Dancer Archive

I don’t know, maybe someone has already thought of this. Maybe it’s already been recommended someplace. I tried searching the forums and came up with a few great posted ideas similar to my own. I am posting this here to open the discussion here, if I may.

In the thread posted on the Game Guides board entitled AFK Macro’s there were some very valid and great points made. I also found the same idea posted in the Musician forum in a thread called suggestion re: AFK Macroers.

The gist of these threads, and I am sure there are many like them, that I wanted to point out is how to get rid of AFK macro users. This would apply to all professions, not just entertainment, but given that AFK macro use is so widely frowned upon by those who choose to actually play their entertainers, I believe that this is a good place to discuss it.

The idea is the removal of two abilities:

1) the ability to choose to not go auto-afk after a given period of time
2) the ability to do certain actions while afk

The precedent for this has already been set by the removal of the ability to enter into responsive combat while AFK. Anyone with the AFK tag up cannot fight back due to present game mechanics. We know this, it’s been tested. Why stop there? Why not make it impossible to skill animate while that tag is up?

When a dancer or musician runs a macro, what is the system message that comes across when you have an error, such as trying to start dancing while running? “You cannot begin skill animating while running.” So it’s obvious that certain actions already cancel out other actions. Why can’t we also get “You cannot begin skill animating while marked as afk” or “You cannot use /ui commands while marked as afk” or “You cannot access /macro commands while marked as afk.”

This alone would not fix it though. The bots would just uncheck that little box in their options that enables them to prevent being marked AFK after a certain period of time. Solution: remove that checkbox.

This presents a further issue. When someone has that box still checked, or in the instance that box was removed, someone is subject to being automatically marked AFK, how is this circumvented? Quite plainly, there are things that are done that prevent that flag from being applied. Remove these things from being the indicator that someone is or is not AFK. Instead, implement a method of determining attended game play status based on mouse movement or keystrokes.

I’ll admit, I am not technologically minded, and I don’t work in computers or programming. I do know that many of us are though. How logical would this be to implement? How difficult would it be to implement something that measures mouse movement?

I realize that the removal of recursive macros appears to be the only viable fix to the AFK problem, I am just trying to think of other ways it can be done as well. I actually use macros, I know many live entertainers that do for a variety of reasons. While I am prepared to deal with the removal of recursive ones, I also believe there will always be someone who finds a way around their removal. So why not implement both, a sort of backup system?

Heeeey, great minds think alike and all that. =) I was planning on suggesting something very similar.

My idea was simply like this (and it is a compromise designed to hopefully satisfy both atk-entertainers such as myself and the people that absolutely need their buffbots);

1.) Remove the ability to choose not to auto-afk.
2.) Remove the ability to group while afk in a NPC building.

It's very simple, no? =)

The above two changes should help solve some rather large issues by: a) removing the buffbots from the NPC cantinas, making them move into a player owned house to be able to continue their business, leaving the NPC cantinas for the at the keyboard entertainers (and the afk-spa--dancers, who should learn rather quickly that spamming would leave to group removals and that they can't rejoin groups while afk.

The luring of afk scans should be fairly easy to prevent if it's based on checking the running macros, which after all are recursive. Ie. the checker sees that the toon is running a macro (or macros, like the ever popular /smile;/pause 300;/macro smile;.) If nothing 'breaks' the loop, like someone writing a message or doing something non-macroed the person is marked afk after 5-10 minutes.

I would like to emphasize that the not being able to group while afk should _only_ be in non-player cities (Theed, Coronet, Bestine etc.).

....erm. Is this something people could accept or have I totally wandered off of the path?

Message Edited by Esharra on 03-23-2005 08:26 AM

I've always said it's super-easy to eliminate AFK play. They don't need a single line of code. Just alter the EULA to make it against the rules, and a bannable offense. 3/4 of the people will stop immediately for fear of being banned, and the ones who aren't will be reported and either quit doing it after a warning, or get banned themselves.

If they really want to put actual code in place then your idea is the next best thing. Just make it so you can't avoid having the AFK flag go up, and once it's up either (a) you can't skill animate, or (b) you can't get XP.

C

I agree with Chessack. That's how it's done in the other MMORPGs. All it takes is a couple of public AFKers being banned/suspended and the bots will run into hiding.

Just one little problem with the EULA suggestion: it already IS part of the EULA, its just not enforced. It doesn't need to be written in, it needs to be enforced.

6. We may terminate this Agreement and/or suspend your Account immediately and without notice: (i) if you violate any provision of this Agreement; (ii) if you infringe any third party intellectual property rights; (iii) if we are unable to verify or authenticate any information you provide to us; (iv) if you violate any of the player rules of conduct located at the Game Site or The Station (as defined below in Paragraph 9) rules of conduct located at www.station.sony.com/en/termsofservice.jsp (either of which we may amend or supplement from time to time, in our discretion), or (v) if you engage in game play, chat or any player activity whatsoever which we, in our discretion, determine is inappropriate and/or in violation of the spirit of the Game. If we terminate this Agreement or suspend your Account under these circumstances, you will lose access to your Account for the duration of the suspension and/or the balance of any prepaid period without any refund. We may also terminate this Agreement if we decide, in our sole discretion, to discontinue offering the Game, in which case we may provide you with a prorated refund of any prepaid amounts.

7. You acknowledge that you are bound by the terms and conditions of the Software License and Limited Warranty that accompanies the Game. You acknowledge and agree that you have not and will not acquire or obtain any intellectual property or other rights, including any right of exploitation, of any kind in or to the software, artwork, music, and other components included in the accompanying CD-ROM (the "Software") or the Game, including, without limitation, in any character(s), item(s), coin(s) or other material or property. You may not use any third party software to modify the Software or to change game play. You may not create, facilitate, host, link to or provide any other means through which the Game may be played by others, such as through server emulators; additionally, you may not engage in matchmaking for multi-player play over unauthorized networks. You may not decrypt or modify any data transmitted between client and server; you may not use or distribute macros or other programs which would allow unattended game play. You may not take any action which imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load (as determined by us) on our infrastructure. You may not buy, sell or auction (or host or facilitate the ability to allow others to buy, sell or auction) any Account or any Game characters, items, credits or copyrighted material or any other intellectual property owned or controlled by us or our licensors.

Message Edited by Cendatinea on 03-23-2005 09:17 AM

Yeah but they don't consider in game macros as thrid party software and have stated in the Holocron itself that AFK play is not against the EULA.

What they need to write in is a line in the rules that states;

Extended unattended play is not permissible in SW:G. If your character is found to be skill animating while unattended your account can be suspended or revoked.

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Else-Whira wrote:
Yeah but they don't consider in game macros as thrid party software and have stated in the Holocron itself that AFK play is not against the EULA.

What they need to write in is a line in the rules that states;

Extended unattended play is not permissible in SW:G. If your character is found to be skill animating while unattended your account can be suspended or revoked.

---

and define "extended" explicitly. the more clear/concise the rule the easier to enforce.

They've already stated that the line in the EULA about unattended macros applies ONLY to 3rd party macros. Macros created using the in-game system are perfectly legal and accepted. They've also stated that at this time they have no intention to change the EULA regarding unattendedness. I hope they do change it when they remove recursive macros to make AFK'ing of any form (over and extended period of time) an offense, though they may not technically need to change it since the game should no longer support it with the built-in mechanics, and they could simply enforce that line more strictly as the only way to have unattended macros would be through 3rd party software.

As far as the original idea, it's certainly been one that's been discussed before. I like the idea of removing the ability for people to turn the auto-AFK tag off. Unfortunately I don't think there's any way to rely on keystrokes or mouse activity to mark a player as active. I'm pretty sure that both of these can be simulated with 3rd party software. The one thing they might be able to detect is loops - if the input from a user keeps repeating with a contant frequency. They could maybe also detect things like someone being in the same place for too long. Whatever they do, they are still supposed to be removing the AFK ability somehow. That was their last official word on it, and I'm holding them to it.