cookie either? Of course not. (Well, some thought of it, but that was quite selfish.)
All entertainers should be standing together to make the game better for all of us, not saying "HAA HAA" (in a Nelson voice) at others' misfortunes.
You can laugh at the musicians all you want, or you can boycott performing at events with a jukebox, and without a live band. The choice is yours.
All entertainers should be standing together to make the game better for all of us, not saying "HAA HAA" (in a Nelson voice) at others' misfortunes.
You can laugh at the musicians all you want, or you can boycott performing at events with a jukebox, and without a live band. The choice is yours.