Dancer Archive
Thread: Is it too late to get rid of our bad rap?
ShinigamiDuo wrote:
trying to find a clear spot to flourish and dance is a CHORE.
Find a different cantina. I've been in several where this was not a problem. I have also been in some that were so packed with ATK entertainers that the same statement rang true. Would you complain then?
Sigrun wrote:
I tipped an ATK Master Dancer 10k yesterday...
Well, not me, but my combative alter-ego did. I knew this Master Dancer was at the keys because she just trained me in a particular technique a minute before and was moving about the cantina at the time.
Know what she said?
Exactly nothing.
That's your rep right there.
Here's the flip side:
As I was standing in the cantina shortly after that, a well-known adventurer came in and asked about getting a mind buff. I used /tell to inform her that I could do it, but since I wasn't master yet it would only be about half as good as a master's buff, and that I could start in a few minutes as I was presently buffing someone else's mind.
Well, for one thing, apparently if you had played the dancer at the keys, you would know that the buff is as good as a master, but to get the entire duration for it, they need to watch longer.
She said OK and waited patiently. When the time came up, I focused my attention on her and asked her to start watching me. Then for the ensuing 10 minutes we talked about all sorts of stuff. The state of the GCW (she's Rebel), what she's been up to, what skills she's working on... all sorts of pleasant conversation. It was what entertaining should be. And something no AFK entertainer could do.
At the end of the 10 minutes, I let her know she could stop watching at any time and she should have the best buff I could give her. She thanked me with a more than generous tip and started harassing a Covert Imperial in the cantina.
That's what our rep should be.
It's not the AFK macros hurting us. It's what we do and don't do while we'reentertaining that enhances or detracts from our reputation.
Again, like was said in a previous post, when you want to make the dance look good and having to actually *find* a place on the floor to dance at (not all of us masters want to do Exotic) it looks like crap going walking through people, or if a group of dancers want to do /bandflo's to put on a show you can't. Yes, I could find another cantina, but I have friends in certain cantinas that I enjoy dancing with and maybe *I* don't want to move, let them goto the empty cantinas or their own houses if they want to do this.
And how about the ones who are constantly spamming every 1-2 min "Please tip your entertainers", "Tips are greatly appreciated" and have disabled the auto AFK, or blatently left it on and they sit there with their little AFK sign on, that right there shows people that they could care less about the enjoyment of the game and only want the money...which in turn makes people think that *ALL* entertainers are this way.
Do they interfer with my gameplay? Yes they do. Do they interfer with my enjoyment of the game? Yes they do.
This needs to stop now.
Ptetroski
Master Dancer --Kettemoor
Ok here is my 2 cents worth. The other day I was in Moenia, after an hour I was the only one not afk, the whole time there was a guy coming in and out asking to buy rebel faction so he could turn rebel. I of course being a rebel razzed him a little and told him to earn it to prove he was serious about dropping imp. It was all friendly no name calling or anything. Eventually he got the last 300 or so that he needed ( he indeed already had earned the rest) and when he came in I told him good luck and that I needed to leave. As I am running to the starport I get a 10k tip from him for not being AFK he said. I thanked him and congratulated him on becoming rebel. Surprised the heck out of me getting that tip, needless to say I find people tipping more and only giving it to ATK performers. Even if they weren't in the cantina to get healed!
Yes the AFK people are obnoxious if they are in the middle of the floor, if they are off to the side or in a cantina with no ATK performers I see them as not such a problem. And if I am a group lead I always boot the afk people to let ATK people in the group. AFK is a reality in dancing and yes it sucks that people can afk their way to master (i know i can't afk my carbine so why can they afk dance).....but let us deal with it as best we can.
Also I thought the mind buff was a % based on how far up the technique tree a dancer is, check your skill tree and let me know if I am right. Not sure but I think so.
Klortho wrote:
Well, for one thing, apparently if you had played the dancer at the keys, you would know that the buff is as good as a master, but to get the entire duration for it, they need to watch longer.
Ptetroski
Master Dancer --Kettemoor
I have done this for 10, 15, and 20 minutes. (Yes, at the keys. It is foolish to assume that I'm an AFK dancer 100% of the time.) The buff was exactly the same percentage each time. Each time, I flourished precisely every 15 seconds and I never stopped dancing the whole time.
I have read that Master Dancers give 100% buffs at 5-8 minutes of constant dancing. Obviously I don't know that firsthand yet as I'm not a master yet.
Anyway,care to rebuff the results of my experimentation with actual events or posts of what other dancers have experienced?
Sigrun wrote:
ShinigamiDuo wrote:
trying to find a clear spot to flourish and dance is a CHORE.
Find a different cantina. I've been in several where this was not a problem. I have also been in some that were so packed with ATK entertainers that the same statement rang true. Would you complain then?
So basically, people AT KEYBOARD are not allowed to play as they want but AFKers are.
Yes this is EXACTLY what you are saying. If I like the patrons in Moenia and have friends there and want to heal people there because that is where the hunting and PVPing is going on and that's where I am needed, but the place is a zombie AFK graveyard, I have to leave and I am not supposed to complain about them or ask the devs to stop them or do anything else because hey it is their right??
Your double standards are hilarious, Sigrun.
You know what? I'll start respecting their right to do what they do, when they start respecting mine.
As for the point about "If it's crowded with at-keyboard people there is the same problem," you apparently missed my entire point because that's simply not true. If people are THERE you can ask them to MOVE or you can all get together and decide the best way to arrange yourselves. My AT KEYOBARD friends and I do this all the time. When I step on them during a dance by accident (it happens sometimes), I stop dancing, say, "Oh excuse me," and move. I can do that because I am there and being there allows me to see that I am messing up things for someone else. The AFK dancers can't do this by definition which means they just get in everyone's way and obviously don't care.
I have just as much right to play or dance in the cantina of my choice, and have it look nice, as they have to AFK in the cantina of their choice and gain xp without earning it. I won't even try to say I have more right, just THE SAME RIGHT they have.
Yet you seem to deny this is so. "Move elsewhere if you don't like it; AFKers get precedence." Yes this is EXACTLY what you are saying. Because they sure aren't going to move -- you can't buy and use shuttle tickets AFK. So that means I have to alter my behavior and do something I would prefer not to do.
So now their $15/month isn't just as valuable as mine anymore, but is MORE valuable? They get priority by NOT playing the game?
Are you really this off your nut or are you JUST playing devil's advocate?
C
I just would like to add something..nothing against AFKers or Anti AFKers , hehe. But I'm on starsider and yeah we have our shares of afk and non afk. What I usually do is use the whole cantina to my advantage. If I can say that ,*smiles*.
Ok , so your in Coronet, Corellia. A bunch of AFKers in the middle of the room. I move to the entrance of the place and as soon as someone pops their head in , I would greet them. So basically you accomplished two more things than the AFKers or even the non ones...You have greeted the customer first...yay! So he/she notices you right off the bat. Second, by greeting this customer most likely you will get a tip(before anyone)before they actually get to the main room...(which in my mind...why does it have to be the main room)and they might be the ones that like how some dancers are at their keyboards. Oh of course you get the usual customers that run! to the main room..and don't see you *chuckles*.
Another option is...where all the people are dancing , playing , or just enjoying themselves..in the front...why not move to the back of the room. Most likely you know 2 dancers or more in the room...move your dances in the back...heck..get a musician along with you. Everyone is so ..about being in one particular area ...over the months of SWG its always has been that main room in the front. I'm sure the designers of SWG made the whole cantina to be used. I'm not the bragging type...but usually i can get 3 or 4 customers to come to the back..and im not talking like all the way where no one can see you....but just enough so your not in the rave of the cantina. I like it when its crowed sometimes..and forgot what else I was goin to say ...but this was just my opinion on how to beat afkers or the competition ...and some 
Cloves-Starsider
Master Teras Kasi Artist
Master Brawler
Master Dancer
Sigrun wrote:Read it again, Chessak. That wasn't my point.
My point was that I'm in a cantina right now that is filled with so many ATK entertainers that Lyrical would look ridiculous. That's right, every single one is AT THE KEYS.
The problem is the same whether the entertainers are behind the keyboard or not - some cantinas are overpopulated and some are underpopulated. You don't need a dev to change code to fix that. You need to buy a travel ticket.
Unless your cantina is filled with all jerks (a distinct possibility, I suppose), if they are all at keyboard it should not be an issue. Every time this happens in Keren, we just re-arrange ourselves and agree to do the less "sweeping" dances. Of course, if people are AFK, you can't exactly come to such an agreement can you?
C
Wanted to add something else. The answer to your question. "Is it too late to get rid of our bad rap?".
I say no.But I really don't think we have a bad rap, as you say. Everyone knows the problem and its out there. Of course we will have the selected few that says anything bad. But overall I'm sure everyone knows that all dancers that actually RP their character are the better people (dancers) than the ones that don't care for it.
Anyone that says anything bad goes a little farther than someone that says something good. So one person can make ahuge scene .For me, I'm not worried about it.
I don't think dancers have a bad rep either. I have never heard anything bad against them, except people saying that they are 'useless', but that's people who just can't understand how people can enjoy dancing for hours.
Would it be better if entertainers were not afk? prolly yes, but as it is whether you go afk or not most of the time it makes no difference at all, even if 50% of the group is at the keyboard they don't necessarily want to stop dancing to move if they bump into someone and most of the time they don't feel like chatting for hours either.I am 75% of the time at the keyboard but I don't always feel like chatting, and if there are comments about afk entertainers it often comes from the other entertainers, not from the customers. Most of the people who go to the cantina don't even look at entertainers anyway they just want to get healed fast and leave.
And well in those places where there are almost never any entertainer I'm always glad to see even an AFK dancer there if I need a heal.
Sienna wrote:
The percentage of the buff is equal to the Mind Buff stat that you get in the Dancing Techniques skill line. At Tech 4 it's only 75%, you need Master to get the 100% mind buff.
I concur with this observation. At Dance 1 (+20%) I gave someone a +20% mind buff. At Dance II (+40) I gave two people roughly (not exactly) +40% mind buffs.
C
Read it again, Chessak. That wasn't my point.
My point was that I'm in a cantina right now that is filled with so many ATK entertainers that Lyrical would look ridiculous. That's right, every single one is AT THE KEYS.
The problem is the same whether the entertainers are behind the keyboard or not - some cantinas are overpopulated and some are underpopulated. You don't need a dev to change code to fix that. You need to buy a travel ticket.