Creature Handler Archive
Thread: Corral Plan V.3
I want to cover the agreeing to disagree. I think see where you are coming from. If a CH lets another CH place a pet, then cannot remove it because they do not have the levels. It makes sense that it's the CH's fault. This is a MMORPG and trusting everyone should be painful at times. Or like I say "stupid should hurt".
I am not saying a merchant could not place things in a CH home. He very well could. I see the problem with what you are saying. Being in the Pen and on the Vendor at the same time would not be possible. We are asking for an ability to redeed creatures. Creatures would be taken from the pen via the menu. Redeeded. Then placed on any vendor. So at this point, your trusted merchant would always have to have time to do things when you want them done. So the idea is to breed. Train as PSP. Then deed. Then straight to vendor.
Pluto9Moon wrote:
Lucha,
I will try to answer as how I see things. First, let me preface that anything I say is not in defense of this writing or any other writing thus far. Anything I have written to date is the thoughts of other people. Ocassionally here or there is an original idea but if one follows all four threads you can clearly see other CH had the ideas and I merely glued them together.
1) I would like to see the art work stay as one solid piece all the way through. That is to say if you only have a manger you still see all the pens but only 1 is usuable. Or the pet levels stay at minimum but you use all the pens. This means of the 3 real pens you could stable 2 adults of CL10 in 2 different pens and raise the consequent babies in the third and last pen.
I have to strongly agree with this. If the concept for the corral art was to have it change with the abilities of the corral, that could cause some real problems. Best to avoid that and just have one art that doesn't change, but the utility of what is there not be available without the proper skills.
2) Lot Size. In V1 and V2 we started off at 1 and increased to 4. It was an abritrary number and a great starting point. Footprints do seem to suggest that this be made larger to come in line with Guild hall sizes. Let me say that by asking with 24 pets total in the highest level and also not asking for much internal storage inside the house structure itself that I believe it is reasonable to ask that 4 lots be the highest limit. Footprint is the only thing being major here. The database space itself is not. This puts the CH in the position to decide whether he needs more internal space or the fun challenge of the Corral itself. 4 lots is large enough to prevent a guild hall.
4 seems ok enough to me, but we'd have to see what a dev thinks (/cough /hint dev please post /uncough). If it's 4 lots, that's still 250 items with the current math (1 lot=75 items, max 250/structure). And I don't think the footprint will actually matter that much. I think the lot requirement is an arbitrary number they just made up to limit the number of player structures in the universe. Heavy harvesters are huge when compared with personal ones, and both take up one lot. 4 lots will allow a CH to have a large and a corral, or 2 corrals and a med house. Sounds good
3) Admin list and creature placement. First, there is a problem here. I do not code and not sure I have the work around. The rules by which we have set so far allows 4 adults (6 total pets counting babies) or CL60. If an MCH had admin rights but was not the structure owner, what would happen to this pet? Certainly it is unusable by most people who would be restricted to the manger level. So why would a low level CH want the MCH to place pets there? The one answer I do have is restrict it to owner only.
I think we are going to have to agree to dissagree here.
To answer any follow ups, if this is not a CH only structure then you have to allow any CH who as admin rights to place pets so it becomes the aesthetic type zoo that some want. If none of that made sense, what I meant to say was that if this remains CH only then only the CH owner could place pets. Much like only the owner can redeed a structure. If it is open to all players then any CH with admin rights could place pets.
Possible exploit would be CH who place high level pets for low level people and then not remove them when requested or just possibly it is hard to find a MCH to remove a hgih level pet after you have had one placed.
I like the idea of the corral being a structure. But I don't want to have to limit the CH's lots to using it. There are plenty of merchants that have vendors in other people's structures, why not CHs? I think instead of limiting the pens by limiting the ownership of the structure, the number of pens should be limited by the CH skill tree. If the structure were basically like any other house, the pens would have to be activated by a CH. If a CH activates a pen, that CH is the ONLY one able to manage that pen. This would be similar to vendors for a merchant. The two things I would hope for this would be: 1) the pen would be a big data pad, just like the one in my pocket 2) I could choose ONE of the creatures in the pen's datapad to be displayed (not all of them!)
Could this cause problems with the lot owner of a corral vs the pen owners? Yes, but its the same problem a vendor has in a Shopping Mall. If the business arangement between the players falls apart for some reason, then so be it. mmorpg=you have to deal with other people
4) Vendor. The only reason the Vendor idea would not work out is if someone was unwilling to use their skill points. Pretty certain that the first vendor is in the artisan tree. As long as we can place items in the internal structure I would not see why this shouldn't work.
Currently items on a vendor are just that, on the vendor. I have no problem with putting a regular vendor inside the corral, but how would you put pets into a pen and on a vendor at the same time? Or is the pen the vendor? How many vendors would you need for a corral? One or one per pen? If the CH hasan elite combat profession, there aren't many skill points left over for vendors....
5) I have yet to go to the Warren to get pics. The bottom level there is a LARGE zoo-liek facility. Using only this room and a ramp down would mean less original artwork need to be created. They would only have to make a mod of the existing place. The major concern of those who have mentioned underground zoos even prior to these posts were would below ground footprints have any effect on above ground footprints. Could one place an underground zoo under ones house? Could miners be placed over? Well you get the picture.
Oh yeah! I had forgotten that the underground concept was The Warren. That place is HUGE! You could get your kimo into a pen down there easy enough lol. I was thinking of just using a space like the rooms in the basements of guild halls, but the warren space would be amazing. I wouldn't think that the size of the basement would conflict with nearby buildings. Like you say in a sec, the building is sealed and everything outside of it shouldn't matter. But then again, who knows.
Other items of interest have been the pen structures on Dantooine. In a perfect world this would make a great 1 lot version of the manger concept. 4-6 animals. The biggest problem would be the sheer number of these that CH might use. I can foresee large communes of these structure becoming the CH version of player cities with only one lot. 2 lots would make them less extreme over all.
I agree
ifWHEN this goes live, every CH is going to want as many of them as they can use. That's one of the reasons why I'd like the see the skill tree limit the pens, not the lots usable by CHs. Smaller, one lot pens would be welcome in my eyes if they were in addition to the corral. Perhaps with the restriction that they can only be placed adjacent to a corral or another pen.
Is the concept for a generic corral or planet specific corrals? There are quite a few little corral like things on many different planets, and graphical ideas can be stolen from them to make programing easier.
6)I am not sure what reason out door loot dropping is not permissible on the overlooks of Tatooine style houses. It has probably been answered somewhere before. I would comfortably assume it has to do with the lack of a wall type coding and certain things not being allowed to be dropped outside.
The little I do understand of MOD coding tells me instinctually that houses are sealed and the veranda is not sealed in to allow dropping. This could easily be fixed by placing a transparent wall on the veranda. SOE has placed it pretty low on their priority level. All the devs would need to do is place a transparent dome over the "ceiling" and made some door in the spirit of guild halls and cantinas also having open doors. It is all about making sure the House Mod does not leak. It is simple in theory, I am not sure how time consuming.
BTW. spreadsheet I do love your additions. Maybe I will get a rework in sometime soon. Is it time for V4?
I agree! Nice thoughts spreadsheet. v3.page6 might need to be upgraded to v4.0
What I'm thinking is that once you have a pet in a corral( BE or Wild ) you can use the corral to train them to be of more use to a dancer, or a doctor, or a ranger. I think that the corral idea as it is laied hints at this type of action already.
As far as what commands or how they would be more useful to said proffs; well there are tons of threads on that.
On a personal note, I think that making the corral more like the plant reward from the FS quest would be fun. Meaning that you could buy dye packs from BE's and add them in the corral to make a pet's baby breed a new color, or you would want to have a doctor make you a certin stim, when fed to te pet during breeding it allows them to have a restiance bonus of some sort. I personaly would like to have a reason to search out crafters and buy or trade for a product that I can then use to enhance my pet's babys. With that said, anything that you can use from another proff would only enhace the outcome of the baby NOT make the babys useles forcing you to get said items. It would 98% be a cool factor but have very little - no heavy outcome on the pet.
Lastly, what about a multi leg cycle for some rare pets. Pets that have been taken out of game because they are too stong. This process would allow you to have a CL 55 or 60 version. The way it would work is, you breed creature type -A- with good resources, a BE samples DNA, gives it to a Cheff who makes a food, you feed it to creature type -B- as it's breeding, it makes a baby creature type -C-, Creature C is feed a xx spice that you got from a smuggler, creature C then has xx% of laying a "strange egg", get the right type of DNA samples from a BE and inject them into the egg, you have a xx% chance of the egg hatching a Giant Peko Peko baby. This would be in addition to any limited or rare drop schem that BE's can use/find/get/ to make other rare pets.
Bottom Line, the idea for a corral is great and growing. It's not enoufh though for it to enhance the CH game, it should enhance all proffs some how. That is to say give other proffs something that they can sell or craft that we need as well as give us something that other players want/need to seek us out for.
The basic framework of the corral as outlined previously is just that, a framework. There have been so many interesting and inovative ideas that have been expressed here that can be added to the corral. And that is my hope. If we can get some devs to go with this idea, then we can show how it can be easily be adapted to be useful and FUN for as many proffessions as possible. (I do NOT want to see things like the armor padding for wookiee armor: armor padding is the only item tailors can experiment on and it isn't even for a tailor item, it's just something you make for an armorsmith) I'd like to see as wide a variety of things as possible become part of the modular upgrade system for the corral. This really is a new and exciting idea.
Like SioBabble says, CHs are not jedi. Maybe therefore we will get no love. But maybe, just maybe... we will come up with a few things to add to the corral just for those glowstick swinging freaks
The more new game code that is needed the more Dev resources it takes, the longer of a timeline it gets put on. I do think that at some point all profs will get the polish treatment from the Devs. The questions I think that reamin to the Devs are
1. Will you consider putting this in game on any timeline?
meaning simply does this idea fit into your orginal vision for how you want CH to effect the game, and will this idea get put on a no ETA to do list?
2. If this is not how you want CH to interact with and effect the game community then what concepts should we be talking about now that are in line with what the role of CH are?
3. If this is an idea that you would consider putting in game at some point, what are the deatails or concept points that you feel we should make more clear, or what problems as Devs do you see that would make this too difficult or undoable?
4. Is there a period of time, even in theory, that Devs planed on spending time and resources on improvments and poslihes to the CH proffesion. If so what, in thoery, where those polishes going to be?
I think if we could recive that kind of focused feedback from the Devs we could be more effective in our posting. On a side note it would be intresting to get a vote from CH about what they would most like to see the Devs work on for the CH aspect of SWG, such as
1. Our top 5 issues
2. Corral
3. Mounted Combat
4. Flying Mounts
5. Other non CH issues that effect SWG game play.
It's not to say that people don't want to see these things come to the game, rather what are they as Ch most egaer for, if 98% of the CH community wants to see or recive feedback from Devs on Corrals, then Vert has good cause to take a list of lets say 5 questions regarding our most popular request to the Devs for attention. Even if they don't answer all the questions Devs seem to like focused and direct communication.
Just a thoguht.
Message Edited by spreadsheet on 12-21-2004 01:59 PM