Dancer Archive
Thread: Idea for solving AFK macroing For players and DEVs alike to read
I think Gohan's friends haven't figured out that you can use higher dances for better exp gain per flourish. See? That's what happens when you macro!
Gohan, tell your friends to try dancing something other than Basic.
Velvet-dancer wrote:I think Gohan's friends haven't figured out that you can use higher dances for better exp gain per flourish. See? That's what happens when you macro!
LOL!
Velvet, you kill me. :-)
C
Ufdah wrote:
I think it's more of lack of interesting things to do to keep you at the keyboard. I hate the nerf bat solutions like the one above. I have heard soloutions like targeted buffs or something a little more interactive.
By nerfing macros you just make a repetitive task even worse. As a master dancer sometimes i will go to out of the way places that never have any entertainers where i will be lucky to have someone come and see me every 15 minutes or longer. I don't need the exp (and i don't really need the cash) but by afk macroing while i am reading a book or watching TV helps those poor saps who would have no entertainer at all.
I say give us something to be at the keyboard, so that reading a book isn't more interesting.
If you find lack of interesting things, this is the wrong profession for you. I don't find running around doing a bunch of destroy missions terribly interesting, so instead of demanding a way to do them automatically, I just don't do them.
Entertainers are a social profession. Surely you have some friends in the profession. Unless of course you just macrod your way to master. I grabbed a bunch of entertainer friends and we all went to Yavin. We had quite a ball. I don't think we saw the first person who needed healing for nearly an hour. We didn't care, we still had fun. Not only that, but the people visiting were amazed to not only find an entertainer, but a whole band that sounded great.
I know many people who have quit being entertainers because of AFK macroers both directly and indirectly, yet you still claim you are helping people. Well those people that quit would be too if they hadn't gotten sick of the joke the profession is turning into.
Ufdah wrote:by afk macroing while i am reading a book or watching TV helps those poor saps who would have no entertainer at all.
So, um... I'm confused...
You're paying $15/month to help other people play a game you find uninteresting??
Wow, that is the most altruistic thing I have heard of in a long time...
Most people who get bored with the game just quit. You log in extra time and help other people heal? I guess you are rolling in spare dough, so the $15/month is not a financial strain. Or maybe you are going to write it off on your taxes as a "charitable donation?"
If so, let me know the right line item on the 1040A... I want in on that action!
C
Tiaga, I am not entirely sure what you meant, but going literally by what you said, you want to eliminate a person's ability to initiate a multiple-command action, pause and then initiate any other multiple-command action.
Please be aware that this would nerf many short-duration macros as well. For example: combat macros. If I program a macro that aims and fires a warning shot, pauses, then unequips the ranged weapon and equips a sword, that isnot legitimate in your world? Are you are saying that is just as bad as AFK macroing, and you want it banned? Please think this through some more.
Bulbous2 wrote:
Tiaga, I am not entirely sure what you meant, but going literally by what you said, you want to eliminate a person's ability to initiate a multiple-command action, pause and then initiate any other multiple-command action.
Please be aware that this would nerf many short-duration macros as well. For example: combat macros. If I program a macro that aims and fires a warning shot, pauses, then unequips the ranged weapon and equips a sword, that isnot legitimate in your world? Are you are saying that is just as bad as AFK macroing, and you want it banned? Please think this through some more.
No, thats not what I suggest. In this case, macro is /aim;/warn;/pause;/ui action (To equip sword). It's all one macro. You seem to be basically suggesting any macro with a pause in it not work, which is obviously not what I meant since I suggested changes to /pause in addition.
All I'm suggesting is that a macro/alias cannot trigger another macro/alias. I can't think of any legitimate uses for that which cannot be done the "long way" in a single macro.
Tiaga wrote:
No, thats not what I suggest. In this case, macro is /aim;/warn;/pause;/ui action (To equip sword). It's all one macro. You seem to be basically suggesting any macro with a pause in it not work, which is obviously not what I meant since I suggested changes to /pause in addition.
It could be, but that is very narrow thinking. It could also be:
/myAimedWarningShot; /pause 3; /PullOutSword
And that, strictly according to what you wrote, would be forbidden.
Tiaga wrote:
All I'm suggesting is that a macro/alias cannot trigger another macro/alias. I can't think of any legitimate uses for that which cannot be done the "long way" in a single macro.
Perhaps YOU cannot think of any, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. My reasons for having two macros could be that I often execute them singly. I understand what you are trying to do, but the fact is there is no real way of doing it without causing undue harm as well as good.
Bulbous2 wrote:
It could be, but that is very narrow thinking. It could also be:
/myAimedWarningShot; /pause 3; /PullOutSword
And that, strictly according to what you wrote, would be forbidden.
Perhaps YOU cannot think of any, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. My reasons for having two macros could be that I often execute them singly. I understand what you are trying to do, but the fact is there is no real way of doing it without causing undue harm as well as good.
But noneof what I saidstops you from doing it, it just stops you from doing it one way. You can still make 3 macros just like you proposed, they just all have all the commands. And actually I will back up my second statement that there is nothing legitimate that this will stop you from doing.
The macro system is in it's design a very simple deterministic state machine. Each state has exactly one transition to the next state, namely chronology. As such, a complex macro that uses others can always be simplified to a list of commands and pauses. So while I repsect that it will make some things a tiny bit more cumbersome, I will point out that my proposal limits only one thing looping macros.
The whole point of macros is to automate tedious tasks. You write an alias to avoid pressing the keys in a certain order (potentially) hundreds of times over. You write a macro to string together your aliases. What you want to do is force people to have to type all their commands in instead of using tools that would automate repetitive segments of macro. This flies in the face of the reason macros were put there in the first place.
Think of it: I am allowed to create an alias that /smiles ten times instead of hitting the smile icon ten times. That is why they created aliases. I can make another that /burps ten times.
I am then allowed to create a macro that uses my aliases to /smile ten times, pause, and /burp ten times. The bonus is, using my aliases saves me from typing all those commands over again. That is why we can use aliases in macros.
Your suggestion that we can still do these things, albeit with manual typing, is illogical from the standpoint of "reducing repetitive tasks". This is why these tools were provided in the first place.
Bulbous2 wrote:
The whole point of macros is to automate tedious tasks. You write an alias to avoid pressing the keys in a certain order (potentially) hundreds of times over. You write a macro to string together your aliases. What you want to do is force people to have to type all their commands in instead of using tools that would automate repetitive segments of macro. This flies in the face of the reason macros were put there in the first place.
Think of it: I am allowed to create an alias that /smiles ten times instead of hitting the smile icon ten times. That is why they created aliases. I can make another that /burps ten times.
I am then allowed to create a macro that uses my aliases to /smile ten times, pause, and /burp ten times. The bonus is, using my aliases saves me from typing all those commands over again. That is why we can use aliases in macros.
Your suggestion that we can still do these things, albeit with manual typing, is illogical from the standpoint of "reducing repetitive tasks". This is why these tools were provided in the first place.
But you are still reducing repetitive tasks. You only have to enter it once. Furthermore, copy and paste work for me, how about you? I appreciate your input, but my point still stands, my proposal would not prevent you from doing anything.
Actually, no, copy and paste do not work in the macro window. At least, they never have for me. In any case, adjusting the macro system is a really poor way of addressing this issue. You have no intention of stopping or reducing macro use. What you want to do is reduce ***AFK*** macroing. You aren't seeking to prohibit me from using my repetitive or looping macro while I carry on conversations with patrons, are you? Of course not. Yet, your so-called "solution" would do just that.
What we need to do is curtail the AFK part of AFK macroing. A better way to do that would be simply to test for the presence of the player. Perhaps what is needed is a keyboard input detector. I don't know why it would be terribly hard to detect for the presence of keyboard input. If there has been none in twenty minutes or so, why not disconnect the player?
Well you're suggesting using aliases not macros, and aliases are just a text file, and last I checked even notepad has copy and paste.
As to looping macros when talking to patrons.. You can setup a good 10-20 minute macro without a single loop. One keypress every few minutes isn't too bad.
This probably never will get implemented, however I was tossing it out as an idea. Too many people say they don't like AFK macroers, but so few actually come up with a solution.
However, it all makes sense why you are trying to find ways to defend macros.. I decided to search your posts and find you yourself are an AFK macroer, you just don't want to come out and say thats why you want to keep macros.
If you know how precisely how much action your dance routine takes, since you are so much a skilled dancer than everybody else, why don't you make that a macro? Then sit down, heal, and when you're healed, stand and start your macro again? I'm sorry but your argument doesn't really have any credibility with me.
I am no longer an AFK macroer. I used the tools supplied in game to achieve the rank I was after. I have been a master dancer for some time now. However, I do use the tools provided for me to dance for myself and for patrons, without needing to execute fifty flourishes manually.
Yes, I am defending the use of aliases and macros. These are not the enemy. AFK is the enemy. You are trying to fight the symptoms and not the disease.