Dancer Archive

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Panthu wrote:

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DrElJefeMD wrote:

Take a look at all the crafting forums. You will notice all the "old school" crafters are not happy about these new buffs. Why? You've been a loyal swg customer for a couple of years, you have built up stocks of some of the best resources on your galaxy. You can hit that 98% exp with your resources but no one who started playing in the last year can come close to 87% and that makes your product that much more valuable than all the new guys. Now these new buffs come out, guess what. Those 30-70 cpu resources are now worthless because the 3 cpu resources will do just fine. This will be seen as another kick to the groin of the veteran crafters. Many will leave is my guess. I have 3 crafting toons with 4 master crafting professions. I have been scrounging resources for almost two years. These changes make my hard work nearly worthless.

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Yes, the Devs call these players "resource hoarders" and have threatened to get rid of their ability to do this many times. Keep making a stink about these little buffs crippling your monopoly and resource decay might be in our near future.

Awesome.

(Also, you might want to look back in the crafting forums yourself. When a Dev posted in here and asked for suggestions for non-combat buffs, the Entertainer Corr, the Crafting Corrs, and many of our crafting/ent posters invited the crafting forums to the thread. This was one of the buffs that was requested in that feedback thread.)

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Message Edited by dedraswg on 08-24-2005 04:21 AM

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Loki_Ashaman wrote:

Red-Dwarf or one of the other TCers, think you can provide a littleinfo towards this question? (Question posted on SW and musician forums relating to the resource cap issue)

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Good news...

Following is test results (feel free to cross post these to other forums you visit, I will be posting this in Dancer and Musician threads):

Crafted an Armour Reinforcement Panel mark 1 using some sweet Duralloy I have for special occasions and a fairly nice bicorb steel currently in spawn on TC. Relevant stats are the duralloy OQ 921 and UT 998 and the bicorb OQ 923 UT 456. The crafting formula for unbuffed experimenting on mass gives:

(921*.75+923*.25)*.25+(998*.75+456*.25)*.75=877

This tallies with me experimenting and reaching 87%

Now the two theories are whether the stat caps are set at 1000 or whether the experimentation caps at 100%.

under the first theory the formula would be:

(1000*.75+1000*.25)*.25+(1000*.75+501*.25)*.75=906

Under the second theory the formula would be:

(1013*.75+1015*.25)*.25+(1097*.75+501*.25)*.75=964

Now, I experimented - and the cap was

...pause for drum roll.....

96%!!!!

The resources are NOT stat capped at 1000, the cap comes in if you hit 100% experiment, so the only resources that are affected are those where all relevant stats are over 910, in those cases they will hit 100%, but all other resources will be getting a benefit.

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Red-Dwarf wrote:

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Loki_Ashaman wrote:

Red-Dwarf or one of the other TCers, think you can provide a little info towards this question? (Question posted on SW and musician forums relating to the resource cap issue)

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Good news...

Following is test results (feel free to cross post these to other forums you visit, I will be posting this in Dancer and Musician threads):

Crafted an Armour Reinforcement Panel mark 1 using some sweet Duralloy I have for special occasions and a fairly nice bicorb steel currently in spawn on TC. Relevant stats are the duralloy OQ 921 and UT 998 and the bicorb OQ 923 UT 456. The crafting formula for unbuffed experimenting on mass gives:

(921*.75+923*.25)*.25+(998*.75+456*.25)*.75=877

This tallies with me experimenting and reaching 87%

Now the two theories are whether the stat caps are set at 1000 or whether the experimentation caps at 100%.

under the first theory the formula would be:

(1000*.75+1000*.25)*.25+(1000*.75+501*.25)*.75=906

Under the second theory the formula would be:

(1013*.75+1015*.25)*.25+(1097*.75+501*.25)*.75=964

Now, I experimented - and the cap was

...pause for drum roll.....

96%!!!!

The resources are NOT stat capped at 1000, the cap comes in if you hit 100% experiment, so the only resources that are affected are those where all relevant stats are over 910, in those cases they will hit 100%, but all other resources will be getting a benefit.

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Firstly, thank you to the Devs and also a big thank you to our Correspondents for helping bring these changes about.

Well, I for one am rather intrigued at these new buffs. My only criticism is that I can no longer buff myself - but meh, I'm sure its something I'm not going to be overly upset about in the long term **laughs**. Whilst I think the division of which entertainer has which buffs is a little bit skewed, my first thought werewhat Doriana said: Are the musicians receiving the buffs they have been given to potentially increase musician numbers? Aye, tis very interesting and only time will call out that one

I know for some, the idea of these buffs makes them feel as though it detracts from them as a performer whose goal is to entertain and ensure their patron is having a good time. As someone who was a professional dancer in RL for many years, I can see where you are coming from and to a certain extent I agree that the gaming content for entertainers should be focused more on giving us that "Star Quality" treatment we deserve, that our goal should be to "entertaining" our patrons. However, from a gamer perspective, we have to acknowledge that we are part and parcel to a gaming environment, and in such we really can't escape those game mechanics, especiallywhere characters and skills are interactive and in some cases inter-dependent on each other. In other words, it is an underlying notion that we must have some kind of functionality in this coded arena that makes us a viable entity.

There is nothing about these buffs that suggest to me a detraction from our ability to put on a quality performance (and quality to me is creating and performing a routine that has obvious style and structure, is coordinated well with effects/costumes/props and other players. It is not just having a sequenced set of flourishes typed into a macro - ugh, is a huge pet peev of mine when dancing in a band, and someone's idea of a good performance is having /bandflo 1 - 8 loop macroed.... but I digress). Rather, I feel that these buffs are rather a draw card to encourage people to come and see us, and have an incentive to stay and enjoy our company. I don't see anything anywhere in the up and coming patchnotes that tell us our personalities, social skills orour creative pizzazwill no longer berequired.

For me, dancing here in SWG has always been a kind of "virtual artform" if it can be generously viewed as such - and I have always beleived that you get out of it what you put in. For those who only want to be a dancer so they can give buffs, I have found to be the ones who typically leave the profession sooner than others (unless of course they are being created into a bot), because they don't derive as much enjoyment from performing because for them dancing is only a gamemechanic, thus they get bored. For those of us who love to socialise and perform, for those of us who take care and pride in the routines that we create - a function like buffing seems almost irrelevant to us because we already have the tools at our fingertips to do exactly what we love. This is where I am, and these new inspiration buffs are like a little extra icing on the cake.

All in all - if you are having doubts, at least give the buff system a go before you condemn it. Afterall, I remember the days at launch when I had several crafters sitting and chatting at my feet whilst I boogied on doing Basic2, and there were no buffs keeping them there then...

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Panthu wrote:

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DrElJefeMD wrote:

Take a look at all the crafting forums. You will notice all the "old school" crafters are not happy about these new buffs. Why? You've been a loyal swg customer for a couple of years, you have built up stocks of some of the best resources on your galaxy. You can hit that 98% exp with your resources but no one who started playing in the last year can come close to 87% and that makes your product that much more valuable than all the new guys. Now these new buffs come out, guess what. Those 30-70 cpu resources are now worthless because the 3 cpu resources will do just fine. This will be seen as another kick to the groin of the veteran crafters. Many will leave is my guess. I have 3 crafting toons with 4 master crafting professions. I have been scrounging resources for almost two years. These changes make my hard work nearly worthless.

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Yes, the Devs call these players "resource hoarders" and have threatened to get rid of their ability to do this many times. Keep making a stink about these little buffs crippling your monopoly and resource decay might be in our near future.

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Ok, are you kidding? Read the text in red. For anyone who is confused here, this is resource hoarding, just like I said. I support crafting being geared towards casual gamers like it was intended. It was never supposed to be a "get in early or suck forever" game... and I'm not buying it that it "dumbs down crafting" just because a few people with an unfair advantage want to keep others out.

I can understand getting an advantage for a shorter period of time, like maybe three months. So a Master Crafter who's been playing for three months will be at the top of the game, but then once the new players under him reach three months, they can get to that level too. That might be ok.

Locking out new players from ever catching up to the vets though? No, sorry. That's just selfish and no I won't be "sensitive" to it. *rolls eyes*

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Alphessa wrote:

I hope something can be done with this perhaps another radial choice of ambiant listen or equivelent that will not buff you again with the lesser 10% inspiration.

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Panthu wrote:

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Panthu wrote:

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DrElJefeMD wrote:

Take a look at all the crafting forums. You will notice all the "old school" crafters are not happy about these new buffs. Why? You've been a loyal swg customer for a couple of years, you have built up stocks of some of the best resources on your galaxy. You can hit that 98% exp with your resources but no one who started playing in the last year can come close to 87% and that makes your product that much more valuable than all the new guys. Now these new buffs come out, guess what. Those 30-70 cpu resources are now worthless because the 3 cpu resources will do just fine. This will be seen as another kick to the groin of the veteran crafters. Many will leave is my guess. I have 3 crafting toons with 4 master crafting professions. I have been scrounging resources for almost two years. These changes make my hard work nearly worthless.

---

Yes, the Devs call these players "resource hoarders" and have threatened to get rid of their ability to do this many times. Keep making a stink about these little buffs crippling your monopoly and resource decay might be in our near future.

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Ok, are you kidding? Read the text in red. For anyone who is confused here, this is resource hoarding, just like I said. I support crafting being geared towards casual gamers like it was intended. It was never supposed to be a "get in early or suck forever" game... and I'm not buying it that it "dumbs down crafting" just because a few people with an unfair advantage want to keep others out.

I can understand getting an advantage for a shorter period of time, like maybe three months. So a Master Crafter who's been playing for three months will be at the top of the game, but then once the new players under him reach three months, they can get to that level too. That might be ok.

Locking out new players from ever catching up to the vets though? No, sorry. That's just selfish and no I won't be "sensitive" to it. *rolls eyes*

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lets ignore the fact that people had a deserved and hard earned advantage and are getting completely nerfed out of it. that applies to pretty much everyone thats crafted for any amount of time if this goes live and is really a legitimate cause for peoples concern. crafting can be for everyone, but it is also one of the few remaining aspects of the game where hard work, dedication, and effort rewards you with a superior product. you shouldnt be so dismissive of peoples concerns over this because they are completely valid.

but like i said lets get past that so we dont have to eyeroll or accuse people of being selfish and actually look at the impact of this change. this does dumb down the entire crafting system regardless of whether you have an advantage or not, so you should at least listen to the concern.

this change is essentially recreating the 1 day crafting bug where everything was able to be crafted at 100 percent experimentation. when this goes live every crafted item in the game currently becomes second rate garbage if it wasnt perfect already. everything crafted past that will be perfect or not. mostly perfect.

caps were the first step, now giving everyone the ability to reach the caps (whether creating tons of loot to hithard numbers on finished products or by making all resources hit the 100 percent experimentation cap) is the second. the third is probably making the resource dungeon drops 50k stacks of 999 stat resources. a formerly enjoyable, unique, and somewhat complicated and technicalgame system is now dumbed down to the point where it is almost like wow crafting. take this item and this item, click combine, heres your product. always the same. zero though. fill recipe and assemble.

that sucks and is not fun whether you have junk or uber everything. the system itself is less involved and dumbed down whether you joined at launch or tomorrow. if you cant see that concern or 'buy' that crafting is getting dumbed down ill post some linksthat have some more detailed analysis for you to read up on so you can perhaps see the other side of the issue a little better.

heres the main discussion on tarq

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Tarquinas&message.id=506574

i cant believe a lynch mob didnt come for ya on a few of the posts in this thread so far