Creature Handler Archive
Thread: It is worse than I feared
MechaWashu
Sat Apr 09, 2005 11:48 am
#27
jopenack wrote:
a grouped jedi knight runningaround alone doing his own thing will appear as though he has no help and he really will be godlike
2 things
a) As of now we have the little I'm in a group icon next to our names when grouped (not sure if this is true in CU beacuse mine got turned off and i don't know how to turn it back on)
2)The Jedi's level in relation to you will be aparant do to the fact that players now have the colored"level dots" next to their name. So if he's grouped with 8 other Jedi, you'll know it by thepurple dot next to his name.
jopenack wrote:
hmm just read the TC noted from Tiggs, looks like in a week or so no more beta testing for people who haven't pre=ordered the new expansion.
No where does it say that.
What it does say is that soon ROTW testing will be being conducted at the same time as CU testing on the same test server.
Says nothing about having to be testing ROTW to test the CU, or that eligibility is based on pre-ordering.
I realy wish people would stop assuming the worst, then running around yelling "the sky is falling" to everyone they can.
The best way to know whats going on is to read and test for yourself, not listen to others (including me) who claim to know all the anwsers.
MechaWashu
Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:23 pm
#28
I try to keep optimistic about the CU. And I still think when it's finished, the good will out weigh the bad.
How ever, the whole level syetm is the one aspect I feel the least sure about.
Like you said there will be no end of people trying to use it to their advantage.
I know that now damage is scaled down in PVP from what it is in PVE, maybe they will apply the same sort of thing to levels in the CU...
I don't realy mind the level system, but I would definatly prefer it be less constraining. It realy feels now like there is a very narrow scope of whatI can and can't do. More room to breath would be nice.
I definetly have trouble looking at thing prom a PVPers perspective, since i havn't PVPed in months. I decided a while ago that PVP as it is now is not for me.
Going off in the wilderness by myself with my pets and myrilfe is more my speed.
jopenack
Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:00 am
#29
did I say the sky was falling
wish people would stop running around putting words in my mouth
if you followed the discussion between myself and Joker you would see Itake into account I may be wrongbut you dont want to read and more do ya, just take what ya need to make the same staements I did
Uneducated and assume
Hypocrasy
yea good word in this case
MechaWashu
Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:18 am
#30
jopenack wrote:
did I say the sky was falling
wish people would stop running around putting words in my mouth
Look I'm not trying to start a flame war.
I'm sory if you thought the "sky is falling" comment was directed solely at you. I've been reading alot of forum posts today and have read alot of wild assumptions on the CU that have no basis.
All I'm saying is that alot of people are posting assumptions and feelings they have about the CU as fact.
It makes it very difficult to find out what is actually going on.
The 2 statements that you made were untrue and possablyinflamitory, i posted so people would not get the wrong idea.
The truth about the CU is we will not know what is fact until testing is finished, or aleast nearing an end.
All we can do now is test and give feedback.
Message Edited by MechaWashu on 04-09-2005 03:19 PM
jopenack
Sun Apr 10, 2005 12:48 am
#31
No hard feelings man, I had big hopes for the curb and have defended it ingame and out with afew firends, truthfully everyday I lose more faith in it.
Consider this to my Solo Group comment
You PVP the night before with friends, all elites an all aroundgood players, next day you login and your still overt, you see a single guy comin at you firing, the groupicon willmeanlittle since your fist reaction will be fire back. you then see it and since you thought he was solo the only option now is run. but in seconds your on the ground and the ole db is cooming since he has a cl level that nuked you in under a minute. A minute seems like a long time but when in combat a mintue = a second
Also for the sake of discussion
If PVP is your thing and you are planning a night of fun, will your group take in noobs? they will lower your all around cl. one noob maybe but two highly unlikely unless they are friends.
In general even in PVE this will apply not many elite groups will want noobs since they will bring everyone down in cl, in the case of PVE it will be what they are planning on hunting and how dangerous it is decide how many lower lv lpeople to take in.
It goes on today with places like the corvette, only elites are really asked to join. now the corvette is the most extreme dungeon we have, If things dont change before the curb goes live, much of the content in this game will be comparable to the corvette depending on your level and what you have planned. hmm that last sentence might be misunderstood. what I am trying to say is people will want to shoot for the higher lvl mobs on whatever planet they are on.
This is some of what I foresee unless they change it before hand, and they seem to be pushing foreward no matter what. TC has been down for almost 2 days now, thats another 2 days less for testing and bug fixing.
imo its not getting any better since I loaded TC.only time shall tell if my fears come true, and if they do won't it be a little too late lol
I believed them when they said they wanted to take the time to do it right, that turned out to be a false statement.
Nell2ThaIzzay
Sun Apr 10, 2005 2:02 am
#32
^ I dunno that anyone is arguing against the new neccesity for groups. I know I for one like it.
As it is now, sure, I could go get some buffs, head out to either Dantooine or Yavin, and kill off pikets, klikniks, or anglers, whatever suits me. But I do have a lot more fun when I'm doing it with my friends. I know I for one am not against grouping.
I think what most people's concern is (as is mine), is that grouping together isn't going to increase the group's chance of success solely through their strength in numbers, but just by grouping, each individual player is going to become stronger. Just look at what Joker posted earlier (in this thread, or another) about how when he grouped up with his pet, -HE- went from like a 12 rating to an 18, or whatever it was. The concern is, individual people shouldn't become stronger just because they are grouped, and they think it will cause solo grouping because, by being in a group, you are individually stronger, and can go out and still solo PvE stuff, or in PvP can become a 1 man gan squad, because you are inherently a stronger individual, because you grouped. The purpose of grouping should be to raise your strength through numbers, not to make yourself more effective individually in combat.
At least that's my interpretation of the grouping thing. And I'm not liking it.
Combat_Medic_to_be
Sun Apr 10, 2005 4:44 am
#34
Nell2ThaIzzay wrote:
I think what most people's concern is (as is mine), is that grouping together isn't going to increase the group's chance of success solely through their strength in numbers, but just by grouping, each individual player is going to become stronger. Just look at what Joker posted earlier (in this thread, or another) about how when he grouped up with his pet, -HE- went from like a 12 rating to an 18, or whatever it was. The concern is, individual people shouldn't become stronger just because they are grouped, and they think it will cause solo grouping because, by being in a group, you are individually stronger, and can go out and still solo PvE stuff, or in PvP can become a 1 man gan squad, because you are inherently a stronger individual, because you grouped. The purpose of grouping should be to raise your strength through numbers, not to make yourself more effective individually in combat.
At least that's my interpretation of the grouping thing. And I'm not liking it.
This is my single biggest concern about the CU. If this grouping system is implemented I will most likely leave. Everything else I've heard about the CU I love, except for the crazy CL ranges on critters, and I think it could make the game an awful lot better. I just think the way the grouping is working will be horrible enough for me not to want to play.
Grouping shouldn't change any individual's abilities, nor should it alter the amount of damage an enemy does to you, it should just allow you to get better missions from the terminals due to your strength in numbers and equally give you a better chance of surviving higher level combat but ONLY because of strength in numbers.
GadonThek
Sun Apr 10, 2005 5:12 am
#35
From the latest TC patchnotes:
Combat
* Fixed an issue with autoattacking a dead or incapacitated target has now been fixed
* A combat exploit using macros was fixed.
* Group level should now be equal to the level of the highest level player in the group
* Fixed an issue with cooldown groups sporadically not appearing in the toolbar
* Armor Accuracy & Rate of Fire Hinderance now show as a debuff
* Healing with no target will now heal the medic
* Scout XP from harvesting has been adjusted
* Baby creatures should now be balanced correctly based on their con
Combat
* Fixed an issue with autoattacking a dead or incapacitated target has now been fixed
* A combat exploit using macros was fixed.
* Group level should now be equal to the level of the highest level player in the group
* Fixed an issue with cooldown groups sporadically not appearing in the toolbar
* Armor Accuracy & Rate of Fire Hinderance now show as a debuff
* Healing with no target will now heal the medic
* Scout XP from harvesting has been adjusted
* Baby creatures should now be balanced correctly based on their con
Dodece
Sun Apr 10, 2005 6:00 am
#36
* Group level should now be equal to the level of the highest level player in the group
Great now I am boned. The codeing for MBH already maxes me out. Nothing I can do from dropping spice to pulling out my baddest pet ever results in a higher difficulty for me. This is actually bad news why will high level players even group with low level players period. It inparts absolutely no reward. Great I thought the devs would get the guts to do something this cool.
Asfor the solo grouping. I see no reason why it would happen. After all If you got jumped to level 50 and the game were balanced. 1 you could not take on any mission at that level, and 2 see no reason why they couldnt impart the same fix they did on the solo grouping credit gouge. Past a certain distance you should lose a group bonus and become weaker. That alone would incentive players to try and keep one another alive.
Combat_Medic_to_be
Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:40 am
#37
* Group level should now be equal to the level of the highest level player in the group
So now grouping is completely borked. Why couldn't they have just left grouping how it was? The only problem with it pre CU is that there is no reason to group due to armour and buffs. So long as they sort out the level of players to consider armour and buffs things would have been fine.
jopenack
Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:40 am
#38
Dodoce
you are misreading it slightly, solo groups will take on a whole new meaning, people will group for the higher lvl defenses then run out on they're own. they wont be doing it so much for missions as for defense and offense stacking, the uber wannabees will look for any way to increase they're power.
Although the new cap will help, maxing out at the highest players lvl, although it still makes it so people will want an uber elite, noobs are going to have a problem I believe.
A firend plays wow i think it was wowlol. I forget, anyways he said groups were needed to do anything, and different roles dictated who was needed, he was a form of mage or something of the type. he was sought after and then dumped after his role was fulfilled in the groups. he left the game because he basically could not play the character he wanted because group mentality and individual goals werenot mixing very well.
Again this cap is good news to a point, But too much emphasis is being placed on groups. I remember what it was like to group with people, and more times than not it was a nightmare. I started becoming very selective about who I grouped with in 03. will the be the case again I dont know, but I am worried.
weapons, buffs,and armor used to be the focus. this will shift to groups. I personally believe individual skills should be just that, group bonuses should be for harvesting and xp not defense and offense bonuses.
Played on TC today went solo, not many people were on at moenia. The last update they did yesterday has helped my downward opinion of the gameimprove. it seems they are listeninhg to people.
The biggest concern right now for me is the hate system and our pets, using macros to retain agro on pets isn't a fix lol if it will even work. Rifleman are tanking half the time and as the couple of ch playing have said pets cant hold agro long. This in itself defeats the jack of all trade roles we are supposed to be able to perform. How can our pets assume tank role if the hate system dictates who is agroe'd. this needs work.
Time shall tell if this all works out, but I predict much tweaking in the group area'sin the next 6 months. Groups should be fun and everyone should be welcome in one, not sure if thats how it will play out. This will be in itself the biggest imbalance of the game when everything calms down. imo
oh and I agree after a certain distance any bonus should be null, also groups now cap at 8 people that also shall make picking certain professions in groups a must. Gotta feel bad for anyone who's looking for a group but is told sorry we have 3 already. I remember sitting at c-net for an hour while the group leader waited for another type of profession. Many times I left the group and logged off because I ran out of time. Not everyone can play for hours at a time.
Message Edited by jopenack on 04-10-2005 10:49 AM
...good job Devs!