Creature Handler Archive
Thread: A new direction for CH balance
- Try not to make the solution too outlandish. The less programming required, the better chance you have to get the idea implimented.
- Try to consider balance. We dont wan to be godly, we just want to be even with other classes.
- Try to be inventive. Skills which require timing add a great deal to gameplay. If you can make the ability good in some situations but not in others, it allows players opportunity to be skillful, knowing when to use the ability and not shows others they're good players.
I offer the following possible options as possible low maintenance solutions to the CH imbalance;
- RabidSprint- a pet only combat sprint. Like the /gallop command, but for non mountable creatures. It would have a shorter time of effect (say 10 seconds or so), but the pets would sprint 2x as fast to catch targets (like hunting hounds!). The recycle time would be about1-2 minutes.
- Pack Attack- thisability requires the use of more then 1 pet. It acts likethe squad leaderability /volleyfire... but for your pets! I like thisidea because it gives your melee pets a damage advantage over ranged pets when stacked with enrage.This master CH level ability gives no bonus to the CH however or any other player character other then to point the group at the same target.
- Famished- CH ability to make a pet hungry again, effectively removing the current food buff from them so another can be applied. (Low level CH might find this handy for leveling).
- Ferral Roar- Your pet bellows its most deafening roar, causing an area effect similar to concussion where all targets become rooted and cannot attack... trying to cover their poor ears! The root and daze will only last about 5-10 seconds, allowing the CH to evacuate themselves and their petsas needed or simply manage aggro better. The pet must be over level 50 to acheive thenoise volumeneeded(intended for single high level pets). Of course the recycle time for this should be considerable... about 3-5 minutes, so timing for this attack is crucial!
Latent abilities;
- CH only ability toattack while riding a /galloping mount (they are, after all, the equestrians of the game).
- Allow CH to pull multiple mounts and offer rides to group mates on them.
A few other abilities that would be nice;
- Training templates- I would very much like for us to simply create a list of our pet commands and drag them from our datapad onto a pet for instant training of all available commands on the list. This would of course be a Master Level skill, and you do not gain XP for pets trained this way. Very handy ability for when you're in a rush!
- Pet redeeding- I think it would also be nice for pets under level 10 to be re-deeded with alltraining retained. Bigger pets require cages that are too large to be practical for the auctions. This wouldnttake business away from Bio Engineers... they can make superior pets at that and higher levels then a CH can tame from the wild. Therefore they will always have a market. Some intrepid CH might even buy from a BE, trainthe petsand resellthem for a profit!This would also not take away the in person trading of larger pets. Its just a way for CH to make consistantmoneyfrom their training abilities.
Again, the idea behind this post is to alter the concept thatbalancing CH requires altering every creature in the game. Instead, it may be possible for us to attain our balance with a few morespecial abilities instead. If you have some you'd like to see, by all means share it here!
Just remember to keep it reasonable.
ADDED SPECIAL IDEAS
Contributed by Larnyth 7-4-05
- Frenzy (proposed name)- An AOE taunt for your pets to draw aggro from PvE targets.
Contributed by Travin64068 7-4-05
- Fetch - With this command a pet will drag back the corpse of his kill to the Handler. This allows the Handler to harvest meat, hide or bone, without moving from a good combat possition. A variation would be to simply loot/harvest without the draging animation(potentially less code).
Contributed by K3nsh1n:
- Tackle- Assuming it is over CL 20, your pet will chase down and pounceupon your opponent. This skill workslike underhand shot and is acquired at tier 3 of CH.
- Pin- This attack, which is used after Tackle, will leave ur pet on top of the opponent making him unable to stand up for 10 seconds, however the CH cannot attack (this target)during this period or it is automatically broken do to the fact that you could not get a clear shot at your target with ur pet on top of him. This is only achieved at master CH. Also, your pet may not attack while pinning a target.
Message Edited by QuantumArtist on 07-15-200503:57 AM
Message Edited by QuantumArtist on 07-15-2005 03:58 AM
Message Edited by Geelo on 07-04-2005 04:33 PM
Message Edited by Geelo on 07-04-2005 04:56 PM
QuantumArtist, I loved all your ideas! Though I do feel that might still be too much for balance. Because as pointed out you can have CH & other profession master. Now if you increased the SP for CH then you could do those nice changes. That'd be wonderful!!
Though do think all pets need an increase in speed, maybe only a bonus in CH to pet's running speed. Because you should beable to gallop on a mount and have your other pets keep up. No reason they shouldn't beable to, especially if same species!
Biggie: It was great to shoot while on a mount, and in all reality that's the largest benefit to mounts it the ability to do other things. I mean look at Western! That's the whole point to riding wester, is so that you have atleast 1 hand free, and if you trained your horse well you can have 2 hands free!
Asking for both offensive and defensive powers is wrong. We had both before, that lead to publish 5.
Because CH can be used at the same time as other professions, it has to be restricted, either damage OR defence. Not both.
I do beleive the announcement of the new pet special system where we can customize pets to a job is the ideal way forward, high damage low defence, high defence low damage.
Anything that gives both at once is just a repeat of the original problem, anyone who was master CH back then, including myself, will not want a repeat performance.
Noggin-The-Nogg wrote:
I would suggest that a working taunt ability , and fixing the pet pathing(which I beleive may be responsible for the speed issue) and auto store problems would go along way to rejuvenating the profession.
Asking for both offensive and defensive powers is wrong. We had both before, that lead to publish 5.
Because CH can be used at the same time as other professions, it has to be restricted, either damage OR defence. Not both.
I do beleive the announcement of the new pet special system where we can customize pets to a job is the ideal way forward, high damage low defence, high defence low damage.
Anything that gives both at once is just a repeat of the original problem, anyone who was master CH back then, including myself, will not want a repeat performance.
Thats the whole point of giving CH abilities which are limited. That and it takes far less effort to alter the profession then it does every animal in the game.
Besides, if it turns out that all we get is a slightly customizable pet, with a few weak specials and current pet stats... we're still going to be underpowered. This is mostly due to the fact that the average level 70 pet simply cant compete with a level 80 player, particularly if they're Jedi.
I dont see anything wrong with the suggestions above. Obviously, we shouldnt have all these abilities, but some would sure allow for much easier "adjustments" of our profession in the future. Things change so much in SWG, I'd rather they just alter our special abilities then to go through another patch 7 catastrophy. If you remember patch 7, they altered creatures all over SWG... it castrated the entire game in the process.
The idea is that the creatures themselves are fine as they are (excluding speed and special attack issues). The key to perfecting our profession balancemay lie in altering/adding special commands/abilities.
QuantumArtist wrote:
Noggin-The-Nogg wrote:
I would suggest that a working taunt ability , and fixing the pet pathing(which I beleive may be responsible for the speed issue) and auto store problems would go along way to rejuvenating the profession.
Asking for both offensive and defensive powers is wrong. We had both before, that lead to publish 5.
Because CH can be used at the same time as other professions, it has to be restricted, either damage OR defence. Not both.
I do beleive the announcement of the new pet special system where we can customize pets to a job is the ideal way forward, high damage low defence, high defence low damage.
Anything that gives both at once is just a repeat of the original problem, anyone who was master CH back then, including myself, will not want a repeat performance.
Thats the whole point of giving CH abilities which are limited. That and it takes far less effort to alter the profession then it does every animal in the game.Besides, if it turns out that all we get is a slightly customizable pet, with a few weak specials and current pet stats... we're still going to be underpowered. This is mostly due to the fact that the average level 70 pet simply cant compete with a level 80 player, particularly if they're Jedi.
I dont see anything wrong with the suggestions above. Obviously, we shouldnt have all these abilities, but some would sure allow for much easier "adjustments" of our profession in the future. Things change so much in SWG, I'd rather they just alter our special abilities then to go through another patch 7 catastrophy. If you remember patch 7, they altered creatures all over SWG... it castrated the entire game in the process.
The idea is that the creatures themselves are fine as they are (excluding speed and special attack issues). The key to perfecting our profession balance may lie in altering/adding special commands/abilities.
It was publish 5 we got changed, as the poster you quoted said, just so you know .
They wont change creatures again regardless, that was what the CU was about, Im unsure where you got that idea from to be honest, the creatures we see now are , apart from minor tweaks, what we have.
The pet special system they describe can achieve pretty much everything we would need if done right, until we see the docs its difficult to judge.
However, you say
' This is mostly due to the fact that the average level 70 pet simply cant compete with a level 80 player, particularly if they're Jedi.'
This is the problem, CH is a level 54 skill, and therefore alone it simply shouldnt stand a chance against a level 80 player, especially a jedi as they are deemed 1.5 times more powerful than a level 80 player.
Do you see what you are asking for?
A level 54 profession (your level 70 pet) to be able to compete with a level 80 player.
Thats inbalance in the extreme.
Add in the rifle, carbine or pistol that is the CH's second profession and you are now destroying evryhing in your path, just like pre pub 5, and just like then , the nerfs would come.
The ONLY thing a stand alone CH can be balanced to is level 54, because, despite a pets level, that is what a CH is.
*bakes QA a BIG cake for being such a clever bunny* 
All I can say is, wow! You have some brilliant and well thought out ideas there QA and I just hope that the Devs have sat up and paid attention to them, and everyone elses on this thread.
Ko!! Any chance of getting these ideas passed to the gods??? Please??
Travin64068 wrote:
Let's not forget about the commands we already have:
Embolden - Gives pets a 15% boost to HAM for 5 minutes
Enrage - Like bezerk for pets lasts for 1 minute
New Command Ideas
Adv Guard - Pets take an aggresivestance for protecting theirMasters. Not waiting for an attack to come to them, they seekout and attack targets with in a 30M radius of the Handler. *Master Only*
Guard Other - The Handler can instruct pets to guard a target, such as a Player or NPC. The pet would follow and attack anything that attacks the target given.
Fetch - With this command a pet will drag back the corpse of his kill to the Handler. This allows the Handler to harvest meat, hide or bone, without moving from a good combat possition.
Pet Trance - The Handler calms the pet into a deep trance where the pets damage (not wounds) heals faster. During this time the pet and Handler both are not able to engage in combat, and the pet is in a stunned state for 30 seconds after.*Master Only*
- Ivoe
We already have a functioning guard command. I however, really like the fetch idea, though I think it would be better/easier to either have the pet simply loot the body. Who knows what it would take for them to alter the /drag command to include corpses being dragged by pets?
/cringe
Do we really want them diving into more code then absolutely needed? LOL
Also, pet trance. Doesnt pet trick commands accomplish this? What are the tricks good for now?
Message Edited by QuantumArtist on 07-05-2005 05:16 AM