Creature Handler Archive

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Freth wrote:

How many more people are going to come here and bash Dodece? He was only trying to help. If you can't post something constructive then don't post at all. If you don't want to use the info in this thread then don't. But don't reduce constructive threads to hate spewing matches and finger pointing. We're all here to help each other and to make CH better. Maybe you think it's a waste of time but the rest of us don't. I'd rather hear about a possible better BE pet from Dodece than pointless bickering and flame-bating.

Back to the topic please.

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you don't help by telling people they are not allowed to express their opinions simply because he doesn't like them Freth. I have changed my mind, you would have made a good Corr, you suck up to Devs pretty well after all.

Standard Dev and Corr line: respect only those opinions that suit our own personal views and gag the rest.

So is there any BE's on Intrepid making new pets with pre CU DNA?

Um... the parttime crafters are the ones leaving? I think you got it backwards. Every dedicated, gung-ho, "I'm a crafter and that's all I ever wanted to be" mega-conglomerate uber crafter I know is leaving in disgust.

I now spend hours searching for a weaponsmith vendor that actually has weapons on it. Whereas before I used to know right where to go to find my server's premiere weapons. Armor is becoming the same, as is food, ships and components, etc. My server used to have the Weaponsmith and the Armorsmith correspondent as representatives. They've both resigned (or been fired for standing up to the devs) due to the CU and are quitting the game.

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tacwraith wrote:

Erm, you're wrong in the viciousness.

Im MBE and i had 3 houses full of pre CU dna.

What jumps creature level to ungodly levels is the magical 500 mark to get light armor.

i made a pet with 100 damage max and light armor and it was level 200.

made another with barely 2k ham bars and 500+ viciousness (viciousness affects damage and to-hit and speed rating) and it came out level 38.

light armor= no no.

the 20k ham creatures you are getting are probably ar0 done with dna from high health-stat experimentation stat dna... which is cool but its not really a pet you'd want. 20k ham and the pet doingcrappy damage is no better than a 10k ham critter doing 400 damage a hit. yes yes u can use pets as meatshields while you shoot but really... is that why you taking ch? i thought you were supposed to fight with your creatures.

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Meuw wrote:

you don't help by telling people they are not allowed to express their opinions simply because he doesn't like them Freth. I have changed my mind, you would have made a good Corr, you suck up to Devs pretty well after all.

Standard Dev and Corr line: respect only those opinions that suit our own personal views and gag the rest.

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Message Edited by Freth on 05-12-2005 01:32 AM

lookmany of us couldnt care less about dodece's little "secret". who gives a crap about pre-cu pet dna when i can call my 2 plains hunters and have a blast without wasting my time for a bio to make something just as good. i have bio pets but only a few cause its taming that i like. the wild petsstill get the job done. dodece is getting flamed because this wasnt a "secret" at all and by no means would it make everyone a CH. i personally like the cu. im not a pvp so maybe thats why but im having a great time with my pets. now lets all drop the frelling subject so we can all get on to helping each other with real problems and leave all this behind us

Message Edited by CritterControl on 05-11-2005 09:26 PM

Maybe your pets are magic Freth. Or bugged. Or you're just lucky.

Mine work "OK", but I would not say they work great and they most definitely do not work as well as they did pre-CU. Before the CU I could pull out a level 28 pet and team with it to take out red cons. This was my middle-level pet, and it could tank things that were red to me.

Now, I have to take out my TOP level pet (66 Kwi) or thereabouts, and go after ONE white con at a time. I have to do a "pet pull" and hope to get just one. If TWO white cons go after the pet, I might win the fight, but I won't put them both down before the pet is pushing up daisies.

Now, note I am NOT saying that this makes CH "unviable", but my level 28 pet has gone from being able to tank red mobs to being owned by whites. Even single-pulling I cannot let the pet fight one-on-one. I have to get in there and help him and help him FAST, because he will drop way before the "white" con does. I have gone from being able to attack, say, a 3-yellow lair, having this same (level 28) pet hold off two of them while I took the third, to having to single-pull white and blue cons and rush to the pet's help immediately or he's eating dirt.

Now maybe that is "the way it should have been" and maybe a level 28 pet shouldn't have tanked yellows... but the fact is before the CU he could, and after the CU this same exact pet cannot do this. So don't tell me that "pets are better than ever in PVE." They are not better... they are significantly weaker. In the long run maybe this is a good thing for the game, but that's not what you said. You didn't say, "OK pets get owned by whites but they always should have." You said, "Pets work better in PVE now than ever before," and that is just not true. At least, none of my pets do.

C

Message Edited by Freth on 05-12-2005 01:12 AM

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Freth wrote:

Pets do more consistent damage now than they ever did. Pets used to be meat shields/tanks. I used to hold off a group of rancors with my pets because I couldn't handle them myself with my Master Pistoleer. That was just wrong... that a couple level 35 narglatches could hold off a group of rancors. By better I mean they are finally balanced to the game. The CU is way more balanced. Now pets will do consistent damage against a target, but they won't be able to take out a whole lair or multiple mobs with ease. This is because (like a previous post said) pets are our weapons. They aren't meant to be the total damage dealer or tanker of the CH. They are support.

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They were support before. But you've basically admitted here that "better" is in the eye of the beholder. Pets do what YOU want them to do now, so you think they are better. But they don't do what they used to do for me, and what I would like them to continue to do (tank for me) and thus I think they are worse. Actually this is simplistic; it's not just about tanking. I used to be able to use different pets for different purposes.

Pre-CU:
Grumpy the level 46 (wild) rancor did nice damage, and was good vs. humans. Not as good vs. critters as some other pets.

Porky the level 25 (wild) boar wolf had 50% kinetic defense and was thus good vs. critters, depending on their level. He was great for getting CH XP because I didn't need to use a higher level pet.

Herp the level 25 (BE) dune lizard had decent all-around defenses (basically 25% to everything, give or take, except lightsaber and stun), and he also had a nice spit attack and a posture change special that were very useful for NPCs. NPCs would run away from other pets, forcing me (TK as my 2nd prof) to have to incessantly chase them. But Herp could either force them to kneel, which held them in place, or he could spit at them and make them get into a shootout with him, which enabled me to get up and TK them.

Loki the level 64 (BE) gurrcat. Massive kinetic defense, very very good vs. critters, sucky vs. NPCs (bad energy/blast defense), nice specials (poison, stun) that also worked well vs. critters. However, he was so high level that I hardly got CH XP from using him (not that it usually mattered at master, but whatever). I used to pull him for really tough creature fights, e.g. vs. a Kimo.

Maxx the level 64 (BE) gurreck. Massive energy/blast/heat/etc defense but weak on kinetic. Great vs. NPCs, crappy vs. critters. He was especially good vs. NPCs because he had dizzy and KD as his specials... between me, the TK, and him, the stormtroopers were often on their butts in a fight.

Tiny the level 52 (BE) Kimo. Very nice defenses all-around. Not as good as Maxx or Loki in any one area, but good overall defenses, and some nice specials. A good general high-level tank for when I am going to fight various opponents.

There were of course others but these were the ones I mainly used. I also had some weaker cats who were toned down versions of Maxx and Loki (named Slash and Fang), similar in that one was good vs critters and the other vs. NPCs, level 28 and 30 respectively... better for weaker fights.

My point here is... I had a LOT of options as a master CH -- which is as it should be; I'm a master. Each pet was different and had different abilities. Some had ranged attacks, some had other specials, etc. Now let's look at post-CU:

All pets under level 40 are useless. They die in under 20 seconds when I send them in. What good is a "weapon" (as you claim) if you are forced to put it away after 3 hits? Which is basically what happens with them. (Note that I am level 80 so I am usuall facing level 79-82 opponents). So the lower level pets are out. Of course all the BEs are either ones I am afraid to pull due to the conversion bugs, or I have converted only to find them much worse than a wild tame. Let's look at the wild tames though... I have four:

Post-CU

Porky, who has now been converted to level 65. As far as I can tell he has about 38% resistance to everything, along with about 6k ham (used to be 50% to kinetic/9k).

Stomper the level 65 Brackasett. As far as I can tell, he is identical to Porky in every way (same HAM, same resistance, same damage done in battle).

Rex the level 66 Kwi. As far as I can tell, he is identical to Porky in every way with one exception: he still has a ranged spit. However, he refuses to use it when I command him to, so he may as well not have it (I know he has it because sometimes he randomly uses it, but that's worthless as a tactical weapon).

Nag the level 63 Crystal Snake. As far as I can tell he is about the same as Rex (ranged spit, random, about the same HAM and resistance).

(Oh and by the way the rancor is now level 79 and uncallable).

What is the difference here? Well other than levels changing for individual pets (the brack was 30ish and is now 65), what has happened is all my pets are identically the same and totally lack individuality. If my pets are to be my weapons like a pistoleer's guns, then I need to be able to choose the right weapon for the job, just like a good pistoleer or BH would be able to. But I can't anymore, because as far as I can tell (and two other CHs in my guild have confirmed my observations) all my pets are now identical for a given level range. With the exception of the occasional use of a ranged spit in some pets and not others, there is no reason to pull anything but the level 65 brack (who serves additionally as a mount). I gain nothing from changing pets. In short, the strategic decisions are out of the game. When I came up to a lair before I'd say, "Ok what am I facing and what do I need?" Or if a guildie called for help I could ask, "Who are you facing?" and figure out what I need... Is he facing energy-blasting stormtroopers? Or kinetic-using rancors? Or perhaps force-wielding nightsisters? Do I want a pet that KDs, or bleeds/poisons, or dizzies? Who are my team mates and which pets are going to cover our weaknesses and augment our strengths better? THESE are the questions I used to ask. I don't need to ask them anymore because the only one to ask seems to be "What pet is highest level? Pull it." There is no point to pulling anything but the Kwi (for a teeny tiny bit more damage and a random ranged attack) or the brack (as a mount in addition to the damage). Anything else is just going to be either the same, or if it is lower level, a total waste of time to pull.

It's not that pets are worse because they can't tank a Krayt. They never should've been able to do that in the first place (and weren't). It's that all the variety, nuance, and thought that went into being a CH is out the window. I used to spend hours hunting for the right pet (BEed, wild, either way) -- for instance, I'd say, "My pets just got flattened by energy, I need something with energy resists." Then I would go into the field or hit the BE vendors and look for a pet with that -- perhaps he was weak to other things but he would do me for energy resist when I needed it. I can't do that anymore because even if I could see the resistances (which you can't anymore on wild animals), they'd all be basically level-based anyway... so now it's just "Go look for a level 50+ pet, and ignore everything else." Gone are the days when the RIGHT level 20 pet could do you in the right situation, just as well as a level 50 uber-pet... not because the 20 was totally overpowered, but because you made the right choice about what defenses to put up against your opponent's attacks, and having chosen well, your pet was able to fight above his level -- again, not because he was uber, but because I knew what I was doing and used my brain. There was an art, as well as a science, to CH, and that is totally out the window. It's 100% brute force now, all based on level and nothing more.

And THAT is why I say pets are worse - because they are boring and characterless now, and you don't ever need any more than that one level 65 brack (serves as mount, and is about as powerful as you can tame) as a CH now, because anything else is either weaker or the same, and thus extranneous. They have turned CHs into one-trick banthas... and that is depressing given that we are supposed to be the prof of "versatility" according to the devs.

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Freth wrote:
Yes, there were aspects of the old pet system that made it fun, but being able to hide behind pets wasn't all it was cut out to be. They shouldn't be god-like and in a sense they were bigger than life. Better, to me, is balance... and having to make strategies and use my character's combat profession plus my pets and figure out ways to come out on top. Bigger isn't always better.

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I did not hide behind my pets. I play a TKA/CH. I am up there in the thick of it with them. They didn't tank while I sat hiding behind a rock doing conceal-shot. They went after ONE rancor, for instance, while I took out the other. They usually couldn't kill it but they could keep it busy while I was working on the other one. And for the record I hardly ever hunted with doc buffs. I used food buffs, if anything, and my armor was UN-sliced, as were my VKs. I did not try to make my critters or my prof into an auto-win button... but I liked the challenge of picking the beastie to the circumstance, and that's gone now. And I liked the fact that if I chose my pet wisely, yes, I was darn near invulnerable to anything my missions could throw at me. To me, that's a justifiable reward for playing smart, and picking my battles. I'm not talking about owning a Krayt solo here... just about fighting a lair of white cons without having to do a single pull even with pets, because my pets die in two shakes of a ronto's tail if I don't do that.

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Freth wrote:
As for Dodece's 'secret', Some people think it was a waste of time or stupid to keep it a secret. Others refuse to use BE. Yet others try to make it into something it's not---an exploit, Dodece tugging at CH heart strings, etc.

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It is most definitely an exploit. Clearly those DNA samples should have been converted and the Devs messed up and didn't convert them. Clearly it was not their intention to let players retain old-school pets in the post-CU world, or else they would've just let us keep our old BE pets instead of auto-converting them whenever we tried to call them after the CU. Maybe they will let you get away with it for a while, but eventually they're going to shut this down and all the pets made this way are going to be converted. You can count on it.

C

I recall, first off /bash Dodece

second... I didn't really quit the game techniclly.. I still play only to see my pets, run around and talk to people. I don't PLAY the game anymore for like I said 8726538765 times, the game blows out the poopshoot.

I find it funny how some of you try to be all wise person like.. for instance always looking to the other side of things. I think any of you who doesnt agree the game isn't worth playing anymore or says "lets give it another chance" or "well on the good side" there is no good to this, they took a great game didn't fix it for a year.. then change the entire game to something I can go to the store, buy, and play for free (guild wars, fun game, def. get it) I am very disapointed in the way the game has been handled, doesnt matter whos fault it was. If you say that you shouldn't complain if you didn't do anything... ummmm well if you paying for it you have every right to complain... at a time like this as the game is broken bugged and pretty much retarded, it isn't worth 15 $ a month.

S In a way Yes I left the game, but since I don't want to just drop my trophies I worked so hard for the past 1.5 years, I am still gunna play to see if it changes at all... doesnt mean I still have to play alot.. seeing my GPS out by my side is worth putting up 15$ a month... but for the game no.

so rant rant rant.... bash bash bash.... thats all we can do and no one can tell you that you can't.

if anyone has any wise words to say like stop taking it out on dodece or I see your point dodece or your all childish.. grow up.... you are just a BSer. Yeah its cool he found that out but he didn't need to keep something that wasn't even a secret, a secret in the first place and say that it will revive CH and that only worthy people can know... that was just plain idiot... I have nuthing against no one I am just saying you guys are physco... just end it already - game sucks - CH dead - move along

dear god.....