Dancer Archive
Thread: Anyone else think all mindhealers should be npc's
I'm flaming you. LOL. That's rich . . . What Javy said . . .
bubbles1 wrote:
Im not baking brownies just stating my experience as a master dancer and musician.
I am sorry u enjoyed it more than me no reason to come here and flame me.
Kreistor wrote:
So, Panthu, has the subject of making these two systems mutually exclusive been brought to the devs attention?? Meaning, as soon as the AFK flag is raised for an unattended toon, all macros are just dumped?
Yes, it's been brought up. You have to remember though, the Devs want people to be able to function while AFK... they are still going with "it's better to give everyone the option instead of just giving the few who can run 3rd party software the option." I personally think this is goofy flawed logic considering that 1. Everybody and their brother uses 3rd party clickers and mouse recorders for crafting 2. Some people won't do it if it is frowned on and a bannable offense 3. They thought it would be hard for people to AFK macro buffing and they wanted to discourage it 4. It doesn't fit with our Social gameplay at all.
They aren't going to change their stance on AFK "play" for us, goofy or no though. We only have the option of changing our Profession to be protected from the damage AFKing has caused us. They have seen our Poll... I have to write up a report on it soon as follow up. Hopefully we'll get some feedback soon. 
You know, Bubbles1, the more I read your original post, the more I am finding I agree with you. And I must apologize for some of the flak you have received. Because I'm trying to put myself in your shoes, and I'm ending up agreeing with you that entertainment serves no useful purpose in your eyes. It does in my eyes, but you don't really care about that, nor should you be expected to.
Because it must be very hard to justify in your mind why you should entertain a bunch of unattended characters when they should be the ones entertaining you. And it must make little sense in your mind why you should have to keep on with this charade the developers want you to play that you are somehow getting your services healed from players when the truth be told that real players are not healing your BF, mind wounds, and buffing you. And it must seem like a very stupid and idiotic thing you are expected to do every time you go to the cantina that can be just as easily replaced by a system function, like a parking garage.
Because its basically the system itself that is healing your stats through the macro system combined with the ability to set it, turn off the sound and monitor, and let the game run. It is not we dancers that are taking on the burden of healing your stats. It is you who is expected to take the burden of healing your stats, and its WRONG. You'll find no disagreement here.
Because I try and justify my tips and presence every time I step foot in a cantina. I put effort into entertaining you. Making you laugh. Making you feel like a Grande Moff. And you do not have to feel like you have to entertain me. I'll take it upon myself to give something of myself to make a very cumbersome and tedious operation less cumbersome and tedious. If I fail? Its no better than you have now, and perhaps I'll get better the next time around. But if I succeed, it gives you some reason in your mind to at least keep me around. Because the galaxy as a whole is better if players put effort into things, even if its as simple as making your cantina stay vaugely more amusing that whatyou are used to. I'll get better. Dancers who try will get better.
And I just wish that there were more dancers out there who take this profession with you in mind, rather than other things in mind. That there were less individuals out there who simply set a macro and leave the keys. That there are less dancers who look to the developers to give them some kind of reason to play this class rather than find the reason within you and your cantina stay. That there are less dancers who concentrate more on the easy work ofmecanics than the hard work of finding ways to amuse you. But I can only speak for myself. Indeed, SOE has its own vision of what you want, but I know it is not satisfying to you. And its because its not satisfying to you that its not satisfying to me.
Because whether we like it or not, you have always been here, Bubbles1. You will always be with us. You are our patron, and you are OUR responsibility. And I'm afraid to say that you will always be bored in the cantina....that is unless you happen to run into a dancer who tries to justify your attention. For then, and only then, will you understand why its important to keep this profession alive. And I hope that you have the fortune of running into someone like that soon.
That's well said, Sirii - except for one thing . . . this is a game for me just as it is for Bubbles and any other player. I work too hardin my RL to come here and have to work more. I am not going to push myself even further to"justify" my chosen profession's existance to every player I come across. I want to come to this game to have fun and relax and be with friends - just like everyone else. I love Kirah, I adore Roho and Lei and all my other friends here and I love to roleplay a performer (thus the reason why I often dance in a cantina devoid of patrons).I would hate for the entertainer profession to become nothing morea glorifyed NPC program because if it does there will be one less player on this game. I will defend my right to play as I choose and in the profession I choose - and stick it out to the very end if need be -but I will not allow that profession or this game to become a drudgery for me.
Bubbles and Curehead and others like them do have the right to express their own opinions. What they need to realize, though is there is a better way to get their point across than coming into our board and slamming our player class. We've recently been dealt our hardest blow yetand, while its painful, we are trying to pull together, find ways to keep our spirits up and make the most of our profession during a difficult time. Its much too easy for people to throw up their hands and give up on this "experiment". For playerswho have chosen other professions to come in hereat this pointand tell us we are basically useless is notsimply an act of thoughtlessness - itcomes across as calculated, meanspiritedand cruel. To then have them claim they are being persecuted is just plain silly. The devs have made a mess of our game profession and we are the ones who have to try to work inside a broken, neglected class, but I flat refuse to coddle other players who make it quite clear that they have no use for us.
We aren't going out anytime soon... I think we've already cleared the worst of it. Goodness, they are even letting me and the other Ent Corres in on the CB test now... that has to be a good sign. < Ugh, does anyone know how I can change this name??
Panthu wrote:
Yes, it's been brought up. You have to remember though, the Devs want people to be able to function while AFK... they are still going with "it's better to give everyone the option instead of just giving the few who can run 3rd party software the option." I personally think this is goofy flawed logic considering that 1. Everybody and their brother uses 3rd party clickers and mouse recorders for crafting 2. Some people won't do it if it is frowned on and a bannable offense 3. They thought it would be hard for people to AFK macro buffing and they wanted to discourage it 4. It doesn't fit with our Social gameplay at all.
They aren't going to change their stance on AFK "play" for us, goofy or no though. We only have the option of changing our Profession to be protected from the damage AFKing has caused us. They have seen our Poll... I have to write up a report on it soon as follow up. Hopefully we'll get some feedback soon.
Thanks Panthu. Didn't know if it was officially talked about or not. *sigh*
Message Edited by Kreistor on 06-09-2004 09:20 AM
Of course, this also illustrates why I'm destitute, but hey...I'm kinda happy being a poor gypsy who is a bad entertainer.
I'm with you on this one! Frankly, at this point, I'd just as soon they went ahead and stuck a lever on the wall of the med center for players to get mind heals and a button to the right of it for buffs. I didn't come here to be a support player for others. I'm here to have fun.
picklesSW wrote:
I'm apparently a rotten entertainer. I believe my own enjoyment of the game is just as important as everyone else's. I suppose I'd change that view if someone were willing to pay the $14.95 a month for me, but until that happens, I'll do whatever makes me happy.
Interestingly enough I was in a similar mindset recently. Having read a post that indicated entertainers weren't regarded as healers by the Devs (wish I could find the source post for that as I'd very much like to see just what it is the devs do think of the entertainers) I was just about as low as you could possibly get. So when several of my regular friends and patrons contacted me in game for healing and mind buffing I told them I was not healing or buffing that day and encouraged them to make use of the buffbots and zombies at various cantinas. In very short order I was getting repeated tells from many letting me know they didn't like the "zombie heal dance" and would I please please stop shooting things in the head and come to the cantina. So take heart my fellow entertainers. There may be the occassional patron who cares not if they are simply watching a zombie or a real entertainer but many out there want our interaction.
All the best,
Ikewe
Ikewe wrote:
Interestingly enough I was in a similar mindset recently. Having read a post that indicated entertainers weren't regarded as healers by the Devs (wish I could find the source post for that as I'd very much like to see just what it is the devs do think of the entertainers) Yeah... that was probably me in the TH Answer Thread *blush*
I was just about as low as you could possibly get. Sorry
So when several of my regular friends and patrons contacted me in game for healing and mind buffing I told them I was not healing or buffing that day and encouraged them to make use of the buffbots and zombies at various cantinas. In very short order I was getting repeated tells from many letting me know they didn't like the "zombie heal dance" and would I please please stop shooting things in the head and come to the cantina. So take heart my fellow entertainers. There may be the occassional patron who cares not if they are simply watching a zombie or a real entertainer but many out there want our interaction. Yay!!
Personally, I like it all. I like the arty Dancing (yes, everywhere, even by myself), the Healing (I like healing, I like having something nice to do for people, I wish we had more), and the reaching out to Patrons. Honestly, I am probably better at each of those in reverse order. Getting a "fan base" and making tips was always easy for me... it's just because I'm chatty and friendly though. I'm not a very good role player. I do go out of my way to make people comfortable though... that's because I'm sort of mothering (ok, very mothering). I do tell jokes and try to make people have fun... that's because I'm a smartypants and a spaz, happy people are more fun, it's really totally selfish on my part, heh. I'm also a big flirt. 
I've always liked the idea that we could play up whichever role we enjoyed the most and hopefully could extend each. That's why it's freaked me out so much to be told over and over again in the Corre forum that we aren't Healers and weren't meant to be Functional. o.O
I now understand that a lot of those answers are coming from Keldarin (which I knew) but all the Devs don't agree on this (which I didn't know). We're not really supposed to give out Dev names and who said what, but with out getting into over detail and because this was discussed in a Panel at FF, I'll throw some stuff out there with names.
First let me say, Keldarin is nuts for Ents. I think he's pretty Artsy himself so the class appeals to him (that's a guess). I think a lot of that is getting lost in translation or because of the context we are usually having to ask things. He does seem to have a clear role in mind for Ents and it's a lot more Arty than I ever understood. His "no" replies to me (most of our past communication, lol) and the other Ent Corres make a lot more sense in that context.
Runesaber was actually the Dev at the Ent Panel and I (along with Pappi and Jessi) was a little thrown off to be hearing such different answers to the same questions we've already had answered. I kept saying "but Keldarin said this... and Keldarin said that"... I'm a little surprised no one has mentioned this because RS finally said to me "I am the Lead Designer you know." *boggle* Ok, so that shut me up, lol. It was a little frustrating for me and after the panel I spoke to RS privately and that's when the possibility of a Dev/Ent talk came up.
I like every Dev I met. I liked every Ent and Dancer idea I heard. I'm sorry that it took a face to face encounter to make so much of this make sense to me. I don't feel like we're being ignored as much as we are just a very big project that hasn't been able to really be expanded yet. When I heard them say "novelty" I think now they were saying "specialty." It sounded like hooey to me before, but after hearing them talk about it, I understand it's not just a line.
Still though, that leaves us with now. What are we to do until they have time for a specialty project that doesn't affect the whole game? Well, that leaves us with the same issues we were already working on. So, no real change in my tactics as a Correspondent... but if I was hopeful and excited before, I am 20 million times more so now. I don't think this means we can slack off or stop fighting for our issues now, but I think we can be a lot calmer about our role in the future.
When I asked RS if we were supposed to be healing in tents at the Ent Panel, he said "we don't know yet"... right there, in front of everyone (I think this was before he hushed me up, lol). I know this talking phase is frustrating and I know a lot of the responses we get from the Devs sound like hooey, but they aren't. I knew when I saw our last answer from TH (weeks before you guys did) that it was the truth. I had already seen that the GCW revamp was going to be our next big break. That's why I was so anxious for you guys to see it. It was a "when" answer! Yay!
Then I scrolled down to the Musician answer and said "uhg." I understand it better now, as Tiaga has said in other posts, Keldarin told us our Buffing Code is flakey and needs a rewrite. He said this to a lot of people and Tiaga has quoted him before me so I think it's ok to share that. So we have to work around buggy code... ok, I can deal with that. I kept telling you guys I was getting the brush off and there was some weirdness about our buffs that I wasn't understanding. Well, that seems to be it.
There is also the fact that Doc buffs are getting a mega revamp in the CB and I don't really have any business trying to say anymore than that about them (ask the Doc Corre). Also, there's the whole thing about Keldarin not really wanting us to be Healers... soooo, there you go. That's what we're up against with the healing thing. I could ramble on for what this all means for self buffing, attended buffing, FS Healing enhancements, BF Healing extensions, Buff Bots, and so on, but I think you guys already know what I'm pushing for with those things.
I think we might see some improvements in our Healing in the CB. I finally got to submit a real honest to goodness write up on the CB thread we had and like I've said, we'll be in on the testing, so that's all good news. I can't say what will happen (no clue) but I'm glad we are being heard. I'm glad we did the "functional" talks even if they were touch and go because they are asking for it now.
Why am I talking so much? Because I'm still fired up from FF and I'm in the middle of packing up my house to move across the country on Friday. I keep running back to the keyboard to post, email, PM, and chat because I can't sit down and play right now.
Anyway, we are on the right track... I thought we were and I'm sure of it now. We need our one voice, we need an open mind, and we need to try to be understanding of what others need from Dancer. There isn't one right way to want to play a Dancer. There are many. We'll keep pushing to get all of those areas improved. We're a fun and passionate community, we'll get the attention we need as long as we stick together and stay focused. The Devs may need a little pushing, but they aren't against us.
bubbles1 wrote:
I would rather go into a cantina kinda like a garage and get my mind healed or a buff since 90% of them are afk anyhow and are never willing to buff u anyhow.
Thank yoda that docs arent the same way or i would still be a 3333 marksman.
I say delete the professions as well as a few others