Dancer Archive
Thread: Updates to the Community Standards Policy
You may not disrupt the normal playability of a game world area.
Area Disruption is defined as any activity, intentional or unintentional, which harms or inconveniences a larger number of players.....Making excessive and inappropriate use of spatial communications, i.e. spamming.
I move that habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters are a violation of community standards under Article 3 and Article 12. Here are Article 3 and Article 12:
3. You may not disrupt the normal playability of a game world area.
Area Disruption is defined as any activity, intentional or unintentional, which harms or inconveniences a larger number of players. Causing a disruption may result in disciplinary action being taken against the account that may include official warnings, account suspensions, or account terminations depending on the severity of the incident which will be determined by a CSR and a CSR Supervisor. Multiple suspensions or account termination will result in the termination of all SOE game accounts.
Buffbots can be proven to disrupt the cantinas in which they play. They create hostility between players in or attempting to get in to the buffbot group. They disrupt the space where live players are enjoying themselves. They change the dynamics of the cantina feature inconveniencing a large number of entertainer players.
12. You will not exploit any bug in Star Wars Galaxies, and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug either directly or through public posting, to any other Sony Station member. You will promptly report such bugs via the /bug command in-game or by emailing [email protected]. Exploitable bugs include, but are not limited to bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in-game.
Exploitation of bugs within the game will result in disciplinary action being taken against the account that may include official warnings, account suspensions, or account terminations depending on the severity or repetitiveness of these incidents which will be determined by a CSR and a CSR Supervisor. Multiple suspensions or account termination will result in the termination of all SOE game accounts.
Buffbot activity cannot be duplicated by a live player operating under the constraints of play. The mechanics themselves can be duplicated, but the ability to dispense these mechanics upwards of 23 hours a day cannot. They provide individuals, PAs, cities, and the server at large with a constent, perpetual, stationary, permanent, and oftentimes free source of game mechanics due to the creation of an entity that was never designed to be played in a manner consistant with play, commonly understood. Players not only do not play in the manner buffbots play, they cannot play in the manner buffbots play without resorting to habitual, deliberate, and flagrant unattendence themselves; due to the fact that players physically cannot dole out mechanics all hours a day, every day, for no other reason simply then to be a 24/7 dispenser of mechanics.
This provides tremendous advantages to those who set unattended entertainer characters, effectivelycreating a "Point Of Interest" for the sheer purpose of replicating and replacing the functions of actual players in the game environment. Having the ability to use the robust macro system to dole out the functional elements of entertainer play in lieu of actual attended play is the use of server resources to mimic and receive the benefits of play far in excess of play, without engaging in play.
Now we can see that the use of habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters are a violation of "fair play" rules and community standards. But will this company ban the cheaters? No. I have to put up with cheaters in my game world simply because this firm will not even enforce their own community standards, and ban those who own buffbots, and those who use buffbots.
...And if they won't even enforce their community standards on this issue, what makes me think that they will enforce their community standards in other respects?
Message Edited by PoetDancer on 11-20-2004 11:31 AM
They'll ban you quick enough if you post a thread to these boards questioning the validity of their correspondents or if point out that thier correspondents are offering 3rd party cheat programs from their personal website.
PoetDancer wrote:
I move that habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters are a violation of community standards under Article 3 and Article 12. Here are Article 3 and Article 12:
3. You may not disrupt the normal playability of a game world area.
Area Disruption is defined as any activity, intentional or unintentional, which harms or inconveniences a larger number of players. Causing a disruption may result in disciplinary action being taken against the account that may include official warnings, account suspensions, or account terminations depending on the severity of the incident which will be determined by a CSR and a CSR Supervisor. Multiple suspensions or account termination will result in the termination of all SOE game accounts.
Buffbots can be proven to disrupt the cantinas in which they play. They create hostility between players in or attempting to get in to the buffbot group. They disrupt the space where live players are enjoying themselves. They change the dynamics of the cantina feature inconveniencing a large number of entertainer players.
12. You will not exploit any bug in Star Wars Galaxies, and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug either directly or through public posting, to any other Sony Station member. You will promptly report such bugs via the /bug command in-game or by emailing [email protected]. Exploitable bugs include, but are not limited to bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in-game.
Exploitation of bugs within the game will result in disciplinary action being taken against the account that may include official warnings, account suspensions, or account terminations depending on the severity or repetitiveness of these incidents which will be determined by a CSR and a CSR Supervisor. Multiple suspensions or account termination will result in the termination of all SOE game accounts.
Buffbot activity cannot be duplicated by a live player operating under the constraints of play. The mechanics themselves can be duplicated, but the ability to dispense these mechanics upwards of 23 hours a day cannot. They provide individuals, PAs, cities, and the server at large with a constent, perpetual, stationary, permanent, and oftentimes free source of game mechanics due to the creation of an entity that was never designed to be played in a manner consistant with play, commonly understood. Players not only do not play in the manner buffbots play, they cannot play in the manner buffbots play without resorting to habitual, deliberate, and flagrant unattendence themselves; due to the fact that players physically cannot dole out mechanics all hours a day, every day, for no other reason simply then to be a 24/7 dispenser of mechanics.
This provides tremendous advantages to those who set unattended entertainer characters, effectivelycreating a "Point Of Interest" for the sheer purpose of replicating and replacing the functions of actual players in the game environment. Having the ability to use the robust macro system to dole out the functional elements of entertainer play in lieu of actual attended play is the use of server resources to mimic and receive the benefits of play far in excess of play, without engaging in play.
Now we can see that the use of habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters are a violation of "fair play" rules and community standards. But will this company ban the cheaters? No. I have to put up with cheaters in my game world simply because this firm will not even enforce their own community standards, and ban those who own buffbots, and those who use buffbots.
...And if they won't even enforce their community standards on this issue, what makes me think that they will enforce their community standards in other respects?
Message Edited by PoetDancer on 11-20-2004 11:31 AM
It all depends on what your definition of disruption is. For SOE it's saying the same thing in less than 30 seconds. I could argue that for me, hearing the same thing in less than 5 minutes is disruptive. Although that's not how I really feel, I could argue it as my position. Buff-bots normally do not break this rule.
Also, it's not a matter if a live player can duplicate it or not. If a player can attain the same abilities using game given skills then it's not unnatural. Any ATK entertainer can use the same skills that the buff-bot is using. They can use the same songs or dances and the same flourishes. They can chat the same way. There is no difference besides the customer's preference to the bot because it's reliable and doesn't complain all the time.
So report the buff-bots all you want, but it will just label you moreso as the complainer that no one wants to associate with.
PoetDancer wrote:
I move that habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters are a violation of community standards under Article 3 and Article 12. Here are Article 3 and Article 12:
3. You may not disrupt the normal playability of a game world area.
Area Disruption is defined as any activity, intentional or unintentional, which harms or inconveniences a larger number of players.
12. You will not exploit any bug in Star Wars Galaxies, and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug either directly or through public posting, to any other Sony Station member. You will promptly report such bugs via the /bug command in-game or by emailing [email protected]. Exploitable bugs include, but are not limited to bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in-game.
Exploitation of bugs within the game will result in disciplinary action being taken against the account that may include official warnings, account suspensions, or account terminations depending on the severity or repetitiveness of these incidents which will be determined by a CSR and a CSR Supervisor. Multiple suspensions or account termination will result in the termination of all SOE game accounts.
Howare these statements open to interpretation? I never created the language. Any activity means ANY activity. And I don't see it as limited to spatial clutter. If they wanted it to mean spatial clutter, they would have defined it as such. But they said ANY activity that disrupts the "Normal Playability" of a game world area. And maybe in your PAs SWG culture, unattendence the way it is done is considered normal playability. But I would bet that common sense folk who don't know the greater context of why you all think it is a good thing may disagree that the cantinas today encourage "Normal Playability." In fact, they encourage abnormal playability.
Exploitable bugs include bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in-game. I consider the ability tocreate and have access toover 7000 buffs a day and do these things perpetually, day in and day out, each day and every day an unnatural and unintended benefit in-game. The ability to distribute these things while unattended is a bug by the definition of what a bug means: it allows those things that are reserved for players to distribute actively at the keys to be distributed in lieu of play, rightly undertsood. And just because a bug can be used by a player with the same template does not make the bug an honestgame feature. Bugs are there for everyone to exploit if they so choose. But you don't break community standards just because you can use a bug, you only break community standards if you do use, distribute, or promulgate the bug.
Now you and I both know your buffbot isn't going anywhere, so you really have nothing to be concerned about, JRock. But its not because your bot is a shining example of community standards. I know it isn't, and if you are honest with yourself, you know it isn't. So let's just drop the rhetoric and just come out with the plain truth: SOE would ratherbend their rules to serve your interests then accept their rules to further everybody's. It may not be right, but its the way it is. And if we can't accept that reality of it, then we should quit. Not only does common sense tell us this, but SOETyrant wants us to "take a break" as well. A lot of entertainers are doing just that, and I'm starting to believe they are the smart ones.
And so I really don't understand why you are so very concerned about us "whining," as you say. Your buffbot will be there when you log on today, and it will be there for a long time to come. And quite possibly, you'll have the ability and the special license to break the rules in this regard until the servers finally get shut down, and the game ends.
We are upset. If you had to deal with exploitive players redefining what "fair play" is at your expense, you would too. But that isn't even the point. Why does this bother you so much? Its not like players aren't going to like us any worse than they always have before. You make it sound like we are doing ourselves a disservice by pointing out such things. Well dear, what else do we really have to do? Its not like things will get any worse for us, and its not like we'd be in any better shape if we didn't. We'll always be hated by your kind. We have before. We are now. And we always will be.
So I'm sorry if our "whine" upsets you. But at leasts its ours. Why don't you save yourself the frustration of having to hear it if its that bad for you to hear?
Message Edited by PoetDancer on 11-20-2004 04:24 PM
PoetDancer wrote:
I move that habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters are a violation of community standards under Article 3 and Article 12. Here are Article 3 and Article 12:
I second this motion.
There's a motion on the floor tocategorize habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters as a violation of community standards under Article 3 and Article 12. Any discussion?
Fellow dancers, as I entered into the record above, I did not create the language. I am merely looking at the language as it defines what is not considered "fair play," and finding that habitual, unattended entertainer accessory characters (otherwise known as"LAMErs" or "buffbots")act in a manner that fits with the definitions of what constitutes a violation of community standards under Article 3 and Article 12. If this truly is the authoritative and revised doccument of Sony Online Entertainment to define what is and is not "cheating," then I have to conclude that there is no way long term unattended macroed entertainment characters can be considered "fair players" under these standards.
3. You may not disrupt the normal playability of a game world area.
Area Disruption is defined as any activity, intentional or unintentional, which harms or inconveniences a larger number of players. Causing a disruption may result in disciplinary action being taken against the account that may include official warnings, account suspensions, or account terminations depending on the severity of the incident which will be determined by a CSR and a CSR Supervisor. Multiple suspensions or account termination will result in the termination of all SOE game accounts.
Disruption includes, but is not limited to, such things such as:* Deliberately blocking a doorway or narrow area so other players cannot get past.
* Making excessive and inappropriate use of spatial communications, i.e. spamming.
* Placing any object (such as pets, droids, structures, city facilities) which prevent access to game content (anything in the game, including city structures, houses, caves, mission terminals, etc.) or trap other customers.
* Using graphics intensive weaponry to duel in high traffic areas*
* Organizing, holding, or participating in protests held in high traffic areas (such as busy Starports or other areas where many players normally gather).
Does this mean that buffbots and Macrotainers wound be allowed to fill the public cantinas with spam? And that the privately placed buffbots can no longer advertises thair location on planet and the auction chat channels?
Baciacca wrote:It all depends on what your definition of disruption is. For SOE it's saying the same thing in less than 30 seconds. I could argue that for me, hearing the same thing in less than 5 minutes is disruptive. Although that's not how I really feel, I could argue it as my position. Buff-bots normally do not break this rule.
For SOE, spamming is saying the same thing in less than 30 seconds. Disruptive on the other hand constitutes any activity, intentional or unintentional, which harms or inconveniences a larger number of players.
Also, it's not a matter if a live player can duplicate it or not. If a player can attain the same abilities using game given skills then it's not unnatural. Any ATK entertainer can use the same skills that the buff-bot is using. They can use the same songs or dances and the same flourishes. They can chat the same way.
Long-term AFK macroers have been condemned by the Developers several times in the past. "We feel that AFK macroers are not healthy for the game. We want it to stop as soon as we can. And yes, we are aware that we are the ones that put the system in place. This was not what we intended, but things have evolved to this point." - JustG It's reasonable to assumeAFK macros to be a bug because of this, and other statements from the Developer team.
This bug allows 24/7 AFK macrotaining which is clearly both an unnatural and an unintended benefit.
*remainder of Baciacca's postsnipped for utterirrelevance*
"- Thunderheart (on whether or not he AFK macroed his dancer)Message Edited by Tralmek on 11-21-2004 12:38 PM