Dancer Archive

I don't think the gray area is much of a problem here and I think everyone realizes there is one. Its the obvious harrassment thats the issue and should be reported. That isn't that gray of an area, if someone is being crude and saying things that offend you and you tell them that you find it offensive and to stop, and they won't,thats harrassment plain and simple. I don't see a gray area here. But I'm 100% in support of people not crying about it every time someone makes a crude remark to them, thats silly. In this profession you have to expect it, but you don't have to put up with someone being nasty to you that won't leave you alone.

Ask them to stop, make sure they know you find what their doing offensive and don't like it. If they keep it up report them, take a screenshot of the textand put them on /ignore. Its the only thing that makes sense to do.

Think of it this way, some of us may not mind it as much of others, some of us may even like it, or just not care period. Thats fine, you have the right to that opinion and as an adult theres nothing wrong with that. Kids play this game too tho, and by not reporting this jerk thats being nasty to you and letting it go, he could turn around next and be doing it to some 10 or 14 year old girl that thought dancing would be fun.

Parents can't watch their kids every minute their playing a game and the filter helps but itsnot enough. We all need to take an active role ingetting rid of those people that seriously step over the line. I haven't come across anythat extreme yet, but the moment I do I won't think twice about it.

Frankly, it's likley to be fixed alot faster if you handle it in charecter. I think many of you would be amazed how many people watch you that have trigger fingers that are allready itchy, let alone with a good target. Get a clientle together, let them know which guy goes to far. When every person in a city is spamming a challenge to duel, even 14 year old morons are forced to concede.

God help him if he's an overt faction member.

I disagree vehemently. Someone sexually harrassing someone should be removed from the game and their credit card number marked for no further subscriptions.

I wonder what his reaction would have been if you had told him you were actually a six-foot MALE truck driver who just liked to express his feminine side in dance?

The thing is, this jerk didnt know you were a real life woman until you made it obvious. He was interacting with the fantasy of the toon, not you, until you allowed him in.

You could have defused the situation with a few well chosen words _from your character_, not you ,followed by an /ignore of his character, but instead you allowed him to take control of the situation.

Yes, there are some hormonal adolescents ( and adults, AND of both sexes) who think online games are just excuses to play out their sexual fantasies. The dancer profession attracts those types to it, naturally. These are not ballet schools, these are cantinas. Your character is a bar dancer. You WILL get hassled, its the nature of the job.

If you report every single one of them, there will always be more to replace them. Its not the answer. It just perpetuates the "nanny " mentality and the belief that its someone else's responsibility to keep you happy.

You need to toughen up a bit , and learn to defend your character, or choose a profession that doesnt involve people watching you move your body in provocative ways. ( oh yes they are, a lot of the flourishes are very provocative)

I'm a woman in real life too, so please dont think I dont understand the very real distress this type of behaviour can cause, but come on girl,you need to grasp the nettle and take the power back!

well I got an interesting story. I play a female dancer. I'm a male irl but I actualy Role play the female. Well the other night I got an offer for cybersex . I was totaly shocked didn't know how to respond I simple told the guy or kid, cause it was probably some 15 year old, that i didn't do that sort of thing and he left me alone after that.

BTW i'm not sure on this but there are laws aganist sexualy harassment even in an online game you could take someone to court over this. I know of a case in EQ where a guy propositioned a couple of 10 year old girls and there dad found out and he had lawyer get involved and found out the guys account info and took him to court.

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Numtini wrote:
I disagree vehemently. Someone sexually harrassing someone should be removed from the game and their credit card number marked for no further subscriptions.

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I agree with that Completely with ONE caveat:

DEFINE sexual harassment in clear, concise, unambiguous terms so that everyone understands EXACTLY what constitutes Sexual Harassment. Then there is a clear definition that can be fairly and evenly administered. If someone breaks it then I say "Out with them and Good Riddance!"

Problem is... even the Supreme Court cannot define it clearly. So it comes down to....

I'm NOT going to tell you what the rules are, but if you break them you get punished.

We are supposed to be a society of Law. i.e. You KNOW what is acceptable and what is not and have a clear concious choice as to whether to obey the rules or break them and accept the consequences.

What I find amusing and silly someone else may find highly offensive. What offends me may not bother someone else.

There can be NO justice or Rule of Law when there is no clear definition of Right and Wrong. Only arbitrary fiat by whoever is the designated Decider for the day.

I find that a truly frightening concept.

Oh one other thing. In UO when things went to far I would tell the guy that I was actually a 60 year old retired Steel Worker living in Detroit. That usually worked just great.

Only problem was that one day the guy in question turned out to BE a steelworker and quickly discovered that I know NOTHING about steelmaking. Word got around and totally BLEW my cover.

So before you use that trick, find out what the guy does for a living. (laugh)

Here are my thoughts. Warning: long post!

First off, I concur that this person crossed a line that shoudln't have been crossed. Period.

The point that is becomes sexual harassment? After you have spurned a person's advance, if they don't stop then and there, it's harassment... IMO.

I'm male, but I've played a few female characters in my time. I tend to be one who creates a lot of characters and plays them for a few levels rather than creating one and playing him until he maxes out. I enjoy the way female avatars look, but also I get a kick out of pulling it off... just the role-play aspect, doing a convincing job.

Playing female characters would be a real eye-opener for most males. I'm a man who loves women, who understands male desire... but being the object of that sort of attention changes everything. You quickly learn how just being friendly with someone can give them the wrong impression... and you learn how uncomfortable it can make you feel when a normal conversation gets derailed by an overtly-sexual comment. I never want to make someone feel that way, and I'll never take the side of a person who does.

I never bring my real life into the game. No matter what character I'm playing or what the circumstances are, I don't ask and I don't tell. I don't tell my gender, my age, what state I live in, my marital status... nothing. The closest I come to mixing real life and game is if I'm in a group and I have to leave for real-life... I might say "brb, got a phone call" or "gotta go - dinner" but that's about it. It's just a personal preference of mine... when I'm in-game, I want immersion... I don't want to hear about someone else's real life and I don't want to talk about mine.

So with that said... if I am playing a female character and someone behaves inappropriately, my perception of it is in-game... i.e., it's not me being harassed by another player, it's my character being harassed by their character.That doesn't make it any more pleasant, but it makes it seem less like a personal attack. So I deal with it in-game -- either through the role-play of my character or with things like /ignore... I've never been pressed to the point that I felt I had to report someone.

I think finding ways to deal with these things on one's own can turn a negative into a positive... in that it bolsters confidence. It's a shame that you have to deal with it at all, but those people will probably never go away completely... so IMO it's good to know that you can fend them off yourself.

I guess if worse comes to worse, you could always make a wookie dancer.

Listen, leave the poor guy alone. You're playing a pixelated character, there is no impact on you physically in real life. He's probably just some 11 year old fat kid who gets his jollies losing himself in his computer. Just keep dancing and ignore him. He'll eventually go away. If not, what's it to you? You can't hear him talking, he's not bothering you. Leave the poor fool alone. If your husband would divorce you in real life for taking your clothes off in a game so some pervert can see your toon dance in her underwear, then you seriously need to re-evaluate your marraige.

Hehe, just find a Wookiee dancer to hang out with. A Fat Male Wookiee dancer named Tatharo always tries to take care of the girls he's dancing with. At least the ones he likes and doesn't think are tramps. If someone messes with one of the non trampy girls he'll scare the guy off. Amazing how fast a little wookiee lovin can make a 15 year old boy tuck tale and run.

Sbocaj,

Where in my post did I mention a real life marriage?? Is that something you assumed from what I said so since you assumed it in your mind it exists???

Here's what I originally posted...

I refused and said I was a married woman and didn't dance that way.

He then questioned if my husband was watching me play and what not. I never answered.

Notice I kept it in character at that point since I am married in game to a male character. My real life marital status is noone of that goons business that is why I didn't answer his question. Since at that point it was still just a petty disagreement as to what I would/wouldn't do for the goon.

Please don'ttry to make me look the fool by telling me about how my marriage needs to be reevaluated in the real world when you know nothing about me from this post... I could be recently widowed or not into men if you know what I mean, for all you know.

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Yes looking back on it a few days later I could have done it alot better... I could have run to the shuttle and taken it out of there.

I could have run outside and screamed for help to other players (but this moron probably wasn't flagged for PVP so death to his character probably couldn't have happened).

I could have turned it around and beat him to death with *punches in the face* *kicks in the groin* etc...

I did what I felt needed to be done at that time... I was caught so completely off guard that I did what my real life training from corporate America taught me to do... report it and follow it up.

And so help my children if at 11 (or any age at that matter)are running around telling female characters what I was told and I catch them doing it... they will be lucky to have the internet back before they marry and have their own children by the time I'm done with them.

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Here's another generalsituation I'll toss out for you all to think about...

Say you had no idea the problems occuring like this and let your daughter play a dancer in this game. She doesn't know how to role play but someone coming up to her is a heavy role player.

She tells a guy no, and he rapes her in game with the emote *rapes you*

She comes running to you upset and explains what happened. Would you tell her to blow it off it's just a game and it's only pretend. What if she can't "just shake it off" and has dreams for a few nights over it really happening to her because of that comment... will you be able to not let it get to you personally???

Many parents wouldn't be able to and be screaming for the dude's head on a platter if it happened to their child. And it does...daily on the internet.

This isn't as far out there scenario any more in this day and age withchat rooms and games so popular in homes... I've read about it many times on message boards from other games I've played, and it happened to my niece awhile back who was in a kids chat room that was supposed to be safe from stuff like that.

My question to that is... What makes it ok for people to scream for his head because it was a child hurt by the words on the screen, and in a nearly same situation with an adult they are told to "suck it up".

Wrong is wrong no matter the age of the person it's said to if they are told to stop and don't, correct??

If it's wrong, what is the problem with reporting it? The log is reviewed by someoneand if the EULA wasn't broken then he doesn't get a ding on his record and it's a closed case.

If it was broken, and I'm one of 300 complaints made against this guy in the last week then he needs to be talked to.

And trust me, I am not the type to report every person every time I'm offended, it takes alot to get me to do it, and in this case I felt warranted.

I told the CSR's in chatbefore I reported it what happened and what was said and if it was something that needed to be reported, or something that was considered a minor offense and wasting their time.

Both of them told me it needed to be reported due to what was said, and the severity of language used. It was their call at that point, and I did as asked.

It's late now and I rambled on way to much.... I need not read these boards when I'm tired. I get to long winded. lol

I have been playing a dancer since beta and I love the character but I have to agree that some of these men/boys go too far in their sexual inuendos. I like to flirt and talk and have fun, but when someone comes up to me and asks me to strip or do a lap dance for them I always tell them no. Most just smile at me and tone it down, but there have been a few that keep pushing it, getting more sexually explicit and using vulgar terms. Its offensive to me irl as well as in game. So far I have dealt with it in character, but at times it is not so easy to put them off. I had one male char follow me from town to town for days...I should have reported him but eventually just ignoring him tired him out I think. When a girl says NO, be it in game or in real life, It means NO. Just back off and go on to someone else who actually wants that kind of attention. There are many out there that actually seek out this sort of thing and love to do lapdances and cybersex. I just dont happen to be one of them.

I agree that what he did was harrassment, rp or not.

As a dancer I get alot of people who do that, and I generally ignore them if it suits me or if I like someone I'll play with them for a while. If they go to far, I tsk at them in game or I just react in game and in character to them which usually involves alot of shouting and cursing, generally unpleasent things. I also don't do private dancing unless its a player who I have built up a reportoire with and can trust to not go to far.

However, if it something I don't feel I want to deal with I just tell them flat out in a /tell to please stop as I'm not in the mood to rp this. If they persist after this and one more repeated warning, then its harrassment and I report them. RPing is not an excuse to do this. If they want to rp then find another rp to do it that will consent with you on that. They shouldn't do this to someone whose unwilling - that is harrassment.

Another form of harassment is when people use /tell to hit on you. That for me takes the game from roleplaying into something that is decidely used for out of character discussions. That is a definite no no and you should tell them that.

Bottom line is ALWAYS tell them to back off first. Try it IN Character first, if they don't get the hint, try it out of character next, and if they persist, then report. them. CONSENT is the key as well as CLEARLY STATING for them to back off.

I believe what you did is the right thing because he did go too far and you told him plenty of times to back off. Its a sore subject for me because I always get someone who goes too far and I have to find creative ways to tell them to knock it off. I haven't had a reason to report anyone yet - managed to get them to back off so far.

And what's even worse is Dancers make their living off tips. I had one guy who I told to back off run around screaming that I was a guy in real life and to not tip me. I am NOT a guy in real life. Though I did laugh because the guy really did sound like he was a 10 year old - eh he probably was.